Mar 30, 2014, 12:53 pm
Last edit by: JDiver
WIKI POST: Using US Dividend Miles for oneworld Award Flights
As further details become available, please fill in this wikipost.
As further details become available, please fill in this wikipost.
N.B. Booking opportunities for new Dividend Miles awards of all kinds ended 11:59 PM Wednesday, 25 March 2015. Please continue using this thread for trips booked or in progress through 24 March 2016.
Changes on USDM oneworld award tickets
This is the only official statement about changing issued USDM award tickets:
If I need to make changes to a Dividend Miles award reservation, which program’s rules will apply?
Minor changes such as date/time can be made provided seats are available without requiring a new award to be claimed. More substantive changes such as changes to stopovers or origin/destination may result in the need to reinstate the previously claimed Dividend Miles award, then claiming a new AAdvantage award under the existing AAdvantage program rules.
The old membership rules do 'generally' still appy to USDM tickets.
For awards ticketed / reticketed on 001- ticket stock, go to the AA Refunds site with your ticket number at hand (unsure if it works with 037- stock at this time)to:
- Print a receipt with ticket number (instead of Request a refund)
- See total fees, taxes, etc. attached to your ticket
- See applicable detailed fare rules
- Request a refund (may not be useful for awards)
- Some were able to change their ticket without beeing charged the USD 150.- changing fee.
- No chance to change a ticket after the first flight segment has been flown.
- ...
Old stuff
oneworld member airlines - airberlin, American Airlines, British Airways, Cathay Pacific, Finnair, Iberia, Japan Airlines, LAN, Malaysia Airlines, Qantas, Qatar Airways, Royal Jordanian, S7 Airlines (Sibir), SriLankan Airlines, TAM Airlines, US Airways and their affiliates.
Award Chart for oneworld awards using US Dividend Miles:
http://shopping.usairways.com/en-US/...wardtravel.pdf
You can use the American Airlines, British Airways, JAL, or Qantas sites to search for oneworld award inventory. AA and QF also allows you to search for award inventory using a handy 30 day calendar view. However, availability on the calendar is dependent on site coverage (e.g. QF does not include JL or MH, AA does not include CX and others). Also, the calendar view may not be completely accurate on all partners, so use it as a guide but do not rely on it fully.
One of the easiest ways to search for oneworld availability is through the use of an outside tool such as Award Nexus, ExpertFlyer, KVS Tool, or The Wandering Aramean oneworld Search.
Award Nexus has a free community membership for flyertalk members, and award email alert with premium membership. ExpertFlyer has email alerts and direct GDS access to select oneworld award inventories, such as AA, QF, and US. ExpertFlyer can also search J class certificate upgrade inventory. With KVS Tool, you can search QF, BA, JL and CX's search engines, in addition to other alliances, on your PC (Mac / Linux with CrossOver). You can also set up an alert via The Wandering Aramean oneworld Search. This tool will automatically search on QF for your alert once per day with a free account and four times per day with a paid account.
N.B. With all of the above tools, it is best to search one segment at a time. Most oneworld search engines have difficulty marrying segments.
For route searching with itinerary information, use the interactive oneworld map and timetable.
For searching Intra-North America availability, the best tool is AA.com. Unlike the other oneworld engines, AA is pretty good at marrying segments, so you can search origin to destination.
Regarding availability, the strategy that has been most effective for people looking to book award travel on oneworld is to start searching right at 330 days prior to departure. This is generally when availability is at its best. After that, availability tends to be sporadic until starting 8 weeks prior to departure where some airlines open up availability, and will vary all the way up until the day of departure.
If you're having trouble finding availability, it may be best to look at alternate airports (JL, for example, serves SAN, YVR, and BOS, in addition to the larger markets of SFO, LAX, YYZ, ORD, and JFK).
