May 9, 2019, 3:08 pm
Last edit by: Goldorak
FLYING BLUE ULTIMATE
Main facts
Ultimate is the top status in FB. It may be added to Club 2000 – Skipper status.
While other FB status (Silver/Gold/Platinum) are based on experience points earning (XP), Ultimate status is obtained by Ultimate XP (UXP) earning. UXPs are earned exclusively on AF- and KL-coded (= marketed) flights, whatever the operating airline.
Some examples :
- CDG-JFK AF-marketing, AF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-JFK DL-marketing, AF-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
- AMS-BOS KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- BOS-IND KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- SIN-SYD AF-marketing, QF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-FCO AZ-marketing, AZ-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
XP earned via AFKL Amex cards are not eligible (those are XP and not UXP).
To qualify for Ultimate, it is needed to have 900 UXP over a year. It is similar to the normal XP counter, resetting as soon as the tier is reached. Ultimate is valid for 1 year once granted. Note 03/2023 : the qualification system just changed from 1800 UXP over 2 years to 900 UXP/1 year. Some transitional measures are in place for the current Ultimate members. See here for details about handling of transition period :
https://www.flyingblue.com/fr/landin...m_content=main
Since 03/2023, a rollover of surplus UXP (over 900) is now possible to the next year and only to the next year (example : year 1, the member earns 2000UXP. At the end of year 1, only 900 UXP will be rolled-over to year 2 and the remaining 1100 UXP earned in Y1 will be lost and not be transferred to year 3. If during year 2, the member earned 1000 new (fresh) UXP, 100 will be rolled-over to year 3.
Hard benefits
- All FB Platinum/Club 2000-Skipper benefits
- Access to a Travel Assistant service 24/7. They are reachable by phone or by email. In practice, from 8 pm to 8 am CET, calls are taken by the Platinum line.
- highest priority on waiting list and in case of irrops
- Possibility to register up to 8 persons who can benefit from Sky Priority services and lounge access when traveling with the Ultimate member and on same PNR (lounge access is only in AFKL lounges here).
- one companion Platinum card
- when the Ultimate member is flying P, 2 guests are allowed in CDG P lounge.
- Zone 1 boarding, irrespective of travel class.
- Access to Hertz Platinum status
- four one-class upgrade certificates per membership year, requiring 1 from W to J, or 2 from Y to J. Upgrades are confirmed instantly at the time of booking (via the Travel Assistant). One voucher = one way. Vouchers can also be used by one of the 8 registered friend/family members travelling by themselves. In case of a long-haul flight with a medium-haul connection/feeder (e.g. CDG-AMS-JFK), the medium-haul segment will be upgraded also with still only one voucher used. In case of 2 long-haul flights in connection (e,g. DXB-CDG-JFK), the use of 2 vouchers is required to upgrade the 2 segments. Upgrade vouchers are usable only on AF- or KL-marketing and operating flights and the PNR must contains only the AFKL flights to be upgraded (if the PNR contains other non-AFKL flights, you cannot upgrade even just the AFKL flights).
The upgrade coupons are valid as soon as you reach Ultimate and is valid for 12 months. The vouchers need to be used within the membership year, but can be applied for travel post expiry date.
Rules for eligible booking classes for the upgrade vouchers are described below :
AF flights, long-haul
Premium Eco to Business
Original booking class : A, S, W
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico, including LAX-PPT)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, C
KL flights, long-haul
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, I.
Airline-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
- AF, KL and contract staff at airports have a popup message on their computer screen when checking-in an Ultimate pax or when scanning a BP at the lounge (AFKL lounges only) asking them to be attentive at any special request of the Ultimate pax. See also below for airport-specific soft benefits. There is no known official policy for operational upgrades of Ultimates, but Ultimate members have all reported on FT a higher rate of op-up (but those remain rare !).
- AF and KL cabin crews are instructed to provide extra care and attentions on-board. It can take different forms : special greetings, extra amenities (pillow, oshibori, etc), F&B from the upper class, upgrades on board (Y to J medium haul, W to J or Y to W long haul), earlier and quicker meal service. This is not systematic and is up to the appreciation of the crew. Based on the reports of Ultimate members of this forum, AF crews seems to be more compliant than KL crews with those directives, although there has been several reports in this thread of nice attentions provided by KL crews.- Unlimited downloads (any day) in AF PLAY app.
