May 9, 2019, 3:08 pm
Last edit by: Goldorak
FLYING BLUE ULTIMATE
Main facts
Ultimate is the top status in FB. It may be added to Club 2000 – Skipper status.
While other FB status (Silver/Gold/Platinum) are based on experience points earning (XP), Ultimate status is obtained by Ultimate XP (UXP) earning. UXPs are earned exclusively on AF- and KL-coded (= marketed) flights, whatever the operating airline.
Some examples :
- CDG-JFK AF-marketing, AF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-JFK DL-marketing, AF-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
- AMS-BOS KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- BOS-IND KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- SIN-SYD AF-marketing, QF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-FCO AZ-marketing, AZ-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
XP earned via AFKL Amex cards are not eligible (those are XP and not UXP).
To qualify for Ultimate, it is needed to have 900 UXP over a year. It is similar to the normal XP counter, resetting as soon as the tier is reached. Ultimate is valid for 1 year once granted. Note 03/2023 : the qualification system just changed from 1800 UXP over 2 years to 900 UXP/1 year. Some transitional measures are in place for the current Ultimate members. See here for details about handling of transition period :
https://www.flyingblue.com/fr/landin...m_content=main
Since 03/2023, a rollover of surplus UXP (over 900) is now possible to the next year and only to the next year (example : year 1, the member earns 2000UXP. At the end of year 1, only 900 UXP will be rolled-over to year 2 and the remaining 1100 UXP earned in Y1 will be lost and not be transferred to year 3. If during year 2, the member earned 1000 new (fresh) UXP, 100 will be rolled-over to year 3.
Hard benefits
- All FB Platinum/Club 2000-Skipper benefits
- Access to a Travel Assistant service 24/7. They are reachable by phone or by email. In practice, from 8 pm to 8 am CET, calls are taken by the Platinum line.
- highest priority on waiting list and in case of irrops
- Possibility to register up to 8 persons who can benefit from Sky Priority services and lounge access when traveling with the Ultimate member and on same PNR (lounge access is only in AFKL lounges here).
- one companion Platinum card
- when the Ultimate member is flying P, 2 guests are allowed in CDG P lounge.
- Zone 1 boarding, irrespective of travel class.
- Access to Hertz Platinum status
- four one-class upgrade certificates per membership year, requiring 1 from W to J, or 2 from Y to J. Upgrades are confirmed instantly at the time of booking (via the Travel Assistant). One voucher = one way. Vouchers can also be used by one of the 8 registered friend/family members travelling by themselves. In case of a long-haul flight with a medium-haul connection/feeder (e.g. CDG-AMS-JFK), the medium-haul segment will be upgraded also with still only one voucher used. In case of 2 long-haul flights in connection (e,g. DXB-CDG-JFK), the use of 2 vouchers is required to upgrade the 2 segments. Upgrade vouchers are usable only on AF- or KL-marketing and operating flights and the PNR must contains only the AFKL flights to be upgraded (if the PNR contains other non-AFKL flights, you cannot upgrade even just the AFKL flights).
The upgrade coupons are valid as soon as you reach Ultimate and is valid for 12 months. The vouchers need to be used within the membership year, but can be applied for travel post expiry date.
Rules for eligible booking classes for the upgrade vouchers are described below :
AF flights, long-haul
Premium Eco to Business
Original booking class : A, S, W
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico, including LAX-PPT)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, C
KL flights, long-haul
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, I.
Airline-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
- AF, KL and contract staff at airports have a popup message on their computer screen when checking-in an Ultimate pax or when scanning a BP at the lounge (AFKL lounges only) asking them to be attentive at any special request of the Ultimate pax. See also below for airport-specific soft benefits. There is no known official policy for operational upgrades of Ultimates, but Ultimate members have all reported on FT a higher rate of op-up (but those remain rare !).
- AF and KL cabin crews are instructed to provide extra care and attentions on-board. It can take different forms : special greetings, extra amenities (pillow, oshibori, etc), F&B from the upper class, upgrades on board (Y to J medium haul, W to J or Y to W long haul), earlier and quicker meal service. This is not systematic and is up to the appreciation of the crew. Based on the reports of Ultimate members of this forum, AF crews seems to be more compliant than KL crews with those directives, although there has been several reports in this thread of nice attentions provided by KL crews.- Unlimited downloads (any day) in AF PLAY app.
Other Skyteam airlines do not provide any extra service or attentions to FB Ultimate passengers.
Airport-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
All benefits below should be understood for departure, unless otherwise noted. In addition to what is mentioned below, it has been reported several cases of expedited transfers organised by AFKL staff in case of short/endangered connection at various airports.
Please complete/edit this list as needed.
AFKL HUBS
Amsterdam
- AMS : some reserved tables in the Non-Schengen lounges. Reserved area in the Schengen lounge (need to ask staff at long entrance). Pre-boarding sometimes granted at the gate.
Paris CDG
Paris ORY
EUROPE
Austria
- VIE: no special treatment to report
Croatia
- DBV: no special treatment to report
- SPU: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Czech Republic
- PRG: no special treatment to report. Pre-boarding refused.
