controller1

SOBE ER DOC

This is not luggage, it's an ambulatory assistive devise, one that is medically-necessary to reduce the risk of falls which, for older persons, can cause intracranial bleeding, a broken neck, fractured pelvis or a broken hip, all of which can easily cause death in this age group. This is not like delaying the delivery of someone's underwear, this is a big deal.

Airlines have figured out through a series of process improvements, checklists and inspections to reduce aviation disaster to almost zero, yet they can't figure out how to get an item left on the jet bridge from said location to a destination a couple of hundred feet away and into cargo. Seriously, this is not brain surgery. It is just sloppiness and a general lack of concern for how their inability to do their job properly can inconvenience or potentially harmful.

GeezerCouple

Thank you for emphasizing that this is not just a matter of convenience or just "wanting to keep a possession nearby", or ... risking needing to purchase new undies... or whatever...

Many people fight like crazy to avoid using a walker, and thus by the time they are in fact using one, they are usually needed very much.

MIL, almost 100, had kept fighting it, refusing to use a walker. And then she fell... and cracked her neck.
Thank goodness it was much less serious than it sounded, but she isn't the same and never will be. But it certainly could have been fatal.
Now, she doesn't dare take a single step without her walker, although she still hates that she needs to use it.

GC

txpenny

My mother was in this category up until about 3 months ago, when she gave it. I had a bad feeling when she did give in, and sure enough, she passed 3 weeks ago at 90. Sorry for your troubles with AA.

On a side note, I need to stop watching The Walking Dead. From the thread title, I thought this topic was going to be about something entirely different.

Dave Noble

It was checked in and therefore was still luggage - errors loading luggage do happen - it is not a unique situation

It is a not a good thing when it happens, but there is nothing outstandingl bad or shocking when it happens ( ie egregious )

GeezerCouple

I think the main problem being referred to is not "what happened to something that was checked", but rather... that the airline crew insisted that the item needed to be checked.

There's certainly no hint that any effort was made to see if it fit in the closet. It would be a very rare "walker" that would not fit the dimensions given for such equipment. Wheelchairs typically fold up much larger in all three dimensions than a walker. A "basket", which is almost always removable (always?), might make the folded item "too fat", but not all baskets. But then it would be removed. And not all walkers have such attachments anyway.

GC

dls25

L-US narrowbodies do not have closets...

SOBE ER DOC

I think if it was your mobility device that was not loaded you might disagree. Think of it this way...someone is forced to gate check their wheelchair. When they arrive at their destination the wheelchair is not there...left at the originating airport by the airline. How is that person supposed to get around, crawl up the jet bridge? I'm sorry you don't see it the same way, but it is egregious. The airline is impacting their mobility, impacting their dignity. I think it's important that people understand how something that those of us who are fully mobile might not think is a big deal can be huge for people who are not fully mobile. I think for any of us, if this were one of our family members we'd be blowing a gasket.

I will go back to my earlier comments, to me an airline employee's error that has the potential to cause harm or death to a passenger as a result of a preventable fall is egregious. It is as egregious as pushing someone like this down to the ground. I'm not saying that the airline should fork over tons of freebies for the error but their ground crews should understand the seriousness of the situation.

Dave Noble

Was the item within AA's designated carry on size limits?

If yes, then indeed it should have been allowed onboard - if not, then whether it fitted in the closet seems to be irrelevant - there seems to be no exclusion to the max size requirements

GeezerCouple

Correct, and we agree with you that IF it doesn't fit in the closet, then it must be gate checked.

However, IF there was a closet on board (and we aren't familiar with the aircraft, and don't remember if it was given above), then I'd be very hard pressed to find a folding walker (most are) that would *not* fit the dimensions specified.

Now, we don't know if there were perhaps other wheelchairs/walkers, which would obviously cause some difficulties.

And in that case, the "get the gate checked assistive device on board and handle it properly", etc., certainly does kick in.

But the description of how it was handled prior to/at boarding strongly suggests that it was NOT handled properly. "It isn't allowed" or "It MUST be checked", etc., is not a proper explanation.
(The above assumes it was an aircraft with a closet; other wise the "handle it properly" kicks in!)

GC

Dave Noble

No , we don't agree

If the collapsed item was within 56 x 36 x 23 cm / 22 x 14 x 9 in , then it should have been allowed on and given priority

If it was outside any one or more of those dimensions, then it looks like it is required to be checked in. There was nothing posted from the rules, that stated that the items can exceed carry on alowance size

Whether it could fit in a cupboard is irrelevant if it is not permitted onboard

GeezerCouple

Sorry, I *meant* by "fit" that the dimensions matched the required ones stated for items to be put in the closet.
That's all.

Sorry if I didn't state that clearly enough.

GC

richarddd

As a carrier, you must ensure that there is priority space (i.e., a closet, or a row of seats where a wheelchair may be strapped using a strap kit that complies with applicable Federal Aviation Administration or applicable foreign government regulations on the stowage of cargo in the cabin compartment) in the cabin of sufficient size to stow at least one typical adult-sized folding, collapsible, or break-down manual passenger wheelchair, the dimensions of which are 13 inches by 36 inches by 42 inches or less without having to remove the wheels or otherwise disassemble it. This section applies to any aircraft with 100 or more passenger seats and this space must be other than the overhead compartments and under-seat spaces routinely used for passengers' carry-on items.
https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-id...se14.4.382_167
The sections cited in my post above provide that this applies to walkers as well as wheelchairs.

JDiver

AA and all other US-based Airlines must comply with the Air Carrier Access Act (Title 14 CFR Part 382), an Act of Congress. Arguing about whether an airline will comply or charge extra to do so is useless, off topic and demeaning to those who must use assistive devices.

Posts that meet the definitions above, as well as some direct replies, have been removed.

Moderator