(N.B. Although US was not adding fuel surcharges to awards, there are reports that they have started doing this for awards containing BA flights.) With the exception of BA & IB, no oneworld carriers require you to pay a fuel surcharge for awards. With BA, be aware that you may have to pay both a fuel surcharge as well as the UK Air Passenger Duty departure tax for intercontinental J and F flights out of UK. These fees vary with class of service and length of flight and are determined by BA; the Air Passenger Duty (see specific thread) is due for all UK departures not under 24 hour connecting flights. APD applies to coach tickets, too, but at a reduced rate. The fuel /YQ surcharge with IB is generally considered minimal.
Known Problems / Workaround:
- Dep 00:00AM : Some agents have difficulty finding flights leaving between midnight and 2 AM. This is because the US systems show it leaving the day before. If the agent cannot find it, please ask to look at the day before. > source <
- LA : Flights put on hold will be cancelled after 24h. Workaround: Issue the ticket immediately. > source <
- JL : US Rep cannot find available seats. Workaround: "Always have to remind Rep to open JL reservations on a new screen". > source <
- MH : US Rep cannot find awards in First Class. Workaround: First class needs to be booked in P-cl instead of Z-cl (as on most other OW carriers). > source < booking classes: > KVS <
- All : If you are booking outbound flights at the US Air 335 day window US Air will often allow you to put your reservation on a longer than 3 day hold to capture the return seats once they open up at T+335. There is a report of this for 30 days here, and FT user beofotch was successful in getting a 13 day hold here. Workaround: Huaca until you get an agent who is competent enough to do this. It may help to act naive and ask for your return flight on your preferred date even if it is after T+335 days. Once they get an error from the computer may be a good time to bring it up.
- ...
Fixed Problems:
- CX : US Rep cannot find seats on flight CX 645 HKG-DOH. Workaround: none so far, search for different routing/carrier (CMB/DXB/...?)... > source < > fixed <
> fixed < - CX : US Rep cannot find seats on flight CX 640 DOH-HKG. They admit, the flight exists, but are unable to book <source>. Workaround: none so far, search for different routing/carrier
> fixed < - BA/Comair : US rep could not see / or unable to book intra-South Africa flights in BA flight number operated by Comair despite AA treats Comair a full fledged oneworld member under BA, in the same context as KA under CX. Only one reported success booking - poster reported agent had trouble at first but on consulting a supervisor was told "where to look"; the agent did not give any further information. Most everyone else reported unable to book Comair flights.
> fixed < - IB : Flights will be cancelled after ticket issued. Workaround: None yet... > source <
> fixed <
LUS: USDM oneworld Award Bookings - (Closed to new bookings) [Master FAQ and Help]
Jan 5, 2015, 6:27 am
#2956
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: A hotel near a major airport
Programs: SPG Platinum . Hyatt Diamond . Delta Diamond . All kinds of car rental statuses
Posts: 464
I want to get from Tokyo to London
round trip.
I've done this before using US miles
once was via HKG in CX 1st
and the other time was direct on JAL 1st
I'm wondering if it might be possible to stretch-out out the routing "a bit"
JAL flies its new 1st class cabin to Jakarta
Could I book
nrt-cgk-hkg-lhr as the outbound?
round trip.
I've done this before using US miles
once was via HKG in CX 1st
and the other time was direct on JAL 1st
I'm wondering if it might be possible to stretch-out out the routing "a bit"
JAL flies its new 1st class cabin to Jakarta
Could I book
nrt-cgk-hkg-lhr as the outbound?
Jan 5, 2015, 9:54 am
#2957
Formerly known as jlars77
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: ORD
Posts: 361
I want to get from Tokyo to London
round trip.
I've done this before using US miles
once was via HKG in CX 1st
and the other time was direct on JAL 1st
I'm wondering if it might be possible to stretch-out out the routing "a bit"
JAL flies its new 1st class cabin to Jakarta
Could I book
nrt-cgk-hkg-lhr as the outbound?
round trip.