Denmark
- CPH: no special treatment to report
France (non-hubs)
- AJA: no special treatment to reportMain facts
Ultimate is the top status in FB. It may be added to Club 2000 – Skipper status.
While other FB status (Silver/Gold/Platinum) are based on experience points earning (XP), Ultimate status is obtained by Ultimate XP (UXP) earning. UXPs are earned exclusively on AF- and KL-coded (= marketed) flights, whatever the operating airline.
Some examples :
- CDG-JFK AF-marketing, AF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-JFK DL-marketing, AF-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
- AMS-BOS KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- BOS-IND KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- SIN-SYD AF-marketing, QF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-FCO AZ-marketing, AZ-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
XP earned via AFKL Amex cards are not eligible (those are XP and not UXP).
To qualify for Ultimate, it is needed to have 900 UXP over a year. It is similar to the normal XP counter, resetting as soon as the tier is reached. Ultimate is valid for 1 year once granted. Note 03/2023 : the qualification system just changed from 1800 UXP over 2 years to 900 UXP/1 year. Some transitional measures are in place for the current Ultimate members. See here for details about handling of transition period :
https://www.flyingblue.com/fr/landin...m_content=main
Since 03/2023, a rollover of surplus UXP (over 900) is now possible to the next year and only to the next year (example : year 1, the member earns 2000UXP. At the end of year 1, only 900 UXP will be rolled-over to year 2 and the remaining 1100 UXP earned in Y1 will be lost and not be transferred to year 3. If during year 2, the member earned 1000 new (fresh) UXP, 100 will be rolled-over to year 3.
Hard benefits
- All FB Platinum/Club 2000-Skipper benefits
- Access to a Travel Assistant service 24/7. They are reachable by phone or by email. In practice, from 8 pm to 8 am CET, calls are taken by the Platinum line.
- highest priority on waiting list and in case of irrops
- Possibility to register up to 8 persons who can benefit from Sky Priority services and lounge access when traveling with the Ultimate member and on same PNR (lounge access is only in AFKL lounges here).
- one companion Platinum card
- when the Ultimate member is flying P, 2 guests are allowed in CDG P lounge.
- Zone 1 boarding, irrespective of travel class.
- Access to Hertz Platinum status
- four one-class upgrade certificates per membership year, requiring 1 from W to J, or 2 from Y to J. Upgrades are confirmed instantly at the time of booking (via the Travel Assistant). One voucher = one way. Vouchers can also be used by one of the 8 registered friend/family members travelling by themselves. In case of a long-haul flight with a medium-haul connection/feeder (e.g. CDG-AMS-JFK), the medium-haul segment will be upgraded also with still only one voucher used. In case of 2 long-haul flights in connection (e,g. DXB-CDG-JFK), the use of 2 vouchers is required to upgrade the 2 segments. Upgrade vouchers are usable only on AF- or KL-marketing and operating flights and the PNR must contains only the AFKL flights to be upgraded (if the PNR contains other non-AFKL flights, you cannot upgrade even just the AFKL flights).
The upgrade coupons are valid as soon as you reach Ultimate and is valid for 12 months. The vouchers need to be used within the membership year, but can be applied for travel post expiry date.
Rules for eligible booking classes for the upgrade vouchers are described below :
AF flights, long-haul
Premium Eco to Business
Original booking class : A, S, W
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico, including LAX-PPT)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, C
KL flights, long-haul
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, I.
Airline-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
- AF, KL and contract staff at airports have a popup message on their computer screen when checking-in an Ultimate pax or when scanning a BP at the lounge (AFKL lounges only) asking them to be attentive at any special request of the Ultimate pax. See also below for airport-specific soft benefits. There is no known official policy for operational upgrades of Ultimates, but Ultimate members have all reported on FT a higher rate of op-up (but those remain rare !).
- AF and KL cabin crews are instructed to provide extra care and attentions on-board. It can take different forms : special greetings, extra amenities (pillow, oshibori, etc), F&B from the upper class, upgrades on board (Y to J medium haul, W to J or Y to W long haul), earlier and quicker meal service. This is not systematic and is up to the appreciation of the crew. Based on the reports of Ultimate members of this forum, AF crews seems to be more compliant than KL crews with those directives, although there has been several reports in this thread of nice attentions provided by KL crews.- Unlimited downloads (any day) in AF PLAY app.
Other Skyteam airlines do not provide any extra service or attentions to FB Ultimate passengers.
Airport-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
All benefits below should be understood for departure, unless otherwise noted. In addition to what is mentioned below, it has been reported several cases of expedited transfers organised by AFKL staff in case of short/endangered connection at various airports.
Please complete/edit this list as needed.
AFKL HUBS
Amsterdam
- AMS : some reserved tables in the Non-Schengen lounges. Reserved area in the Schengen lounge (need to ask staff at long entrance). Pre-boarding sometimes granted at the gate.
