Swearing passenger ruined first F
Nov 5, 2018, 1:15 am
#241
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2016
Programs: BA Silver, IHG Platinum Elite
Posts: 174
To a few other people’s posts. Feeling theatened is subjective to each individual in this world. Did I feel at risk of him having another outburst? Yes I did. Of course there are different levels of feeling theatened and what you feel in threat of. I did not tell the cabin crew member I feared he would do again. Maybe this would of resulted in a different outcome. But none of this changes how I felt on the flight.
Nov 5, 2018, 3:22 am
#242
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Nov 5, 2018, 3:39 am
#243
Moderator: British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Jan 2009
Programs: Battleaxe Alliance
Posts: 22,127
Maybe stowage issues on long haul? I don't think pooches and felines like being in the overhead locker and they might have nowhere to stow a beast-carrier in Affaires under the seat in front of them or by one's feet.
Nov 5, 2018, 5:21 am
#244
Join Date: Oct 2017
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Nov 5, 2018, 5:31 am
#245
Fontaine d'honneur du Flyertalk
Join Date: Jul 2001
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Actually - and this is only from AF and VY - you have to put them at your feet so that may well be the reason.
Nov 5, 2018, 8:00 am
#246
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: YYC
Programs: BA bronze, Aeroplan peon
Posts: 4,747
I can't find it now, but I remember reading about how on a US carrier the cabin crew insisted a dog in it's carrier go in the overhead. At the end of the flight the dog was dead, I believe it got too cold and froze.
Nov 5, 2018, 8:01 am
#247
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: LHR
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But I assume it’s the other way round. You pay premium to get, among other things, more quiet and privacy. Although there is no limitation and wealthy parents can book their kids in F should they wish to do so, the average J or F traveller assumes that she/he will be less likely to be bothered by families. If that happens, nothing will excuse rudeness, but I do think it perfectly normal for those individuals to feel uncomfortable.
when you fly economy, you are naturally more open to experience the full spectrum of potential travel related issues, including babies and loud families.
I really do not see the scandal here...
Nov 5, 2018, 8:52 am
#248
Moderator: British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Jan 2009
Programs: Battleaxe Alliance
Posts: 22,127
Now it's time to deploy the customary Royal Jordanian Falcon Policy link, including the falcon limits:
https://www.rj.com/en/info-and-tips/...ying-with-pets
Falcons in Cabin
Falcons may be carried in the cabin on limited occasions, especially in the Gulf area, provided the following is adhered to:
Falcons can be carried in Economy (Y/C) class only.
Falcons must be properly hooded.
Seats blocked for falcons and handlers must be window seats in the AFT areas of Y/C zone.
A chain or rope must be securely attached to the aircraft seat and the leg of each bird.
Valid health certificates and all other entry documents required by country of entry or transit must accompany the bird(s).
Falcons are accepted at the owner's risk
The reservation must be arranged at least 48 hours prior to the scheduled flight departure time and an approval is required from RJ's Systems & Procedures Section.
Important Notice
Charges
One falcon is charged three times the normal excess baggage rate. More than one falcon per handler will require the booking of an adjacent seat.
Maximum: two falcons per seat.
Max number of falcons per aircraft type
Narrow bodied aircraft: 10 FALCONS
Wide bodied aircraft: 15 FALCONS
Rodents are prohibited carriage on all RJ flights.
Falcons may be carried in the cabin on limited occasions, especially in the Gulf area, provided the following is adhered to:
Falcons can be carried in Economy (Y/C) class only.
Falcons must be properly hooded.
Seats blocked for falcons and handlers must be window seats in the AFT areas of Y/C zone.
A chain or rope must be securely attached to the aircraft seat and the leg of each bird.
Valid health certificates and all other entry documents required by country of entry or transit must accompany the bird(s).
Falcons are accepted at the owner's risk
The reservation must be arranged at least 48 hours prior to the scheduled flight departure time and an approval is required from RJ's Systems & Procedures Section.
Important Notice
Charges
One falcon is charged three times the normal excess baggage rate. More than one falcon per handler will require the booking of an adjacent seat.
Maximum: two falcons per seat.
Max number of falcons per aircraft type
Narrow bodied aircraft: 10 FALCONS
Wide bodied aircraft: 15 FALCONS
Rodents are prohibited carriage on all RJ flights.
Nov 5, 2018, 9:01 am
#249
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: near to SFO and LHR
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You pay premium to get, among other things, more quiet and privacy. Although there is no limitation and wealthy parents can book their kids in F should they wish to do so, the average J or F traveller assumes that she/he will be less likely to be bothered by families. If that happens, nothing will excuse rudeness, but I do think it perfectly normal for those individuals to feel uncomfortable.
when you fly economy, you are naturally more open to experience the full spectrum of potential travel related issues, including babies and loud families.
Luckily, most parents I've observed in C or F are very considerate of others - it's the few who don't really give a *** about other people who are the problem.