Other Skyteam airlines do not provide any extra service or attentions to FB Ultimate passengers.
Airport-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
All benefits below should be understood for departure, unless otherwise noted. In addition to what is mentioned below, it has been reported several cases of expedited transfers organised by AFKL staff in case of short/endangered connection at various airports.
Please complete/edit this list as needed.
AFKL HUBS
Amsterdam
- AMS : some reserved tables in the Non-Schengen lounges. Reserved area in the Schengen lounge (need to ask staff at long entrance). Pre-boarding sometimes granted at the gate.
Paris CDG
Paris ORY
EUROPE
Austria
- VIE: no special treatment to report
Croatia
- DBV: no special treatment to report
- SPU: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Czech Republic
- PRG: no special treatment to report. Pre-boarding refused.
Denmark
- CPH: no special treatment to report
France (non-hubs)
- AJA: no special treatment to reportMain facts
Ultimate is the top status in FB. It may be added to Club 2000 – Skipper status.
While other FB status (Silver/Gold/Platinum) are based on experience points earning (XP), Ultimate status is obtained by Ultimate XP (UXP) earning. UXPs are earned exclusively on AF- and KL-coded (= marketed) flights, whatever the operating airline.
Some examples :
- CDG-JFK AF-marketing, AF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-JFK DL-marketing, AF-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
- AMS-BOS KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- BOS-IND KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- SIN-SYD AF-marketing, QF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-FCO AZ-marketing, AZ-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
XP earned via AFKL Amex cards are not eligible (those are XP and not UXP).
To qualify for Ultimate, it is needed to have 900 UXP over a year. It is similar to the normal XP counter, resetting as soon as the tier is reached. Ultimate is valid for 1 year once granted. Note 03/2023 : the qualification system just changed from 1800 UXP over 2 years to 900 UXP/1 year. Some transitional measures are in place for the current Ultimate members. See here for details about handling of transition period :
https://www.flyingblue.com/fr/landin...m_content=main
Since 03/2023, a rollover of surplus UXP (over 900) is now possible to the next year and only to the next year (example : year 1, the member earns 2000UXP. At the end of year 1, only 900 UXP will be rolled-over to year 2 and the remaining 1100 UXP earned in Y1 will be lost and not be transferred to year 3. If during year 2, the member earned 1000 new (fresh) UXP, 100 will be rolled-over to year 3.
Hard benefits
- All FB Platinum/Club 2000-Skipper benefits
- Access to a Travel Assistant service 24/7. They are reachable by phone or by email. In practice, from 8 pm to 8 am CET, calls are taken by the Platinum line.
- highest priority on waiting list and in case of irrops
- Possibility to register up to 8 persons who can benefit from Sky Priority services and lounge access when traveling with the Ultimate member and on same PNR (lounge access is only in AFKL lounges here).
- one companion Platinum card
- when the Ultimate member is flying P, 2 guests are allowed in CDG P lounge.
- Zone 1 boarding, irrespective of travel class.
- Access to Hertz Platinum status
- four one-class upgrade certificates per membership year, requiring 1 from W to J, or 2 from Y to J. Upgrades are confirmed instantly at the time of booking (via the Travel Assistant). One voucher = one way. Vouchers can also be used by one of the 8 registered friend/family members travelling by themselves. In case of a long-haul flight with a medium-haul connection/feeder (e.g. CDG-AMS-JFK), the medium-haul segment will be upgraded also with still only one voucher used. In case of 2 long-haul flights in connection (e,g. DXB-CDG-JFK), the use of 2 vouchers is required to upgrade the 2 segments. Upgrade vouchers are usable only on AF- or KL-marketing and operating flights and the PNR must contains only the AFKL flights to be upgraded (if the PNR contains other non-AFKL flights, you cannot upgrade even just the AFKL flights).
The upgrade coupons are valid as soon as you reach Ultimate and is valid for 12 months. The vouchers need to be used within the membership year, but can be applied for travel post expiry date.