Paris CDG
- CDG 2E:
- Departure : Escort from check-in to immigration in the morning (super fast track). Reserved space at K/L/M lounges. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate before beginning of general boarding
- Arrival : access to dedicated lane at passport control, all the way to the left, follow the "ULTIMATE" sign.
- Departure : There is a special Ultimate check-in counter in the SkyP zone (on the left of terminal). Reserved room in the lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate before beginning of general boarding. Escort is provided from the counter to security (skipping the line).
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
- Departure : Reserved space in the lounge
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
Paris ORY
- Departure : Reserved space at Schengen and non-Schengen lounges. Pre-boarding upon request at the lounge.
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
EUROPE
Austria
- VIE: no special treatment to report
Croatia
- DBV: no special treatment to report
- SPU: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Czech Republic
- PRG: no special treatment to report. Pre-boarding refused.
Denmark
- CPH: no special treatment to report
France (non-hubs)
- BES: no special treatment to report
- BIQ: no special treatment to report
- BOD: pre-boarding from lounge to plane inconsistently proposed
- CDG: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
- LYS: Escort from lounge to plane when flying from B gates provided upon request . Preboarding with escort to the plane consistently provided.
- MPL: pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane, sometimes proposed (AF agent comes to the contract lounge to meet the Ultimate guest)
- MRS: no special treatment to report
- NCE: Reserved area in Infinity lounge (inconsistently provided : seems to be provided only when lounge crowded). Pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane, sometimes proposed.
- NTE: no special treatment to report
- ORY: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
- PUF: bypass queue at security and pre-boarding provided upon request
- RNS: bypass queue at security and pre-boarding provided upon request
- TLS: Escort from check in to lounge inconsistently provided. Pre-boarding consistently provided
Germany
- BER: no special treatment to report
- DUS: no special treatment to report
- FRA: no special treatment to report
- HAM: no special treatment to report
- HAJ: No special treatment to report.
- MUC: Reserved area in the lounge, escort from lounge to plane with pre-boarding proposed.
- STR: reserved area in the lounge, pre-boarding
Greece
- ATH: no special treatment to report
- HER: no special treatment to report
- JTR: no special treatment to report
Hungary
- BUD: escort through security from check-in to lounge proposed
Ireland
- DUB: no special treatment to report
Italy
- BLQ: escort from check-in to lounge, and through security to plane.
- BRI: no special treatment to report
- CTA: no special treatment to report
- FCO: no special treatment to report
- FLR: no special treatment to report
- LIN: no special treatment to report
- MXP: pre-boarding granted by request
- VCE: escort through security from check-in to lounge, pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane (not always consistently proposed)
- NAP: no special treatment to report
Netherlands
- AMS: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
Norway
- OSL: no special treatment to report
- TRF: no special treatment to report
- KRS: no special treatment to report
- SVG: no special treatment to report
Poland
- WAW: no special treatment to report
- KRK: no special treatment to report
- GDN: no special treatment to report
Portugal
- LIS: pre-boarding proposed upon request
Russia
- SVO: no special treatment to report
- LED: no special treatment to report
Spain
- AGP: no special treatment to report
- BCN: no special treatment to report
- MAD: no special treatment to report
- PMI: no special treatment to report
- SVQ: no special treatment to report
- TFS: no special treatment to report
- VLC: no special treatment to report
Sweden
- ARN: no special treatment to report
- GOT: no special treatment to report
Switzerland
- GVA: pre-boarding upon request. Reserved area in the lounge
- ZRH: no special treatment
United Kingdom
- ABZ: no special treatment to report
- EDI: no special treatment to report
- LHR: no special treatment to report
NORTH AMERICA
Canada
- YUL: Escort from check-in to lounge upon request. Reserved area in lounge, pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane
- YYZ: escort on arrival through immigration, consistently offered. / Escort from check-in to lounge and from lounge to airplane
- YQB: escort from check-in to lounge proposed
- YVR: no special treatment to report
USA
- ATL: no special treatment to report (in connection)
- BOS: escort through security from check-in to lounge, pre-boarding, all consistently provided mostly spontaneously, sometimes upon request. A separate room in the AF lounge is also proposed.
- DTW: no special treatment to report (starting from DTW or in connection)
- IAD: escort through security from check-in to lounge upon request, but inconsistently provided. Reserved area at the lounge.
- IAH: no special treatment to report
- JFK (AF only / terminal 1) : reserved table in the dining area of the lounge (upstairs),
- JFK (KL only / terminal 4) : no special treatments to report.
- LAX: no special treatment to report
- ORD: On arrival, escort through immigration (not consistently provided). On departure, escort through security to lounge and from lounge to plane (pre-boarding)
- MSP: no special treatment to report, except one case of special DL Elite VIP treatment with expedited immigration and Porsche transfer to/from lounge (not a regular benefit to expect)
- SEA: pre-boarding with escort to plane
- SFO: reserved area in lounge
Mexico
- MEX (Terminal 1): escort through security to lounge with access to dedicated space. Ride from lounge to gate. Sometimes escort on arrival
CENTRAL & SOUTH AMERICA
- BOG: no special treatment to report
- LIM: escort to lounge, provided spontaneously
- GIG: Pre-boarding upon request.