I've done this before using US miles
once was via HKG in CX 1st
and the other time was direct on JAL 1st
I'm wondering if it might be possible to stretch-out out the routing "a bit"
JAL flies its new 1st class cabin to Jakarta
Could I book
nrt-cgk-hkg-lhr as the outbound?
Jan 5, 2015, 10:16 am
#2958
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: SUX
Programs: BA Silver; HHonors Gold; SPG Gold; Points but dirt with everyone else
Posts: 8,050
Overcharged YQ
I feel like someone around here has some experience that they might be able to share. I think I've been overcharged YQ on an award, but after spending forever on hold to get an agent and then forever on hold while my agent went to the rates desk (1h11min phone call), I didn't want to argue today.
Here's what I've got:
DCA-AA-JFK-CX-HKG-CX-KUL-MH-DPS in business (and domestic first)
HKG-CX-LHR-BA-IAD (first)
The YQ when I look at my ticket on the Saudia site is $414, but on a revenue booking for LHR-IAD, it's only $245. I could have come back over the Pacific with CX, but this option saves me two nights of hotels and gets me home earlier, so it was worth the extra $300 (once you factor in the UK PSC and additional US taxes since the ticket is no longer free) I was expecting. Tack on another $169, and I'm less pleased. Any tips on going about getting them to re-evaluate the YQ and refund my money? Ideally, I'd like to send in an email and have someone competent review it, rather than waiting on hold forever to get someone who puts me on hold again.
Here's what I've got:
DCA-AA-JFK-CX-HKG-CX-KUL-MH-DPS in business (and domestic first)
HKG-CX-LHR-BA-IAD (first)
The YQ when I look at my ticket on the Saudia site is $414, but on a revenue booking for LHR-IAD, it's only $245. I could have come back over the Pacific with CX, but this option saves me two nights of hotels and gets me home earlier, so it was worth the extra $300 (once you factor in the UK PSC and additional US taxes since the ticket is no longer free) I was expecting. Tack on another $169, and I'm less pleased. Any tips on going about getting them to re-evaluate the YQ and refund my money? Ideally, I'd like to send in an email and have someone competent review it, rather than waiting on hold forever to get someone who puts me on hold again.
Last edited by mtkeller; Jan 5, 2015 at 11:05 am Reason: Fix numbers
Jan 5, 2015, 10:25 am
#2959
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: ZRH/SFO
Programs: A3*G - AZ CFP- HH DIA
Posts: 3,666
Try it out. The routing is not the most direct way but it fits within the MPM:
[KVS Tool 7.7.2 - Reference: Maximum Permitted Mileage [MPM]: NRT-CGK-HKG-LHR]
[KVS Tool 7.7.2 - Reference: Maximum Permitted Mileage [MPM]: NRT-CGK-HKG-LHR]
Code:
CTY DC TPM CUM MPM DC SUR HGL LWL 25M XTRA TYO 3 JKT 3 EH 3612 3612 4334 EH 0M 722 0 5417 0 HKG 3 EH 2029 5641 2187 EH EXC 0 2908 2733 0 LON 2 EH 5965 11606 9760 EH 20M 106 382 12200 0
Jan 5, 2015, 5:26 pm
#2960
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 117
The change issue has been addressed in that after departiure, no changes permitted at all
There is pretty much close to zero chance that the itinerary will be permitted anyway
The MPM for SFO-SYD ( with 25% over ) is 11138 miles and LAX-SYD is 11,242
SYD-LHR is 10,573 on its own and LHR-LAX is 5456 miles fpr 16,029 miles ( 42% over the allowed distance )
There is pretty much close to zero chance that the itinerary will be permitted anyway
The MPM for SFO-SYD ( with 25% over ) is 11138 miles and LAX-SYD is 11,242
SYD-LHR is 10,573 on its own and LHR-LAX is 5456 miles fpr 16,029 miles ( 42% over the allowed distance )
For example, LAX-SYD (MPM) SYD->LHR (MPM) LHR->LAX (MPM) and each leg is subject to its own MPM's?
