Passengers that makes you want to scream
Feb 28, 2015, 3:07 am
#31
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: UK
Programs: BA GGL, BA Amex Prem, Amex Plat, Hilton Diamond, Sir Crazy8534 de l'ordres des aides de Pucci
Posts: 4,466
Glad to hear the unwell passenger was sort of OK. It sounds like the application of defib pads was precautionary and the presence of the doctor at least contributed to them being able to avoid a diversion and all of the extra cost and inconvenience that results. I hope he will send BA an invoice for his usual fee...
As to what has been said above by Littlegirl and waterhorse, the use of a particular set of equipment is certainly best left to those who are familiar with it. I'm sure Lewis Hamilton could drive my car better than I can, but then he doesn't know where to find the keys!
As to what has been said above by Littlegirl and waterhorse, the use of a particular set of equipment is certainly best left to those who are familiar with it. I'm sure Lewis Hamilton could drive my car better than I can, but then he doesn't know where to find the keys!
Feb 28, 2015, 3:30 am
#32
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: LAX/SYD
Programs: BA GGL/CCR, AA EXP, QFF WP, HH D, SPG G, Hertz PC
Posts: 245
You need three cabin crew in a medical emergency that involves doing CPR.
One to do the compressions and one to hold the airway open and administer the breaths of air. (Ideally another to administer the shocks) the third one needs to liaise with the Flight Crew and keep them informed.
Doctors and nurses are great for prescribing, diagnosing and administering medication but believe it or not, most cabin crew are more used to practicing CPR and using a defibrillator than a lot of Doctors are.
One to do the compressions and one to hold the airway open and administer the breaths of air. (Ideally another to administer the shocks) the third one needs to liaise with the Flight Crew and keep them informed.
Doctors and nurses are great for prescribing, diagnosing and administering medication but believe it or not, most cabin crew are more used to practicing CPR and using a defibrillator than a lot of Doctors are.
There should be at least two people doing compressions, taking turns. There's evidence that long term provision of compressions results in poor technique, and likely bad outcome.
The issue about resuscitation with breaths is controversial still as the stopping to provide breaths prevents the provision of regular and competent CPR and leads to too many breaks in compressions. In the most common kind of out-of-hospital arrests, CPR only was associated with a better outcome for patients. However, many resuscitation organisations still don't recommend compressions-only CPR.
Keep in mind this isn't specific medical advice, only the details that guide my practice.
Feb 28, 2015, 4:03 am
#33
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2002
Programs: Mucci des Hommes Magiques et Magnifiques
Posts: 19,096
We are told that the first crewmember on site who is designated as The Assessor takes control on the situation and summons for help, the second crewmember becomes The Collector and the third is The Supportor.
The Assessor and The Supportor attend to the casualty and The Collector after collecting any medical equipment before becoming the Communicator.
If we are giving CPR The Assessor and The Supportor can swap over if the Assessor needs help.
The Assessor and The Supportor attend to the casualty and The Collector after collecting any medical equipment before becoming the Communicator.
If we are giving CPR The Assessor and The Supportor can swap over if the Assessor needs help.
Last edited by Can I help you; Feb 28, 2015 at 4:32 am
Feb 28, 2015, 4:05 am
#34
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The passenger ended up regaining consciousness, was hooked up on oxygen all the flight and we didn't have to divert. An ambulance was in attendance at Gatters, so I suppose it ended up ok for him. But - I could see him from where I was sat - it really looked bad. I don't know if you've ever seen an sick person dying, the kind of looks that he/she has in the last few hours; I had, unfortunately, and more than once. He had exactly the same looks.
Well, one cabin crew was on the phone (with the flying crew, I assume) describing the situation, one was fetching equipment and helping out, the other one was the one that spotted the issue first.
The nurse went really into a panic. I'm not judging her, but she just completely froze, she kept droning that her patient wasn't responding.
The doctor onboard also had his own patient to look after as he had to keeping on going from one to another.
All we were missing was a man with a cello, a pregnant woman and Charlton Heston at the steering wheel. Then it could've been a 1970s film.
Well, one cabin crew was on the phone (with the flying crew, I assume) describing the situation, one was fetching equipment and helping out, the other one was the one that spotted the issue first.
The nurse went really into a panic. I'm not judging her, but she just completely froze, she kept droning that her patient wasn't responding.
The doctor onboard also had his own patient to look after as he had to keeping on going from one to another.