- GRU: escort in case of short connection upon request, inconsistently provided; as of 02/2024 pre-boarding offered at check-in and provided by gate-staff (inconsistently provided).
- SCL: as of 03/2024 escort to lounge offered at departure check-in, pick-up from lounge and pre-boarding done
- EZE: escort to lounge with special crew lane for immigration provided spontaneously
ASIA / PACIFIC
- BKK: escort through security from check-in to lounge, upon request but inconsistently proposed. In connection : escort in case of short connection (better to request it before departure).
- BLR: escort from lounge to gate, pre-boarding provided
- BOM : escort from plane to immigration, and from checkin to the lounge
- DEL: as of 01/2024 escort upon arrival; proactive pre-departure call to arrange terminal entry via VIP entrance and escort to gate for pre-boarding (if lounge used, offered to pick up for pre-boarding)
- HKG: no special treatment to report.
- HND: Arrival : new 09/2023 = escort through immigration. Departure : escort from check-in desk to private (crew) security, proposed spontaneously
- KIX: Arrival : escort through immigration, wait at baggage claim. Departure : escort from check-in desk to lounge All proposed spontaneously
- SIN: no special treatment to report
CARIBBEAN & INDIAN OCEAN
- CUR: no special treatment to report, there is no (sky)priority lane for security or immigration, but escort/short track is available for 100 $.
- HAV: at departure, escort from check in counters until security checks. Pre-boarding offered. No escort at arrival. No reserved space in Lounge.
- FDF: No reserved space in Lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate.
- MRU: escort on arrival through immigration. Unknown for departures (no data point)
- PTP: Reserved table in lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the lounge with escort from lounge to plane.
- RUN: Pre-boarding proposed at check-in and in the lounge, with escort from lounge to plane. Reserved seats in lounge
- SXM: Escort for incoming transit pax (from/to AF flight) through passport controls and security, pre-boarding pro-actively offered for AF departure
MIDDLE EAST
- AUH : no special treatment to report
- BEY: no special treatment to report
- DXB: escort from check-in to lounge and from lounge to plane, all upon request, consistently provided. Access to the Ahlan lounge (normally reserved for P pax) instead of Skyteam lounge.
- JED: no special treatment to report
- RUH: no special treatment to report
- IST: no special treatment to report
AFRICA
- AGA: escort from check in to lounge and from lounge to aircraft, provided spontaneously
- CAI: no special treatment to report
- CMN: escort on arrival through immigration (not always consistently provided)
- CPT: escort from counter to lounge, provided spontaneously
- JNB: escort from counter to lounge (no fast track at immigration), provided spontaneously
- LOS: no special treatment to report
- RAK: escort on arrival, upon request (not provided on departure)
- RBA: on departure : escort to lounge and to plane, provided spontaneously.
- TUN: escort on arrival through immigration provided. Escort from check-in to lounge provided
- ZNZ: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Flying Blue Platinum Ultimate Status
Dec 23, 2017, 3:13 pm
#961
Join Date: Jun 2017
Programs: FB Plat
Posts: 195
I've found that the Dutch in general are very egalitarian and KLM seems to be a perfect example. While one may have status, you're no more important than the person next to you without status. Just my 2 cents after living in the NL for a good number of years. While I'll never be able to achieve Ulti, it's a shame they can't work it out for you guys. They're clearly dropping the ball. Maybe the new year will bring changes to the program and they can get their act together and give tangible benefits to their most frequent/loyal customers.
Dec 24, 2017, 7:37 am
#962
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Champaign, IL
Programs: AF/KL FB Ultimate Platinum for Life/Club 2000, UA MileagePlus
Posts: 524
I've found that the Dutch in general are very egalitarian and KLM seems to be a perfect example. While one may have status, you're no more important than the person next to you without status. Just my 2 cents after living in the NL for a good number of years. While I'll never be able to achieve Ulti, it's a shame they can't work it out for you guys. They're clearly dropping the ball. Maybe the new year will bring changes to the program and they can get their act together and give tangible benefits to their most frequent/loyal customers.
Macaron54
Dec 24, 2017, 8:24 am
#963
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Champaign, IL
Programs: AF/KL FB Ultimate Platinum for Life/Club 2000, UA MileagePlus
Posts: 524
Merry Christmas to everyone on this thread (in particular to my fellow Ultimates). I can tell you that Santa Klaus definitely forgot to stop at CDG last night, as I was waiting for my flight to HKG. Though the ground staff in the lounge was cordial as usual, there was nothing outlandish. No Christmas gift. No thank-you note (for spending so much at AFKL this year). No bottle of vintage Champagne. No chocolates. And on board, it did not get any better. I had a paid ticket in J, but did not get op'ed up to P through divine intervention. The chief purser belonged to the (fortunately small) clique of AF personnel who has little understanding of the concept of loyalty, and (for better or worse) ignored me during the whole journey (nor did I try to catch his attention). The J purser was clearly more affable and came a few times to ask whether everything was in order. Yet, unlike on several other flights, never was I offered a dish, or just a glass of wine from P. So much, therefore, for the speculations that at the end of the year, the airline would make it up to its top-tier PAXs for the many hiccups of the Ultimate program and the promises that were not kept. To paraphrase NumbThumb, perhaps did they finally drop the ball. Or perhaps, and more likely so, do they think they have done already so much for us. Be that as it may, none of the rumors that I had heard here and there, including from the ground staff at CDG, no less, of a complimentary upgrade, appear to be founded. It would have been appropriate though, given that the program management started to lure us in believing that Ultimates would soon benefit from an (undisclosed) upgrade mechanism as early as last spring. But let's be optimistic here. Strictly speaking, my flight was on the 23rd, not the 24th. It is very possible that Santa and his minions have cooked up a surprise for me, which I will find on my return flight next Friday, or upon landing at CDG. The AFKL Santa is a big prankster who loves to tease his top-tier customers. Merry Christmas!
