1Aturnleft

I think the days of higher offers are long gone.
In 2012 I was offered 40k avios for a similar non reclining (seat physically should not recline beyond take off/landing position) Club seat on a AMM-LHR flight and in early 2015 my o/h offered 50k in F when the seat wouldn't fully recline into bed mode. Your offer of $50/9k avios is quite frankly insulting but a sign of the penny pinching and cost savings going on at BA under Alex Cruz control. In your position I'd have declined, ensured the fault was logged with the CSD and sought official proceedings with BA for a fairer outcome upon my return.

BrianDromey

On a recent SIN-LHR the footstool would not raise above the lowest position, so no Z position or fully flat sleeping surface.
I asked for the miles equivolent for WTP-CW on that trip. Was given 5k.

nufnuf77

Push harder, perhaps via MCOL or CEDR.

porky73

Hi everyone, looking for a little advice re: compensation for broken seat, non-operating IFE, missing kids meals.

This was on a flight we took last year and the issues were meant to be logged via onboard iPad complaints procedure. We never heard anything from BA and ultimately I decided to write them recently about it since I had to respond separately to them in relation to an EU delay claim.

Anyway, background is that we were flying YYC to LHR in late August 2016. At the departure gate we were advised that 2 of our club 4 seats were broken (i.e. not reclining) and that they were working to fix them. Maybe 30mins later they told us seats couldn't be fixed and that they could split our party (including 2 young children) into CW and economy or even put on next day flight. We didn't want to separate as generally my wife doesn't fly well and I need to be there to take care of the children - and also, if I recall correctly we had selected seats such that what they suggested would require one of kids to not be sat beside my wife. Anyhow, someone from the cabin crew then turned up and said they could manually recline the seats so that we could all sit together. Once we boarded, we then discovered that my daughter's IFE didn't work and even with manual recline, it was pretty much impossible to recline my seat as access to make the manual adjustment was from behind my seat and the passenger there had already gone to sleep. AND finally to add to the frustration, we were told (by the cabin crew) that my daughter would be prioritised for meal choice as they had no kids meals and due to her allergies. But when they came to serve her, of course they were out of the requested meal.

So long story short, issues were:
1. Complete lack of coordination with between ground staff and cabin crew - ground staff told us nothing could be done with seats, offered to re-route for next day. Several long frustrating conversations;
2. 2 broken J seats (non-reclining);
3. 1 broken IFE system; and
4. Missing children's meal (or non-suitable) option for 1 child.

BA came back to me this week and said they couldn't find a log of the issues in question but as a gesture of goodwill were prepared to offer 30K avios total for the issues (or alternatively, I could take 3x £50 e-vouchers). The CSR told me that she could not offer more.

These were cash paid tickets (maybe £1300 or £1400/ea, I can't recall exactly). Is this something where MCOL or CEDR would produce a better outcome? AND what is reasonable to expect in this situation, if people have experience of this?

Thanks in advance for advice and information.

haroon145

Did you pay by credit card? If so, I recommend a section 75 claim - I've had success before but with QR

Can I help you

porky73, looking at our compensation framework you would be due 33,000 Avios for the seats, IFE and meal issue, I don't think that you will get anything for point 1.

Flexible preferences

It sounds to me like the ground crew were not only correct that the seats couldn't be fixed, but also tried to resolve the situation by offering alternatives. What would you have liked the ground crew to have done differently?

Regarding the cabin crew, sounds like they were trying to be helpful regarding the seat, but it didnt work out, (for one seat anyway?). Bad luck regarding the seats and IFE, seems a mystery regarding the meal and iPad entry. 30k avios is a bit light, but for an easy life worth accepting in my opinion.

corporate-wage-slave

It certainly wasn't a good flight, all told, particularly as it would have been a night flight. The CR offer is towards the top of what I would have expected, in the context of other claims we see here, I doubt you will willingly get more from that particular source. The "what is reasonable" question is something that only you can answer, in my view it's not comparable to other people or other situations since we all have own value judgements here. After all most people don't travel business class, so those who do have deployed their own judgement about not flying economy. Both MCOL and CEDR are legitimate routes to pursue the matter further, and Section 75 if eligible.