Rules for eligible booking classes for the upgrade vouchers are described below :
AF flights, long-haul
Premium Eco to Business
Original booking class : A, S, W
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico, including LAX-PPT)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, C
KL flights, long-haul
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, I.
Airline-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
- AF, KL and contract staff at airports have a popup message on their computer screen when checking-in an Ultimate pax or when scanning a BP at the lounge (AFKL lounges only) asking them to be attentive at any special request of the Ultimate pax. See also below for airport-specific soft benefits. There is no known official policy for operational upgrades of Ultimates, but Ultimate members have all reported on FT a higher rate of op-up (but those remain rare !).
- AF and KL cabin crews are instructed to provide extra care and attentions on-board. It can take different forms : special greetings, extra amenities (pillow, oshibori, etc), F&B from the upper class, upgrades on board (Y to J medium haul, W to J or Y to W long haul), earlier and quicker meal service. This is not systematic and is up to the appreciation of the crew. Based on the reports of Ultimate members of this forum, AF crews seems to be more compliant than KL crews with those directives, although there has been several reports in this thread of nice attentions provided by KL crews.- Unlimited downloads (any day) in AF PLAY app.
Other Skyteam airlines do not provide any extra service or attentions to FB Ultimate passengers.
Airport-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
All benefits below should be understood for departure, unless otherwise noted. In addition to what is mentioned below, it has been reported several cases of expedited transfers organised by AFKL staff in case of short/endangered connection at various airports.
Please complete/edit this list as needed.
AFKL HUBS
Amsterdam
- AMS : some reserved tables in the Non-Schengen lounges. Reserved area in the Schengen lounge (need to ask staff at long entrance). Pre-boarding sometimes granted at the gate.
Paris CDG
- CDG 2E:
- Departure : Escort from check-in to immigration in the morning (super fast track). Reserved space at K/L/M lounges. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate before beginning of general boarding
- Arrival : access to dedicated lane at passport control, all the way to the left, follow the "ULTIMATE" sign.
- Departure : There is a special Ultimate check-in counter in the SkyP zone (on the left of terminal). Reserved room in the lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate before beginning of general boarding. Escort is provided from the counter to security (skipping the line).
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
- Departure : Reserved space in the lounge
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
Paris ORY
- Departure : Reserved space at Schengen and non-Schengen lounges. Pre-boarding upon request at the lounge.
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
EUROPE
Austria
- VIE: no special treatment to report
Croatia
- DBV: no special treatment to report
- SPU: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Czech Republic
- PRG: no special treatment to report. Pre-boarding refused.
Denmark
- CPH: no special treatment to report
France (non-hubs)
- BES: no special treatment to report
- BIQ: no special treatment to report
- BOD: pre-boarding from lounge to plane inconsistently proposed
- CDG: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
- LYS: Escort from lounge to plane when flying from B gates provided upon request . Preboarding with escort to the plane consistently provided.
- MPL: pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane, sometimes proposed (AF agent comes to the contract lounge to meet the Ultimate guest)
- MRS: no special treatment to report
- NCE: Reserved area in Infinity lounge (inconsistently provided : seems to be provided only when lounge crowded). Pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane, sometimes proposed.
- NTE: no special treatment to report
- ORY: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
- PUF: bypass queue at security and pre-boarding provided upon request
- RNS: bypass queue at security and pre-boarding provided upon request
- TLS: Escort from check in to lounge inconsistently provided. Pre-boarding consistently provided
Germany
- BER: no special treatment to report
- DUS: no special treatment to report
- FRA: no special treatment to report
- HAM: no special treatment to report
- HAJ: No special treatment to report.
- MUC: Reserved area in the lounge, escort from lounge to plane with pre-boarding proposed.
- STR: reserved area in the lounge, pre-boarding
Greece
- ATH: no special treatment to report
- HER: no special treatment to report
- JTR: no special treatment to report
Hungary
- BUD: escort through security from check-in to lounge proposed
Ireland
- DUB: no special treatment to report
Italy
- BLQ: escort from check-in to lounge, and through security to plane.
