Another person who does not understand airfares " 6/12 NZ Herald
#16


Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Wellington
Programs: NZ*G
Posts: 209
I'll pose a question to you (and really to everybody) - for the last few weeks the demand on AKL-WLG has been crazy with every flight chokka on quite a few of those days. But do Air NZ really need to sell literally every seat on every day at the full $460 Y fare?
Even a week out every seat of every flight was $460. Did that really need to be the case?
Even a week out every seat of every flight was $460. Did that really need to be the case?
If price is an issue but you have time up your sleeve (looking at you uni students), theres options like WLG-HLZ as well. For bookings a week or two out, Ive sometimes done this at less than half the cost of WLG-AKL (though I appreciate this isnt always practical).
#17
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: WLG/BKK
Programs: TG*G, NZ*GE, QF G, Accor Plat
Posts: 12,706
When my 2 lads were at Otago, I simply purchased 4-8 (or more) P class FlexiRefund one-way fares around the likely travel dates, and then just progressively cancelled the ones not needed as the dates refined. A bit of a brute force solution and of course not for everybody. It also meant AirNZ effectively had a zero interest loan from me until I cancelled.
#18
I can't afford to fly to Europe - so maybe I'll make an article about that... It's just ridiculous.
#19


Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Zealand (most of the time)
Programs: Air NZ Elite *G, Honors Gold, IHG Platinum Elite
Posts: 7,066
Again, I dont love the idea of paying $460 for a domestic Y fare (even less so on a WLG-CHC ATR flight), and its not often I do, but if all flights are chocka, then I will begrudgingly accept every flight being $460 is the tough reality (especially at this time of year). If I really need to get from A to B then Id rather pay $460 for the last seat than not have a seat.
If price is an issue but you have time up your sleeve (looking at you uni students), theres options like WLG-HLZ as well. For bookings a week or two out, Ive sometimes done this at less than half the cost of WLG-AKL (though I appreciate this isnt always practical).
If price is an issue but you have time up your sleeve (looking at you uni students), theres options like WLG-HLZ as well. For bookings a week or two out, Ive sometimes done this at less than half the cost of WLG-AKL (though I appreciate this isnt always practical).
My issue is that for a few weeks now literally every seat on every flight has been full Y at $460. Why does that need to be the case? Qantas have multiple flights tomorrow from SYD-MEL that are $976 in economy but also have a number of flights for $362, and the 22:00 flight for $299. I feel it's a case of the RM team deciding that they can simply can get away with charging $460 and the fact they'd prefer to have empty seats rather than selling those remaining seats at a lower fare bucket.
#20


Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Zealand (most of the time)
Programs: Air NZ Elite *G, Honors Gold, IHG Platinum Elite
Posts: 7,066
I had a little chuckle when I looked at the photo of the reporter enjoying her time in Europe whilst complaining about the few hundred dollars it costs to fly to her (probably) parents $5M home in Queenstown.
I can't afford to fly to Europe - so maybe I'll make an article about that... It's just ridiculous.
I can't afford to fly to Europe - so maybe I'll make an article about that... It's just ridiculous.
I will assume she's booked a China Eastern flight because they're normally about the cheapest carrier around. Now there is nothing wrong with them as an airline, but you literally couldn't pay me to fly on them from LHR - PVG right now since they fly over Russia. In the current world we live in the last thing I'd want would be a medical or tech divert into Russia and then the possibility of having stamps or anything related to Russia in my passport because that has some pretty major implications right now.
I've got a Ukrainian visa in my passport from my visit to Kiev and Chernobyl in 2017 and in recent years I've noticed the interest this gets from literally every immigration person who looks at my passport as they flick through the pages and suddenly stop. This hasn't created any issues because of the date, but any records of visiting those countries these days can have major implications on your ability to travel freely to many Western countries.
#22