Macaron54
Macaron54
Dec 24, 2017, 9:32 pm
#964
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hong Kong, France
Programs: FB , BA Gold
Posts: 15,568
Merry Christmas to everyone on this thread (in particular to my fellow Ultimates). I can tell you that Santa Klaus definitely forgot to stop at CDG last night, as I was waiting for my flight to HKG. Though the ground staff in the lounge was cordial as usual, there was nothing outlandish. No Christmas gift. No thank-you note (for spending so much at AFKL this year). No bottle of vintage Champagne. No chocolates. And on board, it did not get any better. I had a paid ticket in J, but did not get op'ed up to P through divine intervention. The chief purser belonged to the (fortunately small) clique of AF personnel who has little understanding of the concept of loyalty, and (for better or worse) ignored me during the whole journey (nor did I try to catch his attention). The J purser was clearly more affable and came a few times to ask whether everything was in order. Yet, unlike on several other flights, never was I offered a dish, or just a glass of wine from P. So much, therefore, for the speculations that at the end of the year, the airline would make it up to its top-tier PAXs for the many hiccups of the Ultimate program and the promises that were not kept. To paraphrase NumbThumb, perhaps did they finally drop the ball. Or perhaps, and more likely so, do they think they have done already so much for us. Be that as it may, none of the rumors that I had heard here and there, including from the ground staff at CDG, no less, of a complimentary upgrade, appear to be founded. It would have been appropriate though, given that the program management started to lure us in believing that Ultimates would soon benefit from an (undisclosed) upgrade mechanism as early as last spring. But let's be optimistic here. Strictly speaking, my flight was on the 23rd, not the 24th. It is very possible that Santa and his minions have cooked up a surprise for me, which I will find on my return flight next Friday, or upon landing at CDG. The AFKL Santa is a big prankster who loves to tease his top-tier customers. Merry Christmas!
Macaron54
Macaron54
Unfortunately the Ulti execution seems consistent with typical experiences at AF and many other French services. There is a memo from management to staff, and a campaign, to do something. Most staff will observe it. But after some time, the soufflé falls down and everything is back to normal. Typical execution problems. And as you said, anything that is "luxurious" service is frowned upon in France, not only in Holland.
Last edited by brunos; Dec 25, 2017 at 12:53 am
Dec 25, 2017, 1:28 am
#965
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Champaign, IL
Programs: AF/KL FB Ultimate Platinum for Life/Club 2000, UA MileagePlus
Posts: 524
Unclear why you would expect anything special on 23rd. Xmas is on 25th and a lot of people celebrate Xmas eve, but not on 22 or 23 or 29.
Unfortunately the Ulti execution seems consistent with typical experiences at AF and many other French services. There is a memo from management to staff, and a campaign, to do something. Most staff will observe it. But after some time, the soufflé falls down and everything is back to normal. Typical execution problems. And as you said, anything that is "luxurious" service is frowned upon in France, not only in Holland.
Unfortunately the Ulti execution seems consistent with typical experiences at AF and many other French services. There is a memo from management to staff, and a campaign, to do something. Most staff will observe it. But after some time, the soufflé falls down and everything is back to normal. Typical execution problems. And as you said, anything that is "luxurious" service is frowned upon in France, not only in Holland.
. My gut feeling is that the speculations we have heard in recent weeks, most notably from the AF staff, stem from the realization that the program did not meet the expectations of the cardholders. Somehow they convinced themselves (and felt compelled to herald) that the airline would make an end-of-the-year commercial gesture for its top-tier customers. An AF staff on the ground even mentioned a memo on the subject. Returning to your metaphor, I must say that at a number of outstations (e.g., STR and ORD) directives, once given, sink in and the soufflé never deflates. What you are alluding to is a flaw in the line of command, which is both worrisome and difficult to fix given the notorious inertia of the airline.
Dec 25, 2017, 1:49 am
#966
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 367
Well, we can test - I have a flight today (25th) - out of AMS; No need for Santa, but adhering to policies would be very much appreciated.
Which, by the way, we all need to do. Or do we have the choice to be non-egalitarian and just sit anywhere in the plane without paying for it? Remarkably as soon as it hits our wallet the egaliterian attitude miraculously has found it's end...
