What do you do when the passenger is quite overweight?
Mar 20, 2019, 5:06 pm
#91
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: New Orleans
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 655
Southwest has the most comprehensive, thoughtful and respectful policy for large customers - there's no shaming and no fee for an extra seat if needed. Part of their approach is quoted below:What is Southwest Airlines' policy for Customers of size?Customers who encroach upon any part of the neighboring seat(s) may proactively purchase the needed number of seats prior to travel in order to ensure the additional seat(s) is available. The armrest is considered to be the definitive boundary between seats; the width of the narrowest and widest passenger seats (in inches) is available on our Flying Southwest page. The purchase of additional seats serves as a notification to Southwest of a special seating need, and allows us to adequately plan for the number of seats that will be occupied on the aircraft. In turn, this helps to ensure we can accommodate all Customers on the flight/aircraft for which they purchased a ticket and avoid asking Customers to relinquish their seats for an unplanned accommodation. Most importantly, it ensures that all Customers onboard have access to safe and comfortable seating. You may contact us for a refund of the cost of additional seating after travel. Customers of size who prefer not to purchase an additional seat in advance have the option of purchasing just one seat and then discussing their seating needs with the Customer Service Agent at their departure gate. If it is determined that a second (or third) seat is needed, they will be accommodated with a complimentary additional seat.
Mar 20, 2019, 5:26 pm
#92
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: STL
Programs: Southwest A+/CP, Hilton Diamond, National Executive Elite
Posts: 170
You are missing the point, both the obesity epidemic and the narrowing airline seats are the side effects and results of the same capitalism system being unchecked and going off the rails. If the trends continue and we go with the attitude expressed above, in 5 years obesity will be at 50% of the population and airline seats will be 15 inches wide, and so on. The system is broken and needs to be fixed. Doug if he had his way there will be only one airline and would make all seats 10 inches wide and ask everybody to buy two, because that's what unregulated capitalism does.
Or like others have pointed out, fly Southwest (which I fly almost exclusively).
Mar 20, 2019, 5:42 pm
#93
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: SAN
Programs: AA CK, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 839
A few years back while flying Delta to France, I was seated in the second row of Economy and there was a lady POS in the center row of the bulkhead ahead of me with her two children and husband. She could not fit in the seat because the armrest would not go up. She was quite embarrassed and people were starring and the FA was pretty much ignoring the developing situation. She asked if anyone was willing to trade seats with them but no one volunteered. I offered her my seat and sat next to her children for the duration of the flight. The guy I had been seated next to in the second row was visibly pissed off with the switch. It’s hard to watch this situation unfold and not feel their pain. I honestly believe many people do not have a concept of their size and the size of an airline seat.
Mar 20, 2019, 5:52 pm
#94
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2014
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Posts: 11,668
The point of this thread is not the broader issues of unregulated capitalism or unregulated caloric consumption by Passengers of Size.
The question is what do you do when the passenger beside you is quite overweight and spills in to your seat. Anything else is just excusing POS for thinking their size, self-inflicted or not, entitles them to take up someone's else's space.
The question is what do you do when the passenger beside you is quite overweight and spills in to your seat. Anything else is just excusing POS for thinking their size, self-inflicted or not, entitles them to take up someone's else's space.
So, this is the issue. Instead of solving it efficiently themselves, AA and others have made it the passengers problem, to be dealt with on a case by case basis in the field. That's why we have this thread. AA only cares to get your money and have an on time departure, beyond that, adios and suck it up.
My proposed potential solutions are that (a) we need some systematic research to first understand the extend and aspects of the problem, if that doesn't exist already, (b) followed by consumer advocacy to push for passenger rights for free second seats (based on some criteria), and (c) consumer advocacy for regulating airplane seat sizes at the federal level. In the meantime, (d) the cabin crew may also need better training and corporate direction how to deal with issues (swift and discreet passenger re-accommodation, including using premium cabins for that purpose). At the individual micro level, (e) I guess you have to find the best and most discreet and reasonable solution for yourself. And (f) perhaps write in and complain to the airlines about improving the situation.
Mar 20, 2019, 5:58 pm
#95
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2014
Programs: Top Tier with all 3 alliances
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Southwest has the most comprehensive, thoughtful and respectful policy for large customers - there's no shaming and no fee for an extra seat if needed. Part of their approach is quoted below:What is Southwest Airlines' policy for Customers of size?Customers who encroach upon any part of the neighboring seat(s) may proactively purchase the needed number of seats prior to travel in order to ensure the additional seat(s) is available. The armrest is considered to be the definitive boundary between seats; the width of the narrowest and widest passenger seats (in inches) is available on our Flying Southwest page. The purchase of additional seats serves as a notification to Southwest of a special seating need, and allows us to adequately plan for the number of seats that will be occupied on the aircraft. In turn, this helps to ensure we can accommodate all Customers on the flight/aircraft for which they purchased a ticket and avoid asking Customers to relinquish their seats for an unplanned accommodation. Most importantly, it ensures that all Customers onboard have access to safe and comfortable seating. You may contact us for a refund of the cost of additional seating after travel. Customers of size who prefer not to purchase an additional seat in advance have the option of purchasing just one seat and then discussing their seating needs with the Customer Service Agent at their departure gate. If it is determined that a second (or third) seat is needed, they will be accommodated with a complimentary additional seat.
