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-   -   AA A321T 3 class Flagship 2x a day BOS-LAX 2 Apr - 5 Sep 2019 (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/american-airlines-aadvantage/1942980-aa-a321t-3-class-flagship-2x-day-bos-lax-2-apr-5-sep-2019-a.html)

MarkOK Sep 9, 2019 4:17 pm


Originally Posted by Antarius (Post 31506451)
The 772 has 37 J seats. Same issue - there is no way AA sells even half of that. It would be upgrade paradise though.

IMO, AA needs a subfleet of transcon 321s/737 MAX, that fit in between the domestic fleet and the 321T. 16 lay flats.

I'd argue that a subfleet with a larger and enhanced front cabin also be used for midcons on the handful of elite heavy/high business travel routes where domestic F sells well (i.e. DFW-BOS, DFW-JFK, DFW-DCA come to mind). But now we are just dreaming, and the more variants there are the more difficult for AA to manage....

DWFI Sep 9, 2019 8:46 pm


Originally Posted by Antarius (Post 31506451)
The 772 has 37 J seats. Same issue - there is no way AA sells even half of that. It would be upgrade paradise though.

IMO, AA needs a subfleet of transcon 321s/737 MAX, that fit in between the domestic fleet and the 321T. 16 lay flats.

Exactly. The data is clear - the paid J demand (and willingness to pay) is massively higher on NYC-LAX/SFO than any other route. The 321T is simply not viable anywhere but those two routes, and even SFO is marginal. AA's paid J yields are in the trash on BOS-LAX since UA joined B6 in being all flatbed, but there is simply no easy solution.

ralphs Sep 16, 2019 8:38 am

How are these other airlines making money where AA can't?

upinsmoke Sep 16, 2019 8:52 am


Originally Posted by DWFI (Post 31508649)
Exactly. The data is clear - the paid J demand (and willingness to pay) is massively higher on NYC-LAX/SFO than any other route. The 321T is simply not viable anywhere but those two routes, and even SFO is marginal. AA's paid J yields are in the trash on BOS-LAX since UA joined B6 in being all flatbed, but there is simply no easy solution.

There's plenty of paid J business on the BOS-LAX route, and good yields if the plane has flat bed. B6 and UA are not having a problem with it. The issue is that there isn't the paid F (three class) demand to fill the 321T.

AA needs to either get more 2-class planes with flat bed in J to serve this route, or sell the F cabin as J on the 321T for non NYC-LAX routes, so that they don't have a third of the plane going empty. Right now they are not competitive. Why would you book J BOS-LAX with the A321 or B737 "recliners" when you are guaranteed a flat bed on B6 and UA?

DWFI Sep 16, 2019 10:21 am


Originally Posted by upinsmoke (Post 31530541)
There's plenty of paid J business on the BOS-LAX route, and good yields if the plane has flat bed. B6 and UA are not having a problem with it. The issue is that there isn't the paid F (three class) demand to fill the 321T.

Disagree. I routinely buy Mint and UA biz for $400-$620 one way. I can assure you that filling the A321T's J cabin at $600 apiece (even if you are able to sell all the seats, which is certainly not a guarantee) is not going to be a profitable endeavor by any means. Those 20 J seats take the place of 72 Y seats on the non transcon A321.

mesadler Dec 10, 2019 11:33 am

Need to fly LAX-BOS on 1/29. Never fly this route. None of the 3 flights are listed as a A321T and there's no Biz available. Was the 3-class discontinued?

AANYC1981 Dec 10, 2019 11:47 am


Originally Posted by mesadler (Post 31825981)
Need to fly LAX-BOS on 1/29. Never fly this route. None of the 3 flights are listed as a A321T and there's no Biz available. Was the 3-class discontinued?

yup!

donotblink Dec 10, 2019 11:52 am

They could put 757s or 767s on this route. I wonder why they don't do that.

AANYC1981 Dec 10, 2019 12:08 pm


Originally Posted by donotblink (Post 31826054)
They could put 757s or 767s on this route. I wonder why they don't do that.

They're too busy ripping out the IFE on 737's and Oasis :/

teemuflyer Dec 10, 2019 12:39 pm


Originally Posted by mesadler (Post 31825981)
Need to fly LAX-BOS on 1/29. Never fly this route. None of the 3 flights are listed as a A321T and there's no Biz available. Was the 3-class discontinued?

You do have the option to fly through JFK on route to BOS if you're really keen on the 321T.. It'll just cost you a pretty penny and by no means optimal.

mesadler Dec 10, 2019 3:35 pm

No real reason to. Just was looking for it.

Antarius Dec 10, 2019 6:51 pm


Originally Posted by donotblink (Post 31826054)
They could put 757s or 767s on this route. I wonder why they don't do that.

Not enough of them. The 757s have gone back to covering routes that the MAX8 was slated to take over. AA is also launching intl routes like none other, so just not enough fleet slack.

Long term, they do need a 757 replacement such as a 321neo or 737MAX10 with lie flats to compete on such routes with DL and B6

VFR Dec 10, 2019 7:16 pm

JetBlue has 34 Mint A321ceos that they seem to make money on transcons. It seems like there might be some money to be made with a 16J lie flat configuration on "semi-premium" transcons like BOS-LAX, LAX-DCA, maybe JFK-SFO on some days due to less demand for F.

Ty Vil Dec 13, 2019 2:17 pm


Originally Posted by stc (Post 31507951)
Matbe AA shouldn't have let all those ex-TWA 757s to go to DL. They seem to be working well for Delta after the upgrades Delta did.

The TWA fleet used P&W engines as does Delta/UA - AA's fleet always has used RR. Those planes were eliminated to keep a common engine type.

AANYC1981 Dec 13, 2019 2:56 pm


Originally Posted by Ty Vil (Post 31837308)
The TWA fleet used P&W engines as does Delta/UA - AA's fleet always has used RR. Those planes were eliminated to keep a common engine type.

Simplicity versus strategic thinking....seems to be how AA operates these days.


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