Which, by the way, we all need to do. Or do we have the choice to be non-egalitarian and just sit anywhere in the plane without paying for it? Remarkably as soon as it hits our wallet the egaliterian attitude miraculously has found it's end...
Dec 25, 2017, 2:32 am
#967
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,939
Dec 25, 2017, 2:36 am
#968
Join Date: Jun 2017
Programs: FB Plat
Posts: 195
With all due respects, I question the semantics here. While the Dutch might be egalitarian as a people (no one will dispute it here, nor is it the topic of this thread), the KLM staff at AMS is merely (and purposely so) ignoring directives emanating from the higher management in Paris. Being egalitarian has nothing to do with it, and if it did, then let's push the idea to the extreme in an ad absurdum reasoning. Under these premises, KLM would make no distinction between its PAXs and invite them all to its Crown Lounge at AMS, or ignore SkyP rules and let everyone board at the same time. Such is evidently not the case. PAXs who have demonstrated their loyalty to the airline are offered in return a little more than the others. The Gordian knot is for those who have contributed the most to the revenue of the sister airlines, and in principle who deserve the extra attention, following a basic idea in retail, spend more, get more. For reasons unclear to me, the KLM management refuses to follow the Ultimate program, but might be eventually coerced to do so, as AFKL cannot afford to have double standards at its major hubs.
Macaron54
Macaron54
Dec 25, 2017, 6:05 am
#970
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Champaign, IL
Programs: AF/KL FB Ultimate Platinum for Life/Club 2000, UA MileagePlus
Posts: 524
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Dec 25, 2017, 6:22 am
#971
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Champaign, IL
Programs: AF/KL FB Ultimate Platinum for Life/Club 2000, UA MileagePlus
Posts: 524
Well, we can test - I have a flight today (25th) - out of AMS; No need for Santa, but adhering to policies would be very much appreciated.
Which, by the way, we all need to do. Or do we have the choice to be non-egalitarian and just sit anywhere in the plane without paying for it? Remarkably as soon as it hits our wallet the egaliterian attitude miraculously has found it's end...
Which, by the way, we all need to do. Or do we have the choice to be non-egalitarian and just sit anywhere in the plane without paying for it? Remarkably as soon as it hits our wallet the egaliterian attitude miraculously has found it's end...
Dec 25, 2017, 8:34 am
#972
Join Date: Jul 2017
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum
Posts: 7
An update about Ultimate experience of my father since my first post.
Yesterday, we flew in Y from Dublin to Houston via Paris with AF. We were a group of 12, on 3 different reservations : 1 alone (no status), my father and me (so Ultimate and platinum) and 9 on the last one (no status). We didn’t inform the TA that we were on 3 different PNR.
DUB-CDG : flight almost full, but 3 seats for my father and me 👍 Just after take off, the purser came to welcome him (I was sleeping) and discreetly gave us 2 bottles of water and 2 oshibories (the ones from J). I had an interesting talk with her just before landing : nice crew 👍
CDG : we (so 12 PAXs) tried to go in the lounge (M Gates) (we really looked like a delegation !). The staff was quite suprised ! We were accepted (10 thanks to Ultimate status, 2 to platinum) but we had 2 successive different answers from 2 members of the staff : the first one was « il ne devrait pas y avoir de soucis, laissez moi juste appeler le manager pour voir comment procéder » 👍 but the second answer was « ça fait trop de monde il fallait nous prévenir avant ! »... 👎 Anyway, they finally took all the BPs, invited us to enter and came back 15min later with the BPs. The staff also said to my father that he must alert the Travel Asistant before, to give the names of guests. It thus allows the TA to register them...
CDG-IAH : upgrade for my father and me to premium economy ! That is always a nice surprise 👍 (it was my first long haul with this W and found it very uncomfortable to sleep... I had the feeling to be seated on a plaque of metal ! Maybe it is because the seat is quite old)
Nice welcome from the purser for my father.
IAH : Nothing. 👎
Does anyone know if there is something to expect from the IAH staff for the departure ?
Other significant Ulti experiences this year since my first post :
Just to add some informations to that topic (I am not sure if it has already been said) : the idea of the TA came, inter alia, from the meeting organised by FB in 2014. At the end of the day, one of the idea was to create a « YES DESK », to answer to any question/problem related with flights. One year later, the travel assistant was created. Here are the services offered at the beginning, but in reality there was almost only the dedicated phone number.
« Vos services
Progressively, this new status (if we can call it like that) was recognised on the iPads of the crew but most of the crews didn’t know what it corresponded to...! But I must admit that everything has been accelerated when it became official (creation of Ultimate level) : especially for the recognization from the crew, and the escort (before, it was just in case of big irregularities (and birthdays)). So lots of progress have been made ! I agree that the next step is to have more consistency. If FB is not able to uniformise the service provided to Ultis in each destination, at least they should send the list of services (especially about the escort at arrival / for departures) offered in each airport : at the beginning, 3 or 4 times, the station manager of different African airports came to see my father in the lounge or at the gate to tell him that they were waiting for him at the check-in !