- BRI: no special treatment to report
- CTA: no special treatment to report
- FCO: no special treatment to report
- FLR: no special treatment to report
- LIN: no special treatment to report
- MXP: pre-boarding granted by request
- VCE: escort through security from check-in to lounge, pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane (not always consistently proposed)
- NAP: no special treatment to report
Netherlands
- AMS: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
Norway
- OSL: no special treatment to report
- TRF: no special treatment to report
- KRS: no special treatment to report
- SVG: no special treatment to report
Poland
- WAW: no special treatment to report
- KRK: no special treatment to report
- GDN: no special treatment to report
Portugal
- LIS: pre-boarding proposed upon request
Russia
- SVO: no special treatment to report
- LED: no special treatment to report
Spain
- AGP: no special treatment to report
- BCN: no special treatment to report
- MAD: no special treatment to report
- PMI: no special treatment to report
- SVQ: no special treatment to report
- TFS: no special treatment to report
- VLC: no special treatment to report
Sweden
- ARN: no special treatment to report
- GOT: no special treatment to report
Switzerland
- GVA: pre-boarding upon request. Reserved area in the lounge
- ZRH: no special treatment
United Kingdom
- ABZ: no special treatment to report
- EDI: no special treatment to report
- LHR: no special treatment to report
NORTH AMERICA
Canada
- YUL: Escort from check-in to lounge upon request. Reserved area in lounge, pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane
- YYZ: escort on arrival through immigration, consistently offered. / Escort from check-in to lounge and from lounge to airplane
- YQB: escort from check-in to lounge proposed
- YVR: no special treatment to report
USA
- ATL: no special treatment to report (in connection)
- BOS: escort through security from check-in to lounge, pre-boarding, all consistently provided mostly spontaneously, sometimes upon request. A separate room in the AF lounge is also proposed.
- DTW: no special treatment to report (starting from DTW or in connection)
- IAD: escort through security from check-in to lounge upon request, but inconsistently provided. Reserved area at the lounge.
- IAH: no special treatment to report
- JFK (AF only / terminal 1) : reserved table in the dining area of the lounge (upstairs),
- JFK (KL only / terminal 4) : no special treatments to report.
- LAX: no special treatment to report
- ORD: On arrival, escort through immigration (not consistently provided). On departure, escort through security to lounge and from lounge to plane (pre-boarding)
- MSP: no special treatment to report, except one case of special DL Elite VIP treatment with expedited immigration and Porsche transfer to/from lounge (not a regular benefit to expect)
- SEA: pre-boarding with escort to plane
- SFO: reserved area in lounge
Mexico
- MEX (Terminal 1): escort through security to lounge with access to dedicated space. Ride from lounge to gate. Sometimes escort on arrival
CENTRAL & SOUTH AMERICA
- BOG: no special treatment to report
- LIM: escort to lounge, provided spontaneously
- GIG: Pre-boarding upon request.
- GRU: escort in case of short connection upon request, inconsistently provided; as of 02/2024 pre-boarding offered at check-in and provided by gate-staff (inconsistently provided).
- SCL: as of 03/2024 escort to lounge offered at departure check-in, pick-up from lounge and pre-boarding done
- EZE: escort to lounge with special crew lane for immigration provided spontaneously
ASIA / PACIFIC
- BKK: escort through security from check-in to lounge, upon request but inconsistently proposed. In connection : escort in case of short connection (better to request it before departure).
- BLR: escort from lounge to gate, pre-boarding provided
- BOM : escort from plane to immigration, and from checkin to the lounge
- DEL: as of 01/2024 escort upon arrival; proactive pre-departure call to arrange terminal entry via VIP entrance and escort to gate for pre-boarding (if lounge used, offered to pick up for pre-boarding)
- HKG: no special treatment to report.
- HND: Arrival : new 09/2023 = escort through immigration. Departure : escort from check-in desk to private (crew) security, proposed spontaneously
- KIX: Arrival : escort through immigration, wait at baggage claim. Departure : escort from check-in desk to lounge All proposed spontaneously
- SIN: no special treatment to report
CARIBBEAN & INDIAN OCEAN
- CUR: no special treatment to report, there is no (sky)priority lane for security or immigration, but escort/short track is available for 100 $.