Mar 20, 2019, 6:06 pm
#96
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If this was actually the case, a capitalist market would likely bankrupt the airline by not flying it if forced to buy two 10" seats. Flying is not a right and never has been. There is nothing enshrined in law anywhere that guarantees someone the right to fly. If you don't like having to buy two seats, drive. If going overseas, be a decent person and buy two seats or a premium seat. I'm typically a kind and patient person but I've never put up with someone spilling half way into my seat largely due to the fact that I have a bad back. I can understand and frequently deal with some minor overflow, but you know who you are if you can't fit with the armrest down. I will not forego the full seat I paid for because you decided to flaunt the rules.
Or like others have pointed out, fly Southwest (which I fly almost exclusively).
Or like others have pointed out, fly Southwest (which I fly almost exclusively).
Flying is essentially a necessity in the US, given the distances.
Mar 20, 2019, 6:39 pm
#97
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Los Angeles& Telluride
Programs: UA1K, 1MM,AA Exec. Platinum, Global Entry, Nexus
Posts: 731
There are issues that deal with human emotions and in that vein nobody feels comfortable. Not the person who is over weight or the person that has the seat next to them. The prudent thing to do in my opinion is for the overweight person to buy two seats at a fair price. For as greedy as airlines are creating a fare bucket for this situation is an easy remedy and makes the situation more tenable for everyone involved. Flying is a privilege that we pay for. Airlines offer us a defined space to call ours during our journey, and we have a right to that space. Being sensitive to the needs of the overweight passenger is important as well as the needs of those affected by them. Gate agents can create a win win situation in these instances.
Mar 20, 2019, 6:46 pm
#98
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: STL
Programs: Southwest A+/CP, Hilton Diamond, National Executive Elite
Posts: 170
The relevance of my points is that there is a real problem that affects everybody, COS and everyone else, but the airline industry (see unregulated capitalism) does not deal with it properly (other than some bs unfair and ineffective guidelines that are not followed) and passes it on to the customer to deal with it during boarding and being seated. The airline guidelines for buying two seats are unfair and are not followed for the most part, I assume, and many COS are deterred from flying at all, I would guess, which is unfair. When the issues arise in the cabin it is awkward for everybody, nobody wants to deal with it, including the FAs, there is embarrassment, discomfort, concern about being ejected from the aircraft, etc. So the consumers are left to suck it up and deal with it on their own, for the most part.
So, this is the issue. Instead of solving it efficiently themselves, AA and others have made it the passengers problem, to be dealt with on a case by case basis in the field. That's why we have this thread. AA only cares to get your money and have an on time departure, beyond that, adios and suck it up.
My proposed potential solutions are that (a) we need some systematic research to first understand the extend and aspects of the problem, if that doesn't exist already, (b) followed by consumer advocacy to push for passenger rights for free second seats (based on some criteria), and (c) consumer advocacy for regulating airplane seat sizes at the federal level. In the meantime, (d) the cabin crew may also need better training and corporate direction how to deal with issues (swift and discreet passenger re-accommodation, including using premium cabins for that purpose). At the individual micro level, (e) I guess you have to find the best and most discreet and reasonable solution for yourself. And (f) perhaps write in and complain to the airlines about improving the situation.
So, this is the issue. Instead of solving it efficiently themselves, AA and others have made it the passengers problem, to be dealt with on a case by case basis in the field. That's why we have this thread. AA only cares to get your money and have an on time departure, beyond that, adios and suck it up.
My proposed potential solutions are that (a) we need some systematic research to first understand the extend and aspects of the problem, if that doesn't exist already, (b) followed by consumer advocacy to push for passenger rights for free second seats (based on some criteria), and (c) consumer advocacy for regulating airplane seat sizes at the federal level. In the meantime, (d) the cabin crew may also need better training and corporate direction how to deal with issues (swift and discreet passenger re-accommodation, including using premium cabins for that purpose). At the individual micro level, (e) I guess you have to find the best and most discreet and reasonable solution for yourself. And (f) perhaps write in and complain to the airlines about improving the situation.
Mar 20, 2019, 6:47 pm
#99
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: DCA/IAD
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Posts: 7,816
The relevance of my points is that there is a real problem that affects everybody, COS and everyone else, but the airline industry (see unregulated capitalism) does not deal with it properly (other than some bs unfair and ineffective guidelines that are not followed) and passes it on to the customer to deal with it during boarding and being seated. The airline guidelines for buying two seats are unfair and are not followed for the most part, I assume, and many COS are deterred from flying at all, I would guess, which is unfair. When the issues arise in the cabin it is awkward for everybody, nobody wants to deal with it, including the FAs, there is embarrassment, discomfort, concern about being ejected from the aircraft, etc. So the consumers are left to suck it up and deal with it on their own, for the most part.