Trying right now with LAX->HKG->MEL as I believe that is just under the MPM+25%
When I have asked about LAX->SYD->DXB->LHR->LAX no one seems to flinch and they proceed with giving me the taxes and miles expense. Once you get the taxes are you pretty much home free? When I do the other bookings it looks like they hit some sort of real limit, and almost always reference that you can't go to HKG on the way from LAX->SYD because of the MPM
Jan 5, 2015, 5:53 pm
#2961
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,605
The MPM is based on the 1 way journey - not just to a stopover point
Trying to go to the West coast of USA from Australia via Europe I would be very surprised if actually manage to get to the final stage of actually getting a ticket number
Trying to go to the West coast of USA from Australia via Europe I would be very surprised if actually manage to get to the final stage of actually getting a ticket number
Jan 5, 2015, 6:16 pm
#2962
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: AU
Programs: former Olympic Airways Gold (yeah - still proud of that!)
Posts: 14,406
almost... once they accept your payment (ie ticket) you are home free!
If you book, get the taxes and fees, but put it on hold, when you call back they can void the itinerary if it doesn't comply with the rules.
If you think you might be pushing the limits on a routing, always best to ticket there and then rather than put it on hold.
If you book, get the taxes and fees, but put it on hold, when you call back they can void the itinerary if it doesn't comply with the rules.
If you think you might be pushing the limits on a routing, always best to ticket there and then rather than put it on hold.
Jan 5, 2015, 6:36 pm
#2963
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 117
So they wouldn't give me the taxes on LAX->HKG->MEL->DXB->LHR->LAX but they DID give me the taxes on LAX->NRT->SYD->DXB->LHR->LAX without any problems.
Jan 5, 2015, 6:41 pm
#2964
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,605
What matters is whether it actually gets to be ticketed. Even though taxes may price, it doesn't mean that when the agent attempts to validate the itinerary before ticketing that your excessive mileage will not be addressed
Your scam might work and it might get ticketed, but I would still be surprised if it does
On last few awards I have had issued, before taking payment, the agent has gone through the itinerary to validate it
Once payment is confirmed and a ticket number given is the point where can be sure it is ok
Your scam might work and it might get ticketed, but I would still be surprised if it does
On last few awards I have had issued, before taking payment, the agent has gone through the itinerary to validate it
Once payment is confirmed and a ticket number given is the point where can be sure it is ok
Last edited by Dave Noble; Jan 5, 2015 at 6:53 pm
Jan 5, 2015, 6:53 pm
#2965
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 117
What matters is whether it actually gets to be ticketed. Even though taxes may price, it doesn't mean that when the agent attempts to validate the itinerary before ticketing that your excessive mileage will not be addressed
Your scam might work and it might get ticketed, but I would still be surprised if it does
On last few awards I have had issued, before taking payment, the agent has gone through the itinerary to validate it
Your scam might work and it might get ticketed, but I would still be surprised if it does
On last few awards I have had issued, before taking payment, the agent has gone through the itinerary to validate it
Either way though, point taken. It doesn't mean anything until it is ticketed.
Jan 5, 2015, 6:56 pm
#2966
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,605
I am not really trying to scam it, but if there is a way they will allow it I certainly want to do it. I've spoke with supervisors that said that going through London wasn't a problem but going through HK is. Then I spoke with supervisors that said going through HK isn't a problem but going through Hawaii is. It is obviously a mess over there, but if they will allow a ticketing I want to do it in the best way possible.
Either way though, point taken. It doesn't mean anything until it is ticketed.
Either way though, point taken. It doesn't mean anything until it is ticketed.
Jan 6, 2015, 3:40 am
#2967
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: YYZ-HKT-CWL
Programs: aeroplan E .HH.