- HAV: at departure, escort from check in counters until security checks. Pre-boarding offered. No escort at arrival. No reserved space in Lounge.
- FDF: No reserved space in Lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate.
- MRU: escort on arrival through immigration. Unknown for departures (no data point)
- PTP: Reserved table in lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the lounge with escort from lounge to plane.
- RUN: Pre-boarding proposed at check-in and in the lounge, with escort from lounge to plane. Reserved seats in lounge
- SXM: Escort for incoming transit pax (from/to AF flight) through passport controls and security, pre-boarding pro-actively offered for AF departure
MIDDLE EAST
- AUH : no special treatment to report
- BEY: no special treatment to report
- DXB: escort from check-in to lounge and from lounge to plane, all upon request, consistently provided. Access to the Ahlan lounge (normally reserved for P pax) instead of Skyteam lounge.
- JED: no special treatment to report
- RUH: no special treatment to report
- IST: no special treatment to report
AFRICA
- AGA: escort from check in to lounge and from lounge to aircraft, provided spontaneously
- CAI: no special treatment to report
- CMN: escort on arrival through immigration (not always consistently provided)
- CPT: escort from counter to lounge, provided spontaneously
- JNB: escort from counter to lounge (no fast track at immigration), provided spontaneously
- LOS: no special treatment to report
- RAK: escort on arrival, upon request (not provided on departure)
- RBA: on departure : escort to lounge and to plane, provided spontaneously.
- TUN: escort on arrival through immigration provided. Escort from check-in to lounge provided
- ZNZ: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Flying Blue Platinum Ultimate Status
May 27, 2019, 9:59 am
#2086
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Champaign, IL
Programs: AF/KL FB Ultimate Platinum for Life/Club 2000, UA MileagePlus
Posts: 524
Minimalist Ultimate service
More than 900 UXP year-to-date on my account and the perception that the Ultimate program is getting better & more consistently implemented... Service on the ground is overall pretty good at CDG, thanks to assistance to cut lines for immigration both ways, and special attention at the lounge. At outstations, this is really a lottery, with customer experience ranging from very good (e.g. IAH) to very bad (e.g. SIN & HKG).. On-board, I must say I have enjoyed overall very good and very consistent service on all flights. Nothing spectacular but typically nice attention and recognition of my Ultimate status. Even my long-haul KLM flights have been quite good !... It has taken (too much) time but it seems that messages have percolated through the AF organization.
). The preamble to the long haul was to say the least mundane. At the CDG-2E-K lounge, I was offered to be accompanied to the dedicated Ultimate space, which I declined, preferring to sit in the work area. No reserved shower, no newspaper, no pre- or post-boarding offer, and of course no escort to the gate 
. There, a ghastly mess awaited me. The huge, half-an-hour-plus line defied the purpose of being Ultimate 
. Once aboard, the Ultimate experience was again minimalist, and could be summarized to the purser asking for my choice of an entree (which she did to my neighbors as well). Inspired by breton1fr's anecdote, I ventured asking the chief purser for her personal definition of an Ultimate service as we were starting our descent to PEK. In a surreal exchange, she explained to me that while guidelines have been given by the management, pursers have the freedom to interpret how these guidelines ought to be implemented. I suggested that the meal service could have been expedited, as is done on certain flights (2:30'+ from take-off to clearing the trays and shutting off the lights is simply too long ). She acquiesced, but immediately responded that they have no obligation to do so. I suggested that a glass of champagne or wine from P goes a long way. She nodded again, but said that there is nothing systematic in this form of commercial gesture (there was one PAX in P that night). Stepping on eggshells, I finally asked what distinguishes from her perspective the treatment of Ultimates from that of any John Doe flying in J. There was an embarrassed silence prefacing a comment on the personalized greetings, which, she acknowledged it, were offered to most if not all top-tier PAXs aboard. Equally flabbergasting is the misconception of what the program is about, and what is required to qualify. She knew that a substantial flying activity was needed (the notion of XPs and UXPs was all Greek to her), and that Ultimate was the next level after PFL 
. Needless to say that at PEK, as we parked on the tarmac, far away from the gates, she did not invite me to join the P PAX in the minivan that drove to the terminal .