Because the target of Ulti is also to save time : but it’s difficult to anticipate how early he must be at the airport, given that it is not sure that there will be an escort...
Thank’s for all the feedbacks you posted on this thread ; it is always very interesting ! I wish you a merry Christmas !
Luc
Yesterday, we flew in Y from Dublin to Houston via Paris with AF. We were a group of 12, on 3 different reservations : 1 alone (no status), my father and me (so Ultimate and platinum) and 9 on the last one (no status). We didn’t inform the TA that we were on 3 different PNR.
DUB-CDG : flight almost full, but 3 seats for my father and me 👍 Just after take off, the purser came to welcome him (I was sleeping) and discreetly gave us 2 bottles of water and 2 oshibories (the ones from J). I had an interesting talk with her just before landing : nice crew 👍
CDG : we (so 12 PAXs) tried to go in the lounge (M Gates) (we really looked like a delegation !). The staff was quite suprised ! We were accepted (10 thanks to Ultimate status, 2 to platinum) but we had 2 successive different answers from 2 members of the staff : the first one was « il ne devrait pas y avoir de soucis, laissez moi juste appeler le manager pour voir comment procéder » 👍 but the second answer was « ça fait trop de monde il fallait nous prévenir avant ! »... 👎 Anyway, they finally took all the BPs, invited us to enter and came back 15min later with the BPs. The staff also said to my father that he must alert the Travel Asistant before, to give the names of guests. It thus allows the TA to register them...
CDG-IAH : upgrade for my father and me to premium economy ! That is always a nice surprise 👍 (it was my first long haul with this W and found it very uncomfortable to sleep... I had the feeling to be seated on a plaque of metal ! Maybe it is because the seat is quite old)
Nice welcome from the purser for my father.
IAH : Nothing. 👎
Does anyone know if there is something to expect from the IAH staff for the departure ?
Other significant Ulti experiences this year since my first post :
- he flew CDG-MAN on a Flybe ticket (but Hop operated flight). He was firstly refused at 2G lounge (the reason was that he wasn’t on an AF marketed flight). 5 minutes later, as he was walking in the terminal, somebody from the lounge staff caught him up, and was confused because she didn’t notice he was Ulti ! He was thus allowed in the lounge : nice gesture. 👍
- 2 upgrades from J to P
- The escort at 2E arrival is very efficient and usefull. For my father this is the best advantage of Ulti : so much time saved.
- PNC : from nice attentions (first to be served for the dinner, whereas he was seated at the last row ; message written on a small card by the crew, waiting him on his seat ;... ) to nothing. Sometimes crew doesn’t even know what Ulti is ! It is too much inconstant.
Just to add some informations to that topic (I am not sure if it has already been said) : the idea of the TA came, inter alia, from the meeting organised by FB in 2014. At the end of the day, one of the idea was to create a « YES DESK », to answer to any question/problem related with flights. One year later, the travel assistant was created. Here are the services offered at the beginning, but in reality there was almost only the dedicated phone number.
« Vos services
- § Nous connaissons vos préférences et nous assurons qu'elles ont bien été prises en compte.
- § Nous vous proposons en avant-première des offres promotionnelles Flying Blue en accord avec vos besoins et ceux de votre famille.
- § Nous vous aidons et vous conseillons pour gérer vos Miles-Prime, billet prime, surclassement, et bien plus encore....
- § Nous prévoyons* une solution pour vous et vos proches en cas d'arrivée tardive à l'aéroport.
- § Nous étendons* vos privilèges Skypriority à votre famille lorsqu'elle voyage avec vous.
- § Nous fluidifions* votre parcours en vous faisant bénéficier d'un accompagnement jusqu'aux portes d'embarquement les jours de forte affluence.
- § Nous vous proposons une solution alternative adaptée en cas de vol retardé ou d'irrégularité.
- * Uniquement accessible à l'aéroport de Paris Charles de Gaulle durant la phase de test.
Progressively, this new status (if we can call it like that) was recognised on the iPads of the crew but most of the crews didn’t know what it corresponded to...! But I must admit that everything has been accelerated when it became official (creation of Ultimate level) : especially for the recognization from the crew, and the escort (before, it was just in case of big irregularities (and birthdays
)). So lots of progress have been made ! I agree that the next step is to have more consistency. If FB is not able to uniformise the service provided to Ultis in each destination, at least they should send the list of services (especially about the escort at arrival / for departures) offered in each airport : at the beginning, 3 or 4 times, the station manager of different African airports came to see my father in the lounge or at the gate to tell him that they were waiting for him at the check-in !Because the target of Ulti is also to save time : but it’s difficult to anticipate how early he must be at the airport, given that it is not sure that there will be an escort...
Thank’s for all the feedbacks you posted on this thread ; it is always very interesting ! I wish you a merry Christmas !
Luc
Last edited by Theluc; Dec 25, 2017 at 8:45 am
Dec 25, 2017, 12:27 pm
#973
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,939
You can have the Ulti “tag” on top of : platinum, PFL, Club2000/Skipper. The Ulti tag is valid for 2 years. So, if you are PFL-Ultimate and do not requalify for Ulti after 2 years, you come back to PFL.