All we were missing was a man with a cello, a pregnant woman and Charlton Heston at the steering wheel. Then it could've been a 1970s film.
There was a nurse with her patient.
A Doc with his own patient.
Was this a med flight?
Feb 28, 2015, 4:19 am
#35
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: London
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 63
Feb 28, 2015, 4:38 am
#36
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 7,237
Well, it was a flight from Alicante, which I think can possibly rival Vancouver for the highest average passengers' age amongst the BA routes I've flown on.
Feb 28, 2015, 4:55 am
#37
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,775
We rant ad infinitum, here, on how BA is letting us down and crew can't be arsed and ground staff don't care and blah blah blah, but what about our fellow passengers?
I've had my fair share of encounters with unsavory travelers, from obnoxious individuals to complete knobs. Take, for example, the Alicante flight that I've been on a couple of days ago: a packed flight with people who've decided to take onboard half of their possessions, at least judging by the dimensions of their carrier bags, and that all pretended that the crew literally created the space for them. Without using the space where the yellow-labeled bags should go, obviously.
Then, in Club, the full English runs out, leaving only the frittata or the cold platter. Now, I'm a big fan of the cold platter, and so are my arteries; but I understand that the full English is always the full English, and not having it might cause a bit of a stir. What I don't understand is why a grown man, possibly a man with a job and responsibilities and commitments, needs to behave like a 13-years-old teenager when he's told that, alas, the beloved sausages and bacon have indeed run out. And neither I understand why this man needs to subject the cabin crew, nice to a fault and really ready to find alternatives (seriously, she was showing quite a lot of inventive), to a stream-of-consciousness of rantings including punctuality, bags, the new Club cabin, food, price, the Border Force, all intertwined by the classic accusatory mantra "What are you gonna do about that?". Ignoring that, yes, she's offered you alternatives. Yes, she's offered you to fill a complaint form. Yes, she's apologised. And, no, she can't fetch you another sausage-and-bacon combo because we're in the middle of the bloody air.
Then, finally, a medical emergency happens. A full blown one, including defibrillator, big medkits, oxygen bottles aplenty, a panicked nurse who is asking the crew what can be done for her patient and the cliche call "Is there a doctor onboard?" (luckily, there was, bless him). All this, I should point out, on a A320.
And here comes mr Gold card holder (he took pride in showing it dangling from the handle of this carrier bag), hitting the 'call' bell button multiple times, only to ask the cabin crew, shuttling oxygen back and forth, for a drink. On a flight with 3 crews and a medical emergency going on. As fas as inappropriateness goes, this is second only to the one asking "Y'alright babe?" to a woman at her husband's funeral.
I see this sort of behaviour almost every single time I take it to the skies. Some routes - the Middle East, south of Spain - seem more affected than others, but there's no denying that for every cabin crew not doing his/her job, there are 10 of us behaving like, well, the diminutive of Richard.
Discuss!
I've had my fair share of encounters with unsavory travelers, from obnoxious individuals to complete knobs. Take, for example, the Alicante flight that I've been on a couple of days ago: a packed flight with people who've decided to take onboard half of their possessions, at least judging by the dimensions of their carrier bags, and that all pretended that the crew literally created the space for them. Without using the space where the yellow-labeled bags should go, obviously.
Then, in Club, the full English runs out, leaving only the frittata or the cold platter. Now, I'm a big fan of the cold platter, and so are my arteries; but I understand that the full English is always the full English, and not having it might cause a bit of a stir. What I don't understand is why a grown man, possibly a man with a job and responsibilities and commitments, needs to behave like a 13-years-old teenager when he's told that, alas, the beloved sausages and bacon have indeed run out. And neither I understand why this man needs to subject the cabin crew, nice to a fault and really ready to find alternatives (seriously, she was showing quite a lot of inventive), to a stream-of-consciousness of rantings including punctuality, bags, the new Club cabin, food, price, the Border Force, all intertwined by the classic accusatory mantra "What are you gonna do about that?". Ignoring that, yes, she's offered you alternatives. Yes, she's offered you to fill a complaint form. Yes, she's apologised. And, no, she can't fetch you another sausage-and-bacon combo because we're in the middle of the bloody air.
Then, finally, a medical emergency happens. A full blown one, including defibrillator, big medkits, oxygen bottles aplenty, a panicked nurse who is asking the crew what can be done for her patient and the cliche call "Is there a doctor onboard?" (luckily, there was, bless him). All this, I should point out, on a A320.
