AF staff vote down pay deal. Janaillac resigns. Benjamin Smith new CEO
May 8, 2018, 5:54 am
#31
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May 8, 2018, 6:05 am
#32
Join Date: Sep 2014
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I guess many of the workers, especially those that joined in recent years, will not feel they are well paid. Therefore the offer does not feel generous, as it probably actually represents a wage cut in real terms when inflation is factored in.
Paris is not a cheap city to live in. Workers in the trenches will feel that they already made sacrificies during the financial crisis years, now it's time to start seeing some payback.
Management has not been able to communicate with the workers, making a bad situation worse.
The Delta way would be a good model. First, get the structure in order and make the airline highly profitable. Then, give a large slice of those profits back to frontline workers, so they feel properly rewarded for the hard work they put in.
AF is not a lost cause, it's a great airline with a strong brand based in the heart of Europe in the world's most visited city. It just needs the right management to realize its potential.
May 8, 2018, 6:17 am
#33
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: SJJ/AMS
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May 8, 2018, 7:04 am
#35
Join Date: Dec 2016
Programs: Flying Blue
Posts: 47
I think it's simplistic to say its all the workers' fault and shouldn't they be grateful for the "generous" offer.
I guess many of the workers, especially those that joined in recent years, will not feel they are well paid. Therefore the offer does not feel generous, as it probably actually represents a wage cut in real terms when inflation is factored in.
Paris is not a cheap city to live in. Workers in the trenches will feel that they already made sacrificies during the financial crisis years, now it's time to start seeing some payback.
Management has not been able to communicate with the workers, making a bad situation worse.
The Delta way would be a good model. First, get the structure in order and make the airline highly profitable. Then, give a large slice of those profits back to frontline workers, so they feel properly rewarded for the hard work they put in.
AF is not a lost cause, it's a great airline with a strong brand based in the heart of Europe in the world's most visited city. It just needs the right management to realize its potential.
I guess many of the workers, especially those that joined in recent years, will not feel they are well paid. Therefore the offer does not feel generous, as it probably actually represents a wage cut in real terms when inflation is factored in.
Paris is not a cheap city to live in. Workers in the trenches will feel that they already made sacrificies during the financial crisis years, now it's time to start seeing some payback.
Management has not been able to communicate with the workers, making a bad situation worse.
The Delta way would be a good model. First, get the structure in order and make the airline highly profitable. Then, give a large slice of those profits back to frontline workers, so they feel properly rewarded for the hard work they put in.
AF is not a lost cause, it's a great airline with a strong brand based in the heart of Europe in the world's most visited city. It just needs the right management to realize its potential.
AF isnt making a lot of money and need to be reformed in order to be fit.
I agree about communication. And I don't know how that went. It's logical to pay the employees a bonus when it goes well with the company and everybody can enjoy the prosperity.
It just amazes me to keep on striking when the company is bleeding to death and there is no bad concious about it.
It says a lot about work ethics and how bad the management was able to unite their employees as the Air France family.
May 8, 2018, 7:14 am
#36
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 179
In this particular case, in my opinion the threat with CEO resignation had the (predictable) effect of getting more people to vote "no". Again in my opinion, that was either stupid or calculated. I cannot make my mind which of the two.
May 8, 2018, 7:34 am
#37
Join Date: Dec 2016
Programs: Flying Blue
Posts: 47
Also letting people make make a rational decision in a emotional mindset is a mistake that he could have prevented.
I think it it was just plain stupid.
May 8, 2018, 9:07 am
#38
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Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hong Kong, France
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AF is a bit victim of all the glorification press releases stressing the wonderful operating results for 2017. Janaillac wanted to shine as new CEO for 2017 and show investors the great turnaround he had achieved. But AFKL experienced a net loss of some million in 2017, luckily restated as a profit using new IFRS conventions..
AFKL was really helped by the capital increase from DL and MU (they must be very unhappy).
Does anyone has the division between AF and KL for operating results and net results (2017 and Q1 2018)?
AFKL was really helped by the capital increase from DL and MU (they must be very unhappy).
Does anyone has the division between AF and KL for operating results and net results (2017 and Q1 2018)?
May 8, 2018, 9:12 am
#39
Join Date: Sep 2014
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Facts are that the average AF employee is getting paid more than average. I understand their reaction in case they would be underpaid. They arent.
AF isnt making a lot of money and need to be reformed in order to be fit.
I agree about communication. And I don't know how that went. It's logical to pay the employees a bonus when it goes well with the company and everybody can enjoy the prosperity.
It just amazes me to keep on striking when the company is bleeding to death and there is no bad concious about it.
It says a lot about work ethics and how bad the management was able to unite their employees as the Air France family.