Join Date: Oct 2023
Posts: 126
Great thread and topic, I also read the article and was amazed at how clueless the author was. It still beggars belief that some Kiwi's (actually many Kiwis), think anything over about $69 is too much for a one way fare anywhere in NZ, the countless suggestions that somehow Air NZ would make money if every seat was $69.
Take a 171 seat domestic A320, thats $11,799 if every seat sells at $69 (every seat hardly ever sells at off-peak), I doubt that would even come close to covering the fuel cost on a AKL/WLG/CHC/ZQN, let alone airport charges, office leases, ground staff, crew/pilots, not to mention depreciation of a $120 million dollar aircraft that has a finite life.
It would actually do Air NZ justice to publicly release some of this information, like e.g. this is how much it costs to operate between X and X, and this is what every ticket would need to sell for to break even.
Take a 171 seat domestic A320, thats $11,799 if every seat sells at $69 (every seat hardly ever sells at off-peak), I doubt that would even come close to covering the fuel cost on a AKL/WLG/CHC/ZQN, let alone airport charges, office leases, ground staff, crew/pilots, not to mention depreciation of a $120 million dollar aircraft that has a finite life.
It would actually do Air NZ justice to publicly release some of this information, like e.g. this is how much it costs to operate between X and X, and this is what every ticket would need to sell for to break even.
#23


Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Zealand (most of the time)
Programs: Air NZ Elite *G, Honors Gold, IHG Platinum Elite
Posts: 7,066
Foran said earlier in the year that external costs (ie airports, security etc) was $62 excl GST on a WLG-AKL flight.
He also said pretty much any seats sold under $200 are loss making - but clearly theis is going to vary by route.
He also said pretty much any seats sold under $200 are loss making - but clearly theis is going to vary by route.
#24




Join Date: Jun 2023
Posts: 16
A pilot on here can correct me but the A320s burn about 2.5 tonnes going AKL-WLG and at an assumed purchase price of US$80 barrel,
thats about US$1250 in fuel costs alone, never mind the cash cost to purchase more fuel than that to cover reserves, alternates etc. So at NZ$11,800 revenue incl. GST youre looking at 20%-40% in fuel depending on how much is loaded. Those economics clearly only get worse the longer the sector if you stick to this belief of a $70 fare cap
thats about US$1250 in fuel costs alone, never mind the cash cost to purchase more fuel than that to cover reserves, alternates etc. So at NZ$11,800 revenue incl. GST youre looking at 20%-40% in fuel depending on how much is loaded. Those economics clearly only get worse the longer the sector if you stick to this belief of a $70 fare cap
#25

Join Date: Oct 2023
Posts: 126
Add in the fact that most of the NZ public not only have the perception that tickets shouldnt be more than $70, they also expect airlines to cover all of their out of pocket expenses for accomodation during weather and engineering disrupts. Years ago I remember weather was excluded but Air NZ seem to be quite accomodating, and provide hotel accomodation if delayed mid journey - even for weather disrupts.
$250 per night and $90 per person for meals.
So much for travel insurance..
There are so many costs airlines are burdened with, its no wonder they struggle
$250 per night and $90 per person for meals.
So much for travel insurance..
There are so many costs airlines are burdened with, its no wonder they struggle
#26


Join Date: Nov 2018
Programs: Air New Zealand
Posts: 103
I just don't understand why it's always the high-income people who make such a fuss about it? Heather du Plessis-Allan (NewstalkZB) was saying the other day that she "cancelled" her holiday plans to Wellington due to fare pricing from AKL.
I'm a Uni student (not sure how much poorer you could get) and I'm not running to the media whenever I have to pay full Y to get home due to my poor planning lol.
I get there are probably edge cases e.g medical/funeral (even though there are compassionate fares), but the reality is that travel is a luxury. Take a bus if you want to save money...
I'm a Uni student (not sure how much poorer you could get) and I'm not running to the media whenever I have to pay full Y to get home due to my poor planning lol.
I get there are probably edge cases e.g medical/funeral (even though there are compassionate fares), but the reality is that travel is a luxury. Take a bus if you want to save money...

