simons1

That wasn't my point. Were lives placed in danger through the baggage issues - for example was there damage to slides, congestion at top of slides, people prevented from getting to the exits, people injured by falling baggage, plane took longer to evacuate than SOP etc.

I know there was fire, smoke etc but that would have created a risk regardless of the baggage situation.

8420PR

Am I a bad person because I hope that if anyone is killed or injured because someone else didn't follow the rules, that it is you! At least you would understand!

PS. Please don't take this personally, I just wanted to highlight how silly I thought your statement was.

Can I help you

I think that well thought out rules are required when you are travelling on mass public transport, no piece of handbaggage is worth risking the lives of fellow passengers.

KARFA

The civil courts don't have the power to resurrect someone from death though.

Fire and smoke can spread very quickly in an aircraft. Anyone who wishes to waste time grabbing bags and then haul then up the aisle and on the chute is putting everyone else's lives in danger. This isn't h&s gone made, it is common sense.

simons1

I don't think anyone is disagreeing with that - it's a perfectly rational approach.

However the challenge is that in an emergency situation where there is possible fire, smoke etc etc people generally do not follow rules or behave in a rational way. That may not be malicious, just the way people behave under conditions of stress.

I was in a hotel in Dubai about 2 years ago where there was an evacuation at 4.30am due to a fire in the kitchen. Every room had a plan on the back of the door telling people what to do and where to go. What happened was a different thing.

Can I help you

To me some people seem to put their personal needs above safety.

simons1

Unless you have been in such a situation (you may have been, I certainly haven't) I don't think you can say what goes through peoples' minds and causes them to react as they do.

Can I help you

You are correct I cannot say, but as someone who takes their responsibilities very seriously I hope that passengers would understand that sometimes in life you just just have to do what you are told to do in certain situations.

corporate-wage-slave

Does anyone else recall the old safety video? The bit where a younger blond guy catches a basket like piece of hand luggage about to fall on the passenger below? It's stuck in my mind though I haven't seen that video for years.

I wonder if they need to update the current video to show someone going down an escape slide with a 23 kgs block sliding rapidly towards their head......

BA4EVER

I will say that I'm a bit biased in perspective by flying J & F exclusively on longhaul, and window seats on shorthaul. I don't feel like I would be slowing anyone but myself down if I decided to grab my hand luggage, which would usually be in an F cupboard or the closet on the 747, a J side locker on the UD, or under my seat at a window on shorthaul.

Admittedly, if I were in a middle seat or possibly an aisle in W, Y, or shorthaul, I probably wouldn't grab the bag out of consideration for others.

This goes to the point, though. Someone suggested anyone emerging with a bag should be prosecuted. If I choose to risk myself by retrieving my bag from a private J or F storage space without obstructing anyone else, that is my business. I'm a grown man and perfectly capable of controlling a piece of hand luggage on my way down the slide.

mario

I agree with what you are saying, I just think that the rules are fine as they are right now. No need to "lock the overhead bins" or "build a slide for hand baggage"...

My view is that there is always going to be someone who will take their bags despite the rules and there's nothing that can be done about it - trying to prevent them or asking them to leave the bag behind before they evacuate the aircraft would only delay the process even further.

That doesn't mean I think that the message should change - otherwise we would see even more people trying to retrieve their belongings...

Perhaps aircraft evacuation certification should take into account that X% of people will reach out and retrieve their bags - because that's what happens and there's nothing that can be done about it.

lhrsfo

I'm not sure it would be the civil courts. As I understand it, passengers must follow crew member instructions and can be arrested if they don't. It's presumably an arrestable offence, therefore, to take your handbaggage with you on evacuation. If someone dies because you were in the process of committing an arrestable offence (and one where it is very foreseeable that such would be the result of your actions), I could well imagine a US prosecutor going for murder as the charge.

KARFA

You are clearly not just risking yourself though. You are risking everyone else who is also trying to evacuate.

Of the benefits of J and F, one is not that you can ignore safety rules and decide what carry on bags to take with you during an emergency evacuation.

BA4EVER

That's the thing, I don't see how grabbing a small bag without obstructing anyone else would pose a risk to anyone but myself. I'm unlikely to be convinced otherwise.

I'll agree to disagree, though.

KARFA

I and others have noted the reasons in earlier posts. You are right though, there is no problem agreeing to disagree on this thread. However, whilst we may disagree on the thread I hope that in a real life situation (which I don't wish on you or anyone else) you follow the current procedure and don't take any bags.