Posts: 994
2nd F award booked 59 mins on Skype
Just booked (37 mins on Skype from BKK). Yyz-lhr BA F,lhr-man BA Biz, Stop. lhr-Hnd JL F, Hnd-Gmp JL Biz, dest. ICn-Hkg CX Biz,HKg -Jfk CX F , Jfk-Yyz AA biz, 120,000 miles $853 tax n Paid BA ££. cos no flights to Europe By the way just in Bkk after amazing CX 846 in F from Jfk Flew throu New Year on 'Krug' 5 hours in the Wing Hkg made up for aircraft switch to Bkk with no F cabin of offer of compensation
Jan 6, 2015, 4:38 am
#2968
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: A hotel near a major airport
Programs: SPG Platinum . Hyatt Diamond . Delta Diamond . All kinds of car rental statuses
Posts: 464
Try it out. The routing is not the most direct way but it fits within the MPM:
[KVS Tool 7.7.2 - Reference: Maximum Permitted Mileage [MPM]: NRT-CGK-HKG-LHR]
[KVS Tool 7.7.2 - Reference: Maximum Permitted Mileage [MPM]: NRT-CGK-HKG-LHR]
Code:
CTY DC TPM CUM MPM DC SUR HGL LWL 25M XTRA TYO 3 JKT 3 EH 3612 3612 4334 EH 0M 722 0 5417 0 HKG 3 EH 2029 5641 2187 EH EXC 0 2908 2733 0 LON 2 EH 5965 11606 9760 EH 20M 106 382 12200 0
Jan 6, 2015, 4:02 pm
#2969
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 117
What if, we were instead to do SYD->LHR->LAX->SYD (the same essential trip, but using SYD as the starting point and LHR/Europe as the destination)? Since the distance between SYD and LHR is over 10k miles, then that whole routing would (should) work without any issues right? Not scamming, or bending the rules at all?
If thats the case, it might be a bit easier for us (only 10k points more according to their chart), although I would have preferred leaving from LAX (even if we just have to pay the extra 10k points somehow) it wouldn't be the end of the world.
Thanks again
Jan 6, 2015, 4:11 pm
#2970
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,605
Again, I am not fully familiar with what is actually acceptable as far as the rules on this, but it sounds like the MPM has a lot to do with it.
What if, we were instead to do SYD->LHR->LAX->SYD (the same essential trip, but using SYD as the starting point and LHR/Europe as the destination)? Since the distance between SYD and LHR is over 10k miles, then that whole routing would (should) work without any issues right? Not scamming, or bending the rules at all?
If thats the case, it might be a bit easier for us (only 10k points more according to their chart), although I would have preferred leaving from LAX (even if we just have to pay the extra 10k points somehow) it wouldn't be the end of the world.
Thanks again
What if, we were instead to do SYD->LHR->LAX->SYD (the same essential trip, but using SYD as the starting point and LHR/Europe as the destination)? Since the distance between SYD and LHR is over 10k miles, then that whole routing would (should) work without any issues right? Not scamming, or bending the rules at all?
If thats the case, it might be a bit easier for us (only 10k points more according to their chart), although I would have preferred leaving from LAX (even if we just have to pay the extra 10k points somehow) it wouldn't be the end of the world.
Thanks again
travel between Australia-Europe is not permitted via North America though - but there is more of a chance of that being missed than MPM
Originally Posted by membership guide
Award travel is permitted when the distance in one direction does not exceed the maximum mileage allowed between the origin and destination.
Certain itineraries are subject to mileage restrictions.
Travel between North America to Europe is not allowed via Asia, and travel between Europe and Japan/North Asia/South Asia/Australia/New Zealand is not permitted via North America.
Certain itineraries are subject to mileage restrictions.
Travel between North America to Europe is not allowed via Asia, and travel between Europe and Japan/North Asia/South Asia/Australia/New Zealand is not permitted via North America.
Last edited by Dave Noble; Jan 6, 2015 at 4:16 pm