Dec 25, 2017, 1:10 pm
#974
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,939
CDG : we (so 12 PAXs) tried to go in the lounge (M Gates) (we really looked like a delegation !). The staff was quite suprised ! We were accepted (10 thanks to Ultimate status, 2 to platinum) but we had 2 successive different answers from 2 members of the staff : the first one was « il ne devrait pas y avoir de soucis, laissez moi juste appeler le manager pour voir comment procéder » 👍 but the second answer was « ça fait trop de monde il fallait nous prévenir avant ! »... 👎 Anyway, they finally took all the BPs, invited us to enter and came back 15min later with the BPs. The staff also said to my father that he must alert the Travel Asistant before, to give the names of guests. It thus allows the TA to register them...
Bolding is mine. This is true. When traveling with a big party like that, it's important to advise the TA so they can inform the lounge(s) and plan accordingly for reserving you a space. Since I am Ulti, I have traveled several times with 5 to 8 colleagues and has always proactively informed the TA giving them all the names. They can also link the PNR, if needed. Your father should do that before your return flight, if you want to access the AF IAH lounge.
You are supposed to be escorted through security, but this is hit & miss. If it is not proposed spontaneously, tell your father to ask for it. But, I have to say that the size of your party is playing against you. I am sure they will not escort 12 people. Alternatively you and your father can be escorted and the rest of the group will go through the regular channels and will join you at the lounge.
Indeed a nice gesture, because your father did here a newbie mistake
WOW. Not bad ^. They had several opportunities to upgrade me from J to P since I am Ulti, but I didn't have any, despite several very full flights in J and a likely need for opups and also one heavy delay which would have been easily forgiven after an opup from J to P.
Same opinion. This is the best benefit of the Ulti program. We have really fought to obtain it and the battle continues to have it provided everywhere in a consistent manner.
Thanks for this historical part
You are 100% correct. Sometimes when you travel only with carryons and did OLCI you don't stop at the counter and probably miss some opportunities to have some Ulti benefits.
You are addressing here one of the main problem of the program : inconsistency and inhomogeneity. We don't need what to expect outside CDG (and even there sometimes...)
You are very welcome. Thank you for sharing your father's Ultimate experiences with us. Please continue
Other significant Ulti experiences this year since my first post :
- he flew CDG-MAN on a Flybe ticket (but Hop operated flight). He was firstly refused at 2G lounge (the reason was that he wasn’t on an AF marketed flight). 5 minutes later, as he was walking in the terminal, somebody from the lounge staff caught him up, and was confused because she didn’t notice he was Ulti ! He was thus allowed in the lounge : nice gesture. 👍
WOW. Not bad ^. They had several opportunities to upgrade me from J to P since I am Ulti, but I didn't have any, despite several very full flights in J and a likely need for opups and also one heavy delay which would have been easily forgiven after an opup from J to P.
Just to add some informations to that topic (I am not sure if it has already been said) : the idea of the TA came, inter alia, from the meeting organised by FB in 2014. At the end of the day, one of the idea was to create a « YES DESK », to answer to any question/problem related with flights. One year later, the travel assistant was created. Here are the services offered at the beginning, but in reality there was almost only the dedicated phone number.
« Vos services
« Vos services
- § Nous connaissons vos préférences et nous assurons qu'elles ont bien été prises en compte.
- § Nous vous proposons en avant-première des offres promotionnelles Flying Blue en accord avec vos besoins et ceux de votre famille.
- § Nous vous aidons et vous conseillons pour gérer vos Miles-Prime, billet prime, surclassement, et bien plus encore....
- § Nous prévoyons* une solution pour vous et vos proches en cas d'arrivée tardive à l'aéroport.
- § Nous étendons* vos privilèges Skypriority à votre famille lorsqu'elle voyage avec vous.
- § Nous fluidifions* votre parcours en vous faisant bénéficier d'un accompagnement jusqu'aux portes d'embarquement les jours de forte affluence.
- § Nous vous proposons une solution alternative adaptée en cas de vol retardé ou d'irrégularité.
- * Uniquement accessible à l'aéroport de Paris Charles de Gaulle durant la phase de test.
If FB is not able to uniformise the service provided to Ultis in each destination, at least they should send the list of services (especially about the escort at arrival / for departures) offered in each airport : at the beginning, 3 or 4 times, the station manager of different African airports came to see my father in the lounge or at the gate to tell him that they were waiting for him at the check-in !
Dec 25, 2017, 4:15 pm
#975
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Champaign, IL
Programs: AF/KL FB Ultimate Platinum for Life/Club 2000, UA MileagePlus
Posts: 524
. For shame! Poor habits die hard at AFKL, and I find their way of upgrading their top-tier customers borderline discriminatory. Since the epithet egalitarian has been used a few times lately, I advocate (once again) a certificate-based mechanism, which would offer everyone the same number of opportunities to get upgraded yearly. Vox clamantis in deserto 
...