AS at Dallas Love Field (DAL)
Jan 20, 2019, 6:34 pm
#61
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Apparently there are some additional court filings that occurred Friday in the three-way fight at Love Field, with Alaska and Delta responding to the City's proposal to use Alaska gates to accommodate Delta.
See this article:
https://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/n...est-delta.html
The city's November idea
This ordeal started years ago when Southwest Airlines Co. (NYSE: LUV) took over two gates from United Continental Holdings, Inc. (NYSE: UAL), giving Southwest 18 of the 20 gates at Love Field.Delta had an agreement with United to fly five daily flights back to its hub in Atlanta. When Southwest took over the gates, it tried to boot Delta off.Delta refused to leave.
Also, Delta wanted to add eight more flights out of Love Field. Fearing retaliation from whatever side ended up losing the dispute, the city of Dallas sued all the airlines involved and asked the court to decide what to do.In November, Alaska was dragged into this case in a major way.In an attempt to accommodate Delta's request for eight more flights, the city looked at the flight schedules of both Southwest and Alaska. Southwest recently started averaging nearly 11 flights a day out of its 18 gates.
Alaska, however, operated only 6.5 flights a day at its two gates on average.Therefore, the city reasoned, Delta's eight additional flights could be flown on Alaska's gates because the Seattle airline had time gaps in its schedule.The city added that an Alaska representative was deposed on Sept. 28 and stated the airline had no expansion plans at Love Field for the "foreseeable future."
This ordeal started years ago when Southwest Airlines Co. (NYSE: LUV) took over two gates from United Continental Holdings, Inc. (NYSE: UAL), giving Southwest 18 of the 20 gates at Love Field.Delta had an agreement with United to fly five daily flights back to its hub in Atlanta. When Southwest took over the gates, it tried to boot Delta off.Delta refused to leave.
Also, Delta wanted to add eight more flights out of Love Field. Fearing retaliation from whatever side ended up losing the dispute, the city of Dallas sued all the airlines involved and asked the court to decide what to do.In November, Alaska was dragged into this case in a major way.In an attempt to accommodate Delta's request for eight more flights, the city looked at the flight schedules of both Southwest and Alaska. Southwest recently started averaging nearly 11 flights a day out of its 18 gates.
Alaska, however, operated only 6.5 flights a day at its two gates on average.Therefore, the city reasoned, Delta's eight additional flights could be flown on Alaska's gates because the Seattle airline had time gaps in its schedule.The city added that an Alaska representative was deposed on Sept. 28 and stated the airline had no expansion plans at Love Field for the "foreseeable future."
Delta is suspicious of Alaska's recent expansion plans, and Alaska is like, "stay off my lawn". Haha. It's interesting that Alaska finds DAL that lucrative or necessary (I'm definitely happy about their proposed expanded flight options). Is this a case of sticking Delta in the eye, or does Alaska have serious long term plans for Dallas?
VX got AA's gates, and DL claimed squatter's rights to keep flying their 5 flights to ATL, back then on CRJ as "out of state" flights were capped to 56 pax capacity (IIRC).
Dallas City Hall saw the writing on the wall when DL asked them for a ruling, and decided to do a preemptive lawsuit instead, thinking that DL's deep pockets would outgun whatever Dallas could put up.
This has been dragging on for a long time, because when I was fortunate enough to meet the (recently) late former CEO Herb Kelleher he confidently said that he thought "we will win this."
Jan 20, 2019, 7:12 pm
#62
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Delta is suspicious of Alaska's recent expansion plans, and Alaska is like, "stay off my lawn". Haha. It's interesting that Alaska finds DAL that lucrative or necessary (I'm definitely happy about their proposed expanded flight options). Is this a case of sticking Delta in the eye, or does Alaska have serious long term plans for Dallas?
Jan 21, 2019, 1:50 pm
#63
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Southwest is always saying if some other airline isn't providing additional flights, surely they will. The impression given by AS before was that they had no interest in expanding, but that surely changed.
If the city tries to cut down the 2.5 non Southwest gates at the airport, I would imagine there would be anti-trust lawsuits.
Jan 21, 2019, 2:00 pm
#64
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Sure, but isn't it in the interest of the airport to provide the surrounding community with the most routes and frequency possible? Whatever gets more flights into the airport is a win for everyone.
Southwest is always saying if some other airline isn't providing additional flights, surely they will. The impression given by AS before was that they had no interest in expanding, but that surely changed.
If the city tries to cut down the 2.5 non Southwest gates at the airport, I would imagine there would be anti-trust lawsuits.
VX flew to DCA and LGA, and AS had no interest in continuing those flights.
And DL is squatting on 5 roundtrips to ATL - 4 x B717 and midday A320 or 319. - probalby changes depending on how many seats they sell.
Jan 21, 2019, 2:44 pm
#65
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Just my $0.02 worth, of course...
Last edited by Snowdevil; Jan 21, 2019 at 5:30 pm
Jan 21, 2019, 2:54 pm
#66
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Those are NOT my words.I merely posted a part of www.bizjournals.com/ article where that was posted above my reply @:-)
Jan 21, 2019, 3:43 pm
#67
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Um, why are you quoting me Those are NOT my words.
I merely posted a part of www.bizjournals.com/ article where that was posted above my reply @:-)
Those are NOT my words.I merely posted a part of www.bizjournals.com/ article where that was posted above my reply @:-)
Jan 21, 2019, 4:50 pm
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Jan 21, 2019, 4:51 pm
#69
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Originally Posted by FlyerTalk Rules
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Posts that misquote or mischaracterize other posts or members, or contain deceptive, dishonest or knowingly inaccurate information are not allowed.Rule 15
Jan 21, 2019, 5:01 pm
#70
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Looking one and two days out, SEA/DAL
Tomorrow - F2 Y6 / F4 Y0 - pretty full flights, if not close to or oversold in the back.
Wednesday - F4 Y6 / F3 Y1 - same.
LAX/DAL
Tomorrow - F2 Y0 / F0 Y6 / F6 Y7 - sounds like 2 of the 3 flights will be sold out. Once you're below Y7, you're pretty much good as full.
Tomorrow - F2 Y6 / F4 Y0 - pretty full flights, if not close to or oversold in the back.
Wednesday - F4 Y6 / F3 Y1 - same.
LAX/DAL
Tomorrow - F2 Y0 / F0 Y6 / F6 Y7 - sounds like 2 of the 3 flights will be sold out. Once you're below Y7, you're pretty much good as full.
Jan 21, 2019, 5:14 pm
#71
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Glad that planes are starting to fill up.
If you are going to Dallas proper DAL is much easier to get to and to navigate the airport.
If you are going to Dallas proper DAL is much easier to get to and to navigate the airport.
Jan 22, 2019, 9:48 am
#73
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My last DAL-SEA on Fri 1/18 was oversold. I volunteered and was first on the list but they managed to squeeze everyone on. Weight is usually a concern on this flight with high headwinds. We had to hold short of the runway 5 minutes to burn off enough fuel to make takeoff weight(!). It was a busy business week on Dallas. Flights were sold out well in advance. Every week there can be pretty different but SEA-DFW is always heavy load. SEA-DAL can vary.
Feb 12, 2019, 7:48 am
#75
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Even more so with AS which has fewer FC seats on 737 than UA, where this has been discussed (u/g chances) quite a bit in a couple of threads.