Often1

Perhaps OP could simply accept the GBP 300 offer and not put himself through the entire Letter Before Action and other associated time-consuming tasks.

The arbitration function is a great idea if the parties were at a standstill. Here BA might be just as happy to end this for once and for all.

I would not be so certain that BA won't litigate this issue. It is never about one single case. If it were, BA would have simply refunded the entire ticket as it has likely expended far in excess of OP's claim already. Rather, it is about the non-binding precedent it sets if it starts providing disproportionate cash refunds for individual services.

hearingdouble

If a plane ticket were solely a contract for transportation, passengers with tickets in WT, WTP, CW and F would have the same contractual rights for the duration of their flight, irrespective of what they were sold. Is that really correct?

Clearly I have more to learn about the Montreal convention, but is it really right that (but for statutory EU-261 downgrade compensation) paid-for cabin benefits are, from a contract law perspective, discretionary? I.e. That if you buy a Club World ticket and one day BA sat you in a 31" pitch 3-4-3 cabin and called it "Club World" that you would have no claim for breach of contract?

I completely agree that compensation (rather than a full refund) is appropriate here. When determining quantum it seems to me that the cost delta between flat-bed products and sit-up products on the same flight is not an unreasonable place to start. Thankfully I've never been in this position, but the main reason I pay the significant premium for premium cabins in long haul is so that I can get some sleep.

NWIFlyer

The offer is no longer there - it likely went with the CEDR decision. The only likely way to bring it back on the table is MCOL. That's what will potentially force arbitration, but this time forcing BA to have a phone conversation directly with the OP, with the MCOL system providing the arbitration service.

mec72

I guess if the OP will want to put some valuation to various components of a CW ticket (flat bed, blanket, alcohol, food, lounge access) to figure out how much of this is directly attributable to a flat bed on a ~12 hour overnight flight, BA will surely not want to have this tried before a court and will put forward a settlement offer with an NDA?

TabTraveller

I suspect this would largely depend on when this information became known to the air carrier and the passenger.

If a late aircraft swap on a mid-haul route meant that a shorthaul A321 got subbed in for a longhaul A321 after 'embarkation' then the carrier could probably rely on the Convention to defend against a claim for breach of contract. If the notification came before embarkation then I would expect the passenger to be able to rely on the domestic law in their jurisdiction.

In the above example I don't think that EC261 would apply in any event.

HarryKUK

Doesn't much simpler legislation apply here? Like if Dixons advertised a 42" OLED and sent you a 32" LCD instead? Surely this is simply basic trading law - you can't advertise one thing and deliver another. Would you accept £50 for that, assuming the difference in price between the two items was the same?

My other concern re: BAs stance is that they have little to no incentive to fix their broken seats / planes if they can get away with this. Was the seat broken before / after this flight? How many other pax but up with the same broken seat, where BA presumably took in thousands and refunded £50/£300 or whatever?

Re: walking off the plane, in reality I think I'd be too scared to end up with no ticket, no refund and no assistance if I did that. So once again, BA have the upper hand and muggins here has to play along. I might be better off sitting in the aisle until I get a new boarding card before takeoff and see if BA "do a United" and drag me off. At least I'd get some press attention.

MADPhil

It's interesting to see how parsimonious BA has become. I was on an AA daytime TATL flight where the equipment was swapped and a lie flat seat in 1-2-1 became an angled seat in 2-2-2. AA sent me an apologetic email and 25,000 RDMs out of the blue. I had been rebooked from BA owing to a cancellation and the flight was credited to BA.

mrow

I had a similar experience. Was booked in F on a 77W and the aircraft was switched to a 772 with no F, so downgraded to J. This was on an ex-JFK routing so no EU261 to invoke.

I had originally got into F using an SWU (Upgrade instrument similar to a GUF1) so wasn't too worried about the downgrade and told the gate agent so (she had suggested she would rebook me on BA but I didn't want to change terminals and just wanted to get on a plane to come home).

The SWU was returned to me. I got a voucher at the gate for $250 USD and I also got 15,000 AAdvantage miles as an apology. All of this was proactively offered without any prompting whatsoever. Voucher was provided upon boarding and SWU and miles were in my account when I landed at LHR the next morning.

Only problem is using an AA paper voucher - they're a pain in the neck and I still have it sitting on my desk as I haven't been organised enough to take it to an AA ticket desk to redeem it!!

gcuk

The process has been simplified. It's no longer necessary to visit an airport desk or post it to the US. There is now a UK address to post it to after making the booking and my ticket was issued within 3 days. Fast becoming a firm fan of AA Customer Service and their service recovery.

Stez

Some people talk about what's the right level of compensation and suggested the difference between W and J.

Would the EU261 involuntary downgrade compensation amount be a useful benchmark? (while realising there's no actual downgrade through the cabins).

TabTraveller

I appreciate that you are meaning well here, but encouraging the OP to pursue compensation is utterly unrealistic. The determination by the Adjudicator is correct in law and there is no basis for a claim due to the limitations afforded by the Montreal Convention. Banging on about EC261 or English consumer law is deeply unhelpful as any claim is destined to fail.

I would encourage all of those posting along the lines of the above to actually read some of the precedents. Stott v Thomas Cook [2014] UKSC 15 is an illustrative case of the extent to which the MC precludes claims from being brought against airlines except in the limited circumstances permitted by the Convention.

NWIFlyer

And perhaps, for the sake of balance, we ought to point out that other qualified legal professionals, plus those not qualified but nonetheless extremely experienced in this area, have posted in this thread and overwhelmingly disagree with you. Simply continuing to state a given scenario will happen doesn't, perhaps, necessarily mean it actually will. @:-)

bafan

Interesting to note that the EU is the signatory to the Montreal Convention so who knows what might happen on Brexit...

BlackBerryAddict

Much as I do not like Brexit, the United Kingdom is also a signatory in its own right.

Ancient Observer

On the "who is/is not" qualified to speak, swmbo, who was a solicitor, says that many of these sorts of cases are solved by the court door.
She found it very frustrating - having a great case etc., but the barristers, and the judges, love a settlement.