Oaxaca

"Indecent" in % terms maybe, and not many customers are overjoyed with the changes, but in a rising economic environment, fairly inevitable in cash terms. Even if you were to buy 30K Avios from BA (just about the most expensive way to acquire them), they would cost £495 today. The reality is that this is not a big price for upgrading from WTP to CW, BA knows it and don't have to sell the CW seat to GIG at WTP+£495 return. Since many people acquire Avios at a far lower price though credit cards, Tesco etc, this was becoming even lower value for BA. My observation is that it was great while it lasted. Whether the promise to show more reward availability is made good remains to be seen.

Are those other airlines offering £1500 for J on a direct flight? BA doesn't have much competition on that, and the majority of UK punters don't do the ex-EU thing, despite what you might think from reading FT.

They could indeed have done all these things, but they would have required investment and in some cases more complex rules (lounges etc). BA isn't seeking to be the best, they are seeking cold hard profit. By reducing the BAEC benefits, which have been undoubtedly generous, they are taking the bet that even if some customers walk, they will have enough to replace them and maintain profit growth. I'm not sure personally that BA are good enough to compete on hard/soft product alone, but that will only be seen in a longer timeframe, when the economy cycles round again and they have to try and win people back with what by then will likely be a vastly inferior product. I wouldn't hold your breath on BA backing down on this anytime soon.

I'm sure many are, the question is how many do anything about it and whether BA can replace them. If UuA was a big benefit for you, its increase in price just needs to be costed into your future purchasing decisions. Sometimes that's easier said than done though.

atmorris

Not to be argumentative, but if you want travel in the CW cabin, then book CW, as relying on UuA is a dangerous game to play...

I am still trying to this day using my AF Miles to upgrade flights, and guess what in 3 years, ive not managed it once... So I now know to book into Business if i want to travel in Business.

So BA is no different to other schemes.

LondonFlight

Could not agree more and look forward to experiencing other airlines. I was locked with Star Alliance since the airline alliance concept was launched, and was then stuck with Oneworld. From now on I will give up the mileage game and buy the best available fare.

wyvern

Trying other airlines from time to time is always a good thing. I have always tried to fly more than one carrier/alliance for variety.

The new T2 offers a nicer overall experience arriving an departing than T5 - especially if you are Star Gold for fast track outbound security and priority baggage arrival which actually works, and have a PP or other card for the arrivals lounge.

There are some good FFP offerings from *A airlines and also still quite a few *A discount economy fares which earn 100% miles.

BA has made some business decisions - my view is that they probably needed to make some of the changes as they may have been a little over generous in the past, but that they may have gone too far and may be alienating too many heretofore 'loyal' customers.

I would have been happier had the Silver bonus reduced to 75% and had discount Y been dropped to only 50% TP and miles, possibly with intermediate Y at 75% TP and miles - 25% seems very stingy. As a fairly regular WTP traveller looking for the cheapest fare, I am not happy about the change from 125% earning to split 100%/150% between discount and full WTP. And if BA needed to put up the cost of premium redemptions, they could have done it by a lesser factor.

As the owner of a SME I am not happy with the On Business changes which are great for companies spending £300K with BA but pretty poor for your average SME which does not spend anything like that.

However I guess BA have done their maths! As a shareholder I hope they start paying a dividend again - and relaunch a shareholder discount scheme!

I flew CW the other day for the first time since last year and they have definitely not enhanced it - the club kitchen in particular seems to have had some consultancy from Old Mother Hubbard. The service on board was great but the premium experience in T5 leaves a lot to be desired, especially if you are departing from T5C.

HIDDY

Sensible move especially if you don't travel often enough to get the benefit of status. That's why I don't have or need it.

I have never used Avios to upgrade due to the high cost of WT+ fares from EZE. Why go through all the hassle of hoping award seats open up when you can buy a Biz class ticket with another airline for a couple of hundred quid more?

paul4040

Yes, UuA from W to J is now poor value. So don't use your Avios on it any more...!