And here comes mr Gold card holder (he took pride in showing it dangling from the handle of this carrier bag), hitting the 'call' bell button multiple times, only to ask the cabin crew, shuttling oxygen back and forth, for a drink. On a flight with 3 crews and a medical emergency going on. As fas as inappropriateness goes, this is second only to the one asking "Y'alright babe?" to a woman at her husband's funeral.
I see this sort of behaviour almost every single time I take it to the skies. Some routes - the Middle East, south of Spain - seem more affected than others, but there's no denying that for every cabin crew not doing his/her job, there are 10 of us behaving like, well, the diminutive of Richard.
Discuss!
No names, no pack drill, but I remember vividly the first time I saw one of the "mover and shaker" elite throw an epic two-year-old type wobbler! I really couldn't believe it and, if I hadn't beein in uniform, I would have taken him into a "no camera" corridor and given him the thrashing his mum and dad should have done as a child! (The man, incidentally, is now a CEO of a major Blue Chip company, has his ugly mug in the FT regularly and is still as big a to55er as he was then!)
At Gatwick, he approached me on the Customer Service desk about 30 minutes after his evening flight to Nairobi had closed (check in used to close 90 minutes before departure for long hauls - that's a long time ago!) I rang everyone I could to try to get him accepted as a late passenger and, reluctantly, the Dispatcher agreed - but as the standbys have been onloaded, he would lose his Club seat and have to teavel Economy with no refund as "it's not BA's fault he's turned up late!"
When I put that to him, he agreed "I've got no bloody choice, have I!" I'll get the sack if I miss this meeting!" I checked him in, handed him his boarding pass - a middle seat down the back - at which point he visually exploded, veins popping out of his bull neck, which had gone a delightful shade of purple, and everything!
"I don't even get a bloody window or aisle seat! Bloody Hell!" and he spun round and threw his beautiful leather brief case about twenty feet where it hit the escalator and tumbled downstairs to fetch up at MacDonalds!
The Police and a BAA Security Manager popped over to see what the fuss was about and I am afraid to say the passenger did get one hell of a going over when he went through security. No orofice was left unexamined!
Feb 28, 2015, 4:57 am
#38
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Scotland
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 363
We are told that the first crewmember on site who is designated as The Assessor takes control on the situation and summons for help, the second crewmember becomes The Collector and the third is The Supportor.
The Assessor and The Supportor attend to the casualty and The Collector after collecting any medical equipment before becoming the Communicator.
If we are giving CPR The Assessor and The Supportor can swap over if the Assessor needs help.
The Assessor and The Supportor attend to the casualty and The Collector after collecting any medical equipment before becoming the Communicator.
If we are giving CPR The Assessor and The Supportor can swap over if the Assessor needs help.
If I take unwell you have my permission to all help, doctors nurses, staff, vets if need be and then we can discuss the outcome over a beer. One short with the wrong result is always the wrong result !
Feb 28, 2015, 5:01 am
#39
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,775
This might be a plan for cardiac arrest somewhere in the world, but it's not best practice.
There should be at least two people doing compressions, taking turns. There's evidence that long term provision of compressions results in poor technique, and likely bad outcome.
The issue about resuscitation with breaths is controversial still as the stopping to provide breaths prevents the provision of regular and competent CPR and leads to too many breaks in compressions. In the most common kind of out-of-hospital arrests, CPR only was associated with a better outcome for patients. However, many resuscitation organisations still don't recommend compressions-only CPR.
Keep in mind this isn't specific medical advice, only the details that guide my practice.
There should be at least two people doing compressions, taking turns. There's evidence that long term provision of compressions results in poor technique, and likely bad outcome.
The issue about resuscitation with breaths is controversial still as the stopping to provide breaths prevents the provision of regular and competent CPR and leads to too many breaks in compressions. In the most common kind of out-of-hospital arrests, CPR only was associated with a better outcome for patients. However, many resuscitation organisations still don't recommend compressions-only CPR.
Keep in mind this isn't specific medical advice, only the details that guide my practice.
http://www.sja.org.uk/sja/first-aid-...ing/adult.aspx
Last edited by bealine; Feb 28, 2015 at 5:07 am
Feb 28, 2015, 5:05 am
#40
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2002
Programs: Mucci des Hommes Magiques et Magnifiques
Posts: 19,096
Having helped to safe a ladies life by giving CPR I am proud of the training that we are given at BA.