Nov 5, 2018, 11:06 am
#251
Join Date: Mar 2009
Programs: BAEC Gold; Le Club Accorhotels Plat; Marriott Gold
Posts: 371
I realise that this is a frequent flyer forum, but I was still very unpleasantly surprised about a sense of entitlement of some VIP’s here. In an nutshell, they think that babies either shouldn’t fly or if they do, they should be able to control their noise/behaviour. Genius!!!
Nov 5, 2018, 2:10 pm
#252
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 1,197
I've genuinely never considered being away from families part of booking F / J... because I've regularly seen families in F / J.
Maybe I'm on the wrong flights?
Like I said before, when airlines state that certain cabins are childless, that's when you can rightfully expect not to have to deal with them.
Edit - I'm actually starting to wonder if it's the fact that I don't have kids that means I'm not so easily offended by their presence!
Maybe I'm on the wrong flights?
Like I said before, when airlines state that certain cabins are childless, that's when you can rightfully expect not to have to deal with them.
Edit - I'm actually starting to wonder if it's the fact that I don't have kids that means I'm not so easily offended by their presence!
Nov 8, 2018, 5:38 am
#253
Join Date: Sep 2013
Programs: BAEC Silver
Posts: 186
I used to fly multiple times per month with my boss on NetJets and it was amazing how many things he found he could complain about. I've had flights with all sorts of rude employees and disruptions and I definitely have been hot under the collar at the time like OP, but I think a lot of this is about what a person wants to let bother them. For my boss, even small miscues in the catering or kids running around the FBO set him off and had him getting his PA to complain. Yes almonds and cashews instead of macadamia nuts is a big deal 
Just another case of someone getting too big for his own boots.
Seriously, I get it... he likely made a lot of money. From my own experience though, many of the bigger earners in companies (and yes, I'm a little disillusioned with companies) are not the most efficient or most capable. They often tended to be bullies or played politics instead of doing actual work. If they vanished with a snap of my fingers, and everyone else just continued what they were doing, the company would still function and their absence would hardly be noticed (other than it's a better work environment to be in).
Nov 8, 2018, 5:48 am
#254
Join Date: Sep 2013
Programs: BAEC Silver
Posts: 186
Well...yes?
But I assume it’s the other way round. You pay premium to get, among other things, more quiet and privacy. Although there is no limitation and wealthy parents can book their kids in F should they wish to do so, the average J or F traveller assumes that she/he will be less likely to be bothered by families. If that happens, nothing will excuse rudeness, but I do think it perfectly normal for those individuals to feel uncomfortable.
when you fly economy, you are naturally more open to experience the full spectrum of potential travel related issues, including babies and loud families.
I really do not see the scandal here...
No.
All you have paid for is extra space and a little more service to get from A to B. If you're lucky, caring parents with a baby are seated inside your cabin. If you're unlucky, you'll be seated in a cabin with a grumpy company executive, a drunk celeb or someone with an attitude (anyone who thinks they're someone but they're really no one).
Nov 8, 2018, 5:54 am
#255
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It also makes it much harder to manage children with their own seat when you are seated apart, or even in the middle pair where the access to your neighbouring seat isn't optimum.
I have often seen problems with children in F repeatedly undoing their seat belt and trying to get up, with cabin crew needed to stay by their seat to manage the situation until immediately before take-off, in some cases with the child throwing a huge tantrum over the seat belt, and then return immediately afterwards to put it back on, all because, of course, the parents can't reach them because they had to be strapped in. I have also seen the same thing in turbulence.
In many ways, young children (perhaps under 6 or so) need to be restricted to seats within immediate and unrestricted reach of their parents for their (children's) own safety, and perhaps in a seat where they would have difficulties 'escaping' without going over the parents so that they can't just undo their seat belt and get into the aisle during take-off/turbulence etc., which I have seen quite a few times. I had to press the call button to alert the crew (I essentially NEVER press the call button unless it's really urgent like that) a number of times to put them back in the seat. It creates undue workload for crew and extra risk for children, and extra risk for parents who may get out of their seat to tend to their children.
I have often seen problems with children in F repeatedly undoing their seat belt and trying to get up, with cabin crew needed to stay by their seat to manage the situation until immediately before take-off, in some cases with the child throwing a huge tantrum over the seat belt, and then return immediately afterwards to put it back on, all because, of course, the parents can't reach them because they had to be strapped in. I have also seen the same thing in turbulence.
In many ways, young children (perhaps under 6 or so) need to be restricted to seats within immediate and unrestricted reach of their parents for their (children's) own safety, and perhaps in a seat where they would have difficulties 'escaping' without going over the parents so that they can't just undo their seat belt and get into the aisle during take-off/turbulence etc., which I have seen quite a few times. I had to press the call button to alert the crew (I essentially NEVER press the call button unless it's really urgent like that) a number of times to put them back in the seat. It creates undue workload for crew and extra risk for children, and extra risk for parents who may get out of their seat to tend to their children.
My bigger concern is that unsecured children, including lap kids as well as the ones who refuse to keep their seat belts fastened when required, are a risk to other passengers (such as me me me) sitting near by as well as the cabin crew who sometimes take personal risks to walk to the child and try to restrain him/her.