Prelude to the AF382 night flight to PEK.
May 27, 2019, 2:56 pm
#2087
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,939
Ouh this is bad. 
on my side, I can report another excellent treatment on-board a medium-haul flight. Was flying Y. Once I was identified, and before I was seated, the chief purser invited me to seat on row 1 and had full J service and all attention from the crew ^. This is happening more and more frequently to me on medium-haul and so I can guess it’s a guideline that may have been given to the medium-haul crews : if space is available in J, consider inviting the Ulti pax to seat at the front. But it’s not an “official” upgrade as your BP/seat doesn’t change. Very pleasant I would say
on my side, I can report another excellent treatment on-board a medium-haul flight. Was flying Y. Once I was identified, and before I was seated, the chief purser invited me to seat on row 1 and had full J service and all attention from the crew ^. This is happening more and more frequently to me on medium-haul and so I can guess it’s a guideline that may have been given to the medium-haul crews : if space is available in J, consider inviting the Ulti pax to seat at the front. But it’s not an “official” upgrade as your BP/seat doesn’t change. Very pleasant I would say
May 27, 2019, 3:05 pm
#2088
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 191
Thanks for sharing. Had I had the chief purser's attitude I would have been fired long ago. With no excuse. It is one thing to say "sorry, we should have done better" and another to reckon she does not give a damn about the customers who most contribute to her payslip.
I would encourage you to escalate this and keep on making the crew sensitive to customer loyalty.
I would encourage you to escalate this and keep on making the crew sensitive to customer loyalty.
May 28, 2019, 12:21 am
#2089
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: Eurostar Carte Blanche, SBB-CFF-FFS GA-AG, SNCF Grand Voyageur LeClub
Posts: 7,836
There seem to be two flaws in the system:
1) Giving pursers and other staff personal discretion about how to interpret the guidelines they have been given (probably it's some vague stuff such as "be extra nice to them, make sure they are well, recognise that they are on board" - and not some hard coded protocol such as "Always ask them first for their meal choice; when in Y, always bring them bottle of water and refreshing towel from J; keep some space for their hand luggage; etc")
2) The fact that there are crew members that within the room for manoeuvring they are given chose to operate at the lower end. Why? What benefit for them to not care?
Separately, I wonder whether there isn't more space for difference-making on the ground than on board. Once you are on board, what makes the biggest difference is which cabin you travel in. Since on-board upgrades happen (see Goldorak's post) but for good reasons cannot be made systematic, there is little else that can be done: personal welcome, a glass of wine from the P menu, first choice of meal, space for hand luggage - what else? All the other benefits that do or should exist happen on the ground or in the computer systems: guaranteed seat, seat blocking, access to P lounge, escort to the plane, escort through immigration and security, highest spot on the upgrade list, effectiveness of the travel assistant, and so on.... all of those things make a real difference and require staff, investment into facilities and training of people. That's not an excuse for the lame and indifferent performance of some crews, but still a fact.
1) Giving pursers and other staff personal discretion about how to interpret the guidelines they have been given (probably it's some vague stuff such as "be extra nice to them, make sure they are well, recognise that they are on board" - and not some hard coded protocol such as "Always ask them first for their meal choice; when in Y, always bring them bottle of water and refreshing towel from J; keep some space for their hand luggage; etc")
2) The fact that there are crew members that within the room for manoeuvring they are given chose to operate at the lower end. Why? What benefit for them to not care?
Separately, I wonder whether there isn't more space for difference-making on the ground than on board. Once you are on board, what makes the biggest difference is which cabin you travel in. Since on-board upgrades happen (see Goldorak's post) but for good reasons cannot be made systematic, there is little else that can be done: personal welcome, a glass of wine from the P menu, first choice of meal, space for hand luggage - what else? All the other benefits that do or should exist happen on the ground or in the computer systems: guaranteed seat, seat blocking, access to P lounge, escort to the plane, escort through immigration and security, highest spot on the upgrade list, effectiveness of the travel assistant, and so on.... all of those things make a real difference and require staff, investment into facilities and training of people. That's not an excuse for the lame and indifferent performance of some crews, but still a fact.