Each year at our recurrent training we are updated on any new procedures that have come up and are tested in all roles of our medical plan.
We now have a new defibrillator onboard which is much easier to use and is more intuitive.
Each year at our recurrent training we are updated on any new procedures that have come up and are tested in all roles of our medical plan.
We now have a new defibrillator onboard which is much easier to use and is more intuitive.
Feb 28, 2015, 5:08 am
#41
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Robin Hood Territory
Programs: BA Silver, MUCCI des Soins Medicaux, Le médecin personnel à PUCCI GALORE
Posts: 1,613
Quote:
Originally Posted by 13900
The passenger ended up regaining consciousness, was hooked up on oxygen all the flight and we didn't have to divert. An ambulance was in attendance at Gatters, so I suppose it ended up ok for him. But - I could see him from where I was sat - it really looked bad. I don't know if you've ever seen an sick person dying, the kind of looks that he/she has in the last few hours; I had, unfortunately, and more than once. He had exactly the same looks.
Well, one cabin crew was on the phone (with the flying crew, I assume) describing the situation, one was fetching equipment and helping out, the other one was the one that spotted the issue first.
The nurse went really into a panic. I'm not judging her, but she just completely froze, she kept droning that her patient wasn't responding.
The doctor onboard also had his own patient to look after as he had to keeping on going from one to another.
All we were missing was a man with a cello, a pregnant woman and Charlton Heston at the steering wheel. Then it could've been a 1970s film.
Glad that everything turned out fine….. BUT,
There was a nurse with her patient.
A Doc with his own patient.
Was this a med flight?
Originally Posted by 13900
The passenger ended up regaining consciousness, was hooked up on oxygen all the flight and we didn't have to divert. An ambulance was in attendance at Gatters, so I suppose it ended up ok for him. But - I could see him from where I was sat - it really looked bad. I don't know if you've ever seen an sick person dying, the kind of looks that he/she has in the last few hours; I had, unfortunately, and more than once. He had exactly the same looks.
Well, one cabin crew was on the phone (with the flying crew, I assume) describing the situation, one was fetching equipment and helping out, the other one was the one that spotted the issue first.
The nurse went really into a panic. I'm not judging her, but she just completely froze, she kept droning that her patient wasn't responding.
The doctor onboard also had his own patient to look after as he had to keeping on going from one to another.
All we were missing was a man with a cello, a pregnant woman and Charlton Heston at the steering wheel. Then it could've been a 1970s film.
Glad that everything turned out fine….. BUT,
There was a nurse with her patient.
A Doc with his own patient.
Was this a med flight?
This flight sounds a very unusual set of circumstances though - it's often said that as doctors undertaking this type of work are statistically much more likely to have to help with another passenger than their own one!
And in view of the age comment above, Alicante is probably a more frequent destination for this kind of thing. Another one is Martinique - when cruise ships offload their sick bays regularly into the local hospital.
Feb 28, 2015, 5:34 am
#42
Join Date: May 2009
Location: London
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 2,741
Feb 28, 2015, 5:53 am
#44
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Taif, KSA
Programs: BA GGL, HH Diamond
Posts: 1,908
We also get yearly training in first aid and more advanced first aid/combat first aid etc
After 3 or 4 minutes of giving good CPR anyone will start to fatigue so its a good idea to have plenty of people to help out with it.
After 3 or 4 minutes of giving good CPR anyone will start to fatigue so its a good idea to have plenty of people to help out with it.
Feb 28, 2015, 6:06 am
#45
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,926
You need three cabin crew in a medical emergency that involves doing CPR.
One to do the compressions and one to hold the airway open and administer the breaths of air. (Ideally another to administer the shocks) the third one needs to liaise with the Flight Crew and keep them informed.
Doctors and nurses are great for prescribing, diagnosing and administering medication but believe it or not, most cabin crew are more used to practicing CPR and using a defibrillator than a lot of Doctors are.
One to do the compressions and one to hold the airway open and administer the breaths of air. (Ideally another to administer the shocks) the third one needs to liaise with the Flight Crew and keep them informed.
Doctors and nurses are great for prescribing, diagnosing and administering medication but believe it or not, most cabin crew are more used to practicing CPR and using a defibrillator than a lot of Doctors are.
Could this be the basis for improving the NHS? Sack all the doctors and let waitresses with a couple of hours first aid training do all the operations. Diagnoses could be self-done by Google.