What is next? Baggage of Size (BOS) must be free? Meals of size (MOS) must be free? Sodas of size (SOS) must be free? Liquor of size (LOS) must be free?
Oversized vehicle loads pay excess road fees. Plus sized clothing is priced at price points higher than regular sized clothing. Are we going now to insist that a size 24 dress be priced the same as a size 2 dress?
Mar 20, 2019, 7:00 pm
#100
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: ORD
Programs: US Air, UA BA LH AI DELTA MARRIOTT CHOICE SGP
Posts: 9,883
Wow...just wow. I can't believe that you would ask someone who CLEARLY is overweight to "contain themselves". I can't imagine how embarrassing requesting a seatbelt extension or being told you're too big to fit. I understand obesity is possible to control and sometimes it isn't. If "normal" sized people on here bellyache and complain about how uncomfortable flying is, how bad must it be for a COS. They obviously don't try to purposefully invade your space. It's uptight and inconsiderate people like you who make people feel like they need to apologize for everything they often can't control when flying and ultimately makes flying uncomfortable and almost traumatic.
This PC business of being empathetic for ANY & ALL for ANY reason is just a guilt trip you lay on people so you can continue to enjoy your lives at other's expense.
If they have to travel why can't they purchase two seats ?
Upon reflecting on this I for reasons think that the airline should be required to provide two adjacent seats for the price of one (second seat free), for customers above certain size. There has to be some ADA type of accommodation. What is happening now is not fair to either COS or other passengers.
Can I get an accommodation because I am allergic to various smells from people, clothes , perfumes etc ? I absolutely hate pigs and yet I read of a support pig ...I would do a voluntary DB. because I can't even stand the sight of a pig.
Mar 20, 2019, 7:10 pm
#101
Join Date: Oct 2018
Programs: BAEC Silver, HHonors Diamond, Marriott Gold, IHG Spire, Caesars Diamond
Posts: 83
I hope they feel like a pos for making someone else suffer in agony for weeks after a flight due to 1. not being able to sit in their seat and having to squat sideways leaning over the aisle armrest 2. not being allowed out of their seat due to turbulence for most of the flight. I totally get why airlines have rules but in practice don't enforce them. I always fly domestic first in the US now or just don't fly because of experiences like that when we couldn't afford to do otherwise. Why make one of the many 'first class monetisation' benefits to airlines go away by actually stopping people too fkn huge for their seat from ruining flights for others.
Mar 20, 2019, 7:13 pm
#102
Join Date: Oct 2018
Programs: BAEC Silver, HHonors Diamond, Marriott Gold, IHG Spire, Caesars Diamond
Posts: 83
It doesn't matter, body shape and size is to a significant extend out of people's control and likely complex and multifactorial (genetics, medical, lack of access to right food, SES, rearing, advertising, etc.). This is access to basic transportation and should not be conditional and discriminatory. At the same time there has to be better public policy to prevent and address the obesity issue more systemically.
Mar 20, 2019, 7:25 pm
#103
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Location: Ontario, Canada
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Life is not fair, and it never will be. If you want to be dealt with discreetly, buy two seats. If you want comfort, buy two seats. If you want a few wide seats added to each plane, where does it stop? How many? Who gets them? Essentially you should pay for the two seats it displaces. What you're asking for in the bold portion above is insane. If anything, the person being displaced should be moved up front, and NOT the COS flaunting the rules. Air travel is less than comfortable for 99% of the population, deal with it like everyone else.
I have little interest in timidly cooperating with an FA who attempts to relocate me to a lesser location from a seat I pre-selected and paid extra for simply to accommodate a POS. If I didn't pre-select then I will grudgingly accept a move to seat where I'm not being encroached upon. If there are no available seats any suggestion that I leave the aircraft instead of the POS will be met with polite but resolute non-compliance until they opt for a different course of action.
The reason POS don't book a second seat and the airlines don't enforce their POS policy is IMO because too many people fret about confrontation and acquiesce to having half their seat being taken over.
Mar 20, 2019, 7:53 pm
#104
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2014
Programs: Top Tier with all 3 alliances
Posts: 11,668
Life is not fair, and it never will be. If you want to be dealt with discreetly, buy two seats. If you want comfort, buy two seats. If you want a few wide seats added to each plane, where does it stop? How many? Who gets them? Essentially you should pay for the two seats it displaces. What you're asking for in the bold portion above is insane. If anything, the person being displaced should be moved up front, and NOT the COS flaunting the rules. Air travel is less than comfortable for 99% of the population, deal with it like everyone else.
Mar 20, 2019, 8:01 pm
#105
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 612
I’m a big boy at 6’0. 300 lbs. on southwest it works great at not having even skinny people sit next to me. I can fully contain myself and do not need an extender butbwhen I spread my legs and lean back people keep on walking.