May 28, 2019, 5:10 am
#2090
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Paris and around the WW
Programs: AF/KLM Club2000 Ultimate / M&M HON Circle / ALL Diamond / Hertz President Circle
Posts: 1,040
Thanks for sharing. Had I had the chief purser's attitude I would have been fired long ago. With no excuse. It is one thing to say "sorry, we should have done better" and another to reckon she does not give a damn about the customers who most contribute to her payslip.
I would encourage you to escalate this and keep on making the crew sensitive to customer loyalty.
I would encourage you to escalate this and keep on making the crew sensitive to customer loyalty.
I escalated last year when the chief pursuer told me that she would prefer to upgrade a low frequent flyer than myself as I already knew way too well the J and P cabin... what the h*** ?
I got offered a champ' bottle
My feeling is that most of the Ulti benefits on board systematically depend of the crew. Some do not care at all and some go the extra mile to make you feel "special".
As long as there gonna be some attendants that believe they can treat their (best) customers the way they want without any risk (warning, getting fired...), I am a little bit worried that nothing will improve...
May 28, 2019, 7:52 am
#2091
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: 🇸🇬 🇭🇰 🇫🇷
Programs: Many
Posts: 4,749
Very valid point. And from my perspective not limited to Ulti. I would then say that overall, onboard service with AF depends on the crew.
May 28, 2019, 7:59 am
#2092
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: MAN
Programs: FB Platinum
Posts: 500
Inconsistencies exist at every level at AF and, to an extent, KL on board. I'm not, nor am I likely to be, ULTI but as Plat I've had the full range of experiences on AF; from being completely ignored and shabbily treated in J to being ultra pampered in Y. I even got a P champagne AND meal in J once (granted - I was struggling with the J choices and the purser took pity on me). On KL the service has generally been commensurate with my status as it's moved up but occasionally they have gone the extra mile - my partner was thrilled when the captain came over and chatted to her on one trip.
May 29, 2019, 3:14 pm
#2094
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,939
May 30, 2019, 1:15 am
#2095
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Switzerland
Programs: AFKL Flying Blue Platinum Ultimate, Marriott Bonvoy Ambassador Elite
Posts: 369
I was very skeptical of the check-in by TA service, but I must say it was great. The opening time for my check-in was at midnight, and I expected to receive the boarding passes by the TA team let's say in the morning. When I woke up, I found the boarding passes and the mail had been sent at 2am in the morning! (CEST time)
Moreover: Pre-boarding granted this morning at MXP upon request.
I also got offered a voucher for full breakfast (orange juice, coffee, croissant) at the Briciole Bar on airside area, since the lounge was opening at the boarding time (5:30am, flight at 6:00am). Never happened to me before in MXP, but I'm not sure this has been offered just as substitute for the lounge (so at all J passengers) or as a special benefit for Ultimate.
CDG-MXP flight was uneventful. Zero recognition.
No fast(er) immigration when connecting to 2E-M from 2F.
At 2E-M lounge, I had to ask where the reserved area was - the agent said "whoops" when I asked explicitly for it.
Still secluded and with no windows (one of the things I like most of 2E-M), but at least it's very quiet compared to the rest.
Moreover: Pre-boarding granted this morning at MXP upon request.
I also got offered a voucher for full breakfast (orange juice, coffee, croissant) at the Briciole Bar on airside area, since the lounge was opening at the boarding time (5:30am, flight at 6:00am). Never happened to me before in MXP, but I'm not sure this has been offered just as substitute for the lounge (so at all J passengers) or as a special benefit for Ultimate.
CDG-MXP flight was uneventful. Zero recognition.
No fast(er) immigration when connecting to 2E-M from 2F.
At 2E-M lounge, I had to ask where the reserved area was - the agent said "whoops" when I asked explicitly for it.
Still secluded and with no windows (one of the things I like most of 2E-M), but at least it's very quiet compared to the rest.