There are lots of good value redemptions still about. I have disposed of a lot of Avios on Band 1 weekends away which I would otherwise have spent cash on. Save the cash and buy a cheap I class return to the USA instead... It's all about tweaking your plans to fit your budget.

If you do a wide variety of flying then with a pen and paper you can still eke out a lot of value if you sit and think about it.

If you *don't* do a lot of flying, then one wonders what you expect to get from a Frequent Flyer Programme...

HMPS

If this business model is what BA is using how do you /others/ BA explain the giving up avios by the truckloads to credit card sign ups with Chase / Amex-Tesco etc.

Isn't this what is clogging the premium cabins and the lounges ? bringing down the premium paying pax per a lot of posters ?

FrancisA

I am not sure on what basis you think that. Have BA ever said that?

The purpose of POUGs and to a lesser extent AUPs is to give their purchasers a taste of a higher cabin than the one that they normally fly - hence they are targeted and restricted.

Awards, often referred to as rewards, on the other hand are a BAEC benefit for your continued custom and are not targeted. The only restriction is availability, which Revenue Management control.

As for the OP's point - yes, earning and burning rates are worse, but to some extent no worse than they used to be. Removal of the WT+ to CW sweet spot is not nice, but it was a real bargain previously.

Having tried a programme that was generous to back of the bus fliers, BA seem to have decided to return its focus to premium cabin fliers. This is how BAEC always used to be.

It is wrong to think BA is not interested in leisure fliers - it is more interested in someone flying in CW or F than any business traveller on an HBO Y fare, as numerous recent threads demonstrate.

Globaliser

And when have I said either of those things? WT+ --> CW UuAs were my most frequent use of BAEC awards, and they are poorer value for me now, just as they are for you. Recognising these changes as an inevitable correction of an anomalous situation doesn't mean that I'm happy about them. But it does mean that this isn't the time for throwing toys out of the pram.

Often1

And therein lies the problem. If the FFP were simply one point for one GBP and those points could be used to purchase tickets at the same rate, all would be well. But, that is not the case and it has resulted in a vast ocean of "points" not accumulated based solely on spend.

simons1

I agree, I have never understood that.

For me the best model is one based on spend, which is the way the US airlines are going (I noticed SAA has just done the same).

paul4040

There are lots of people who feel pushed out; that's been documented over the last four months since BA announced the changes.

The fact is, you and I, and everyone else know that UuA W to J was ridiculously good value. With the Avios you earned on the underlying fare it almost cost nothing at times. I don't think anyone reasonably expected that sweet spot to stay any longer. I had a couple of sweet spots which I mined like hell because I knew at some point they'd be removed.

Now the BAEC is fairer if a little less rewarding for most of us.

Globaliser

It was sometimes even better than that.

A Gold or Silver flying LHR-CPT or LHR-JNB in paid WT+ (T class) would earn 13,542 or 12,690 Avios; a UuA to CW on either flight would only cost 12,500.

kauppias

While I could understand that they needed to change, I think going from 100% to 25% earnings on alot of Y fares was too much, As I think raising uua prices 140+% was too much...

They basically made BA an airline to avoid for me... YMMV of course. But why would I pay for a WTP fare to only get 100% credit??

So now I switched to different flights for 2015 and am burning my avios stash. None of which were earned from credit cards or shopping

While I wish BA had been more modest in changes all I can do is make my own changes while enjoying my last year a BAEC Gold. I sure hope BA will still be able to fill those a380's in the back with flyers that do not care about miles

atmorris

So around 99% of the PAX on the plane, who don't care about TP or Avios, and who just book on Price, Convenience, Flight times etc.

Or look at another way you pay for a WTP seat, why shouldn't you sit in it? as I and many people have said (in numerous threads) you want CW then pay for it, never assume you will always be allowed to UuA