AF isnt making a lot of money and need to be reformed in order to be fit.
I agree about communication. And I don't know how that went. It's logical to pay the employees a bonus when it goes well with the company and everybody can enjoy the prosperity.
It just amazes me to keep on striking when the company is bleeding to death and there is no bad concious about it.
It says a lot about work ethics and how bad the management was able to unite their employees as the Air France family.
The CEO has lost the battle, he has failed in his leadership and he has to go. Other heads should roll too.
About the compensation, if you compare with Easyjet or Ryanair then maybe yes, the crew are "overpaid". My understanding is that a full time long haul cabin crew member who started in the last couple of years gets about €1500/month*, which is a pretty poor salary for anyone living in Paris. Then imagine that salary being eroded by inflation. Not hard to see why someone would feel like striking, especially if management is unable to communicate a positive vision of the future.
May 8, 2018, 9:29 am
#40
Join Date: Dec 2016
Programs: Flying Blue
Posts: 47
I am also amazed that the strike was allowed to happen as nobody wins here. AF loses, staff lose, customers lose.
The CEO has lost the battle, he has failed in his leadership and he has to go. Other heads should roll too.
About the compensation, if you compare with Easyjet or Ryanair then maybe yes, the crew are "overpaid". My understanding is that a full time long haul cabin crew member who started in the last couple of years gets about €1500/month*, which is a pretty poor salary for anyone living in Paris. Then imagine that salary being eroded by inflation. Not hard to see why someone would feel like striking, especially if management is unable to communicate a positive vision of the future.
The CEO has lost the battle, he has failed in his leadership and he has to go. Other heads should roll too.
About the compensation, if you compare with Easyjet or Ryanair then maybe yes, the crew are "overpaid". My understanding is that a full time long haul cabin crew member who started in the last couple of years gets about €1500/month*, which is a pretty poor salary for anyone living in Paris. Then imagine that salary being eroded by inflation. Not hard to see why someone would feel like striking, especially if management is unable to communicate a positive vision of the future.
I agree totally about the failure of the leadership. It’s nearly a rookie mistake.
But it then again, it’s also about the French culture and how they look at a PDG. It’s much more hierarchical compared to The Netherlands where KLM managed to create a family feeling which is visible in all aspects in the company. They even made it an USP.
May 8, 2018, 2:29 pm
#41
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I agree compared to LCC but I am comparing to KLM. Living in Amsterdam isn’t cheap either and is no reason to strike. I think it’s just not ethical.
I agree totally about the failure of the leadership. It’s nearly a rookie mistake.
But it then again, it’s also about the French culture and how they look at a PDG. It’s much more hierarchical compared to The Netherlands where KLM managed to create a family feeling which is visible in all aspects in the company. They even made it an USP.
May 8, 2018, 3:26 pm
#42
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I would argue exactly the same thing about Air France staff, at least cabin crews (I hardly interact with others so I don't know). Very proud about their work, their company, the legacy. They feel a bit elitist - which is why it's so tough for them to accept that their wages are too high and need to go down to the levels of other, (in their eyes) less prestigious occupations.
May 8, 2018, 7:18 pm
#43
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May 8, 2018, 9:26 pm
#44
Join Date: Apr 2018
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Facts are that the average AF employee is getting paid more than average. I understand their reaction in case they would be underpaid. They arent.
AF isnt making a lot of money and need to be reformed in order to be fit.
I agree about communication. And I don't know how that went. It's logical to pay the employees a bonus when it goes well with the company and everybody can enjoy the prosperity.
It just amazes me to keep on striking when the company is bleeding to death and there is no bad concious about it.
It says a lot about work ethics and how bad the management was able to unite their employees as the Air France family.
AF isnt making a lot of money and need to be reformed in order to be fit.
I agree about communication. And I don't know how that went. It's logical to pay the employees a bonus when it goes well with the company and everybody can enjoy the prosperity.
It just amazes me to keep on striking when the company is bleeding to death and there is no bad concious about it.
It says a lot about work ethics and how bad the management was able to unite their employees as the Air France family.
Regards,
May 8, 2018, 9:48 pm
#45
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I flew some months ago from CDG to South America, the cabin crew ( most of them in Business ) did not lived in Paris but in the interior of France, so they commuted to Paris for their three or four long-haul flights a month. With that point of view we can conclude how viable is the future of AF against other carriers that are far more competitive with the new trend of travelers and low cost companies TODAY and not back to the old aviation of the 80's and 90's.
Regards,
Regards,
if the former, AF staff is no different from other airlines. It is very common everywhere to live somewhere else than the main base. If the latter, yes certainly.