May 30, 2019, 7:04 am
#2096
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,939
Was flying to Asia yesterday (in J). Good Ulti treatment at check-in and at the L lounge (I was happy for once to leave from L as AF seems to always make me depart from K). Not a problem specific of Ulti, but I think that the quality of food offer in lounges has really deteriorated since last September (while the quality of wines and Champagnes has improved). There was nothing really appealing to eat in the lounge. Cheese was reduced at its “portion congrue” of a single industrial cheese (a shame for a French airline in a Lounge in France).
Boarding was a disaster. @Macaron54 : it was like your boarding to PEK. See pictures below. About 150 persons were packed in the jetway without moving for 15 minutes. People (me included) were even waiting just after te boarding gate because we couldn’t enter the full jetway.
On-board, this time nothing special although I was clearly identified as an Ultimate because I was greeted by the global chief purser and the J one (and they asked me several times during the flight of everything was OK). Not a bad flight at all, but a standard good AF flight without going the extra mile (nothing came from P ). Before boarding, I was also secretly hoping for an opup from J to P because the flight was heavily booked and was showing P1 J1, but no !
Nothing also on arrival (but was not expecting anything)
Boarding was a disaster. @Macaron54 : it was like your boarding to PEK. See pictures below. About 150 persons were packed in the jetway without moving for 15 minutes. People (me included) were even waiting just after te boarding gate because we couldn’t enter the full jetway.
On-board, this time nothing special although I was clearly identified as an Ultimate because I was greeted by the global chief purser and the J one (and they asked me several times during the flight of everything was OK). Not a bad flight at all, but a standard good AF flight without going the extra mile (nothing came from P
). Before boarding, I was also secretly hoping for an opup from J to P because the flight was heavily booked and was showing P1 J1, but no !Nothing also on arrival (but was not expecting anything)
May 30, 2019, 7:47 am
#2097
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Champaign, IL
Programs: AF/KL FB Ultimate Platinum for Life/Club 2000, UA MileagePlus
Posts: 524
Was flying to Asia yesterday (in J). Good Ulti treatment at check-in and at the L lounge (I was happy for once to leave from L as AF seems to always make me depart from K). Not a problem specific of Ulti, but I think that the quality of food offer in lounges has really deteriorated since last September (while the quality of wines and Champagnes has improved). There was nothing really appealing to eat in the lounge. Cheese was reduced at its “portion congrue” of a single industrial cheese (a shame for a French airline in a Lounge in France).
Boarding was a disaster. @Macaron54 : it was like your boarding to PEK. See pictures below. About 150 persons were packed in the jetway without moving for 15 minutes. People (me included) were even waiting just after te boarding gate because we couldn’t enter the full jetway.
On-board, this time nothing special although I was clearly identified as an Ultimate because I was greeted by the global chief purser and the J one (and they asked me several times during the flight of everything was OK). Not a bad flight at all, but a standard good AF flight without going the extra mile (nothing came from P ). Before boarding, I was also secretly hoping for an opup from J to P because the flight was heavily booked and was showing P1 J1, but no !
Nothing also on arrival (but was not expecting anything)
Boarding was a disaster. @Macaron54 : it was like your boarding to PEK. See pictures below. About 150 persons were packed in the jetway without moving for 15 minutes. People (me included) were even waiting just after te boarding gate because we couldn’t enter the full jetway.
On-board, this time nothing special although I was clearly identified as an Ultimate because I was greeted by the global chief purser and the J one (and they asked me several times during the flight of everything was OK). Not a bad flight at all, but a standard good AF flight without going the extra mile (nothing came from P
). Before boarding, I was also secretly hoping for an opup from J to P because the flight was heavily booked and was showing P1 J1, but no !Nothing also on arrival (but was not expecting anything)
May 30, 2019, 10:13 am
#2098
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: San Francisco, CA
Programs: Flying Blue Platinum, JetBlue Mosaic, Hyatt Globalist, Alaska MVP Gold.
Posts: 1,962
It's beyond puzzling that AF has apparently decided that the implementation and experience of the program on board is entirely up to the cabin crew.
May 31, 2019, 10:10 am
#2100
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: CDG/AMS
Programs: FB Plat for life, FB PC, M&M FT, Hertz President (+ many low tier cards)
Posts: 2,777