porky73

@haroon145 - just read a thread re: s75 and CC companies seem to be resisting on basis that this is a service issue. Even if they would acknowledge your claim, the key point seems to be that you need to prove the value of the loss.
@Flexible preferences - I didn't give a full account and I didn't expect the ground crew to be able to guarantee a fix per se. But, it was such a confused / uncoordinated effort. Ground crew says can't be fixed, how about next day travel or how about we separate you from kids with some economy seats? Then they say we have found an extra seat for you and then turn around and say sorry we can't give it to you - how about travelling tomorrow. AND then finally someone from the Cabin crew presents at the departure desk and says we can manually recline. I'm not saying managing customer expectations is always easy but we were travelling in party of 4 with a 3yr and 5yr old. A little more dialogue from Cabin crew and Ground crew would have been nice. And why didn't ground crew know that seats could be manually reclined?

30,000 avios is worth maybe £300. If that's the case then why can't I buy long haul CW tickets for economy price plus a little more than £100+. Just saying that if this is the appropriate level of compensation in their eyes then they must have a very dim view of what they are offering in J.

corporate-wage-slave

Well you kind of provide your own framework for working out what this is worth to you: imagine when were reserving these tickets a little box then pops up during the booking process. Let's say the box offers you a £300 discount to give you the CW product (including food and lounge [such as it is in YYC!]) but 2 seats wouldn't recline / meal + IFE issues. Would you accept that £300 discount? If not, how about £400? And so on.

porky73

Thanks CWS. Was trying to add a tangible valuation to the process, had this in mind:

Half Original Ticket Price GBP 750
Less: 1/2 Economy Price GBP 300
Less: extra luggage GBP 30
Less: "improved" food GBP 20
Less: lounge access GBP 40
-----------------------------------------
Subtotal GBP 360

Of course I already had extra baggage and lounge access due to status, so even if priced in they had no benefit to me. AND whilst not reclining, I did have extra space so perhaps worth £100. So overall, I guess I would say the minimum it was worth is £250. The intangibles include the fact, that lie-flat makes life easier with young children and wife doesn't travel well at all (hence why we almost always travel J). So I reckon the baseline valuation is somewhere around £300-350+. Anyone think that sounds totally unreasonable?

stevie

Typical BA - screw things up and then compound further by an insulting compensation offer. By all means fight your case, but I would not expect them to improve. Vote with your wallet next time.

porky73

I'd vote with my wallet if only I didn't have to travel to YYC, the only other viable option is AC where the J product isn't great either.

CEDR first? Or straight to MCOL and any views on success rate and types of pre-mediation/litigation settlement might be offered?

corporate-wage-slave

You potentially have 4 options for this case:
- Section 75
- MCOL ticking the arbitration box
- MCOL not ticking the arbitration option
- CEDR

In your case I'm tempted by MCOL/no arbitration since you merely have to convince a judge that on the balance of probability you have the better argument. S/he won't order a payment more than you claimed, but will cut it down to a lower amount based on reasonableness. There is a good chance that BA won't defend the case. However it may involve a face to face hearing, it will be formal, you must carefully construct your case at the start and follow the strict timelines involved.

CEDR is similar in a way, but though this is more consumer law rather aviation law, I suspect that the Mediator will essentially have a legal background and so may be heavily guided by the Conditions of Carriage. It is however a more informal process, it is unlikely (though not impossible) to award more than you asked, it is likely to be free of cost to you, and you may find the exchange of information process more helpful than MCOL. There is a reasonable chance that BA will defend the case, though not necessarily using a lawyer.

A lot depends, I guess, on your determination and the amount of time you can devote to this.

porky73

Thanks CWS.

MCOL looks like fees at 2 stages: (1) Making claim and (2) Trial fees. Does the court also award costs? Why do you think BA won't defend the case? All in, I would be asking for somewhere near £1,000 for all the affected parties. What do I actually need to prove here, the implied value of various components of CW? When I spoke to BA, the CSR couldn't even find a record of the service disruption/issue. I actually have no idea what information BA has or doesn't have.

The sad thing about this situation is that BA already owes us an EU261 claim for the outbound leg plus they credited me 5K avios (which I actually refused and they still put into my account) for a missing meal for daughter on outbound.