San Gottardo

Suppose one gets an opup to Premiere at OLCI or at the counter. Would one have access to the Premiere lounge at CDG? Or is the rule that it has to be a paid (by money or miles) ticket?

Zembla

From experience I can confirm that La Premiere lounge access is not included in the OPUP.

olivedel

Same for me, no lounge access either departing or connecting in Paris.

Zembla

However, with buy-UP's or miles-UP's the lounge is included.

Goldorak

Indeed no lounge access, but for my last op-up of that kind (from J to P), which happened at the gate in CDG (at boarding), the AF agent closed her boarding station after me and accompanied me to the plane to introduce me to the crew. Nice touch

tpatta

Very nice. ^^

orbitmic

+1! -- as is the concept of "last upgrade of that kind" which suggests that there has been more than a single occasion! Sadly never experience a P upgrade on AF, or rather the only one I ever was "offered" (on the flight after mine in compensation for accepting to be taken off the flight which was oversold and for which they needed VDB's from J) was then withdrawn when they realised that they did not need my seat after all (but my first row window lost for good and I was sent back to a middle aisle seat

Goldorak

Unfortunately, it is very rare. The one I mentioned was exactly a year ago. Overall, I think I had 5 op-ups from J to P on AF in about 15 years. I'm not complaining

orbitmic

I think that's an excellent op up rate from J to P! I'm on zero!!

cityflyer369

I had one opup to Premiere in nearly 10 years as a Plat customer. So 5 in 15 years seems to be a good cut.
I didn't get access to the lounge either btw.

olivedel

I myst saying that in 4 years of Plat, I enjoyed 3 opups from J to P, including one DL marketed flight on AF metal and one award ticket, the other being a regular Z class one

San Gottardo

I got op-upped to P maybe 3 or 4 times in 15 years of FB Rouge/Platinum.

Now what does that tell you? Is it good or bad? Some may say "scandalous, so many years as a top tier passenger, and you only get 2-3 op ups". But here's the reality: I do most of my longhaul flying with airlines other than AF. So maybe 10-12 legs year on AF. Then some of those are on planes that do not have First Class anyway, so I can't get upgraded. And on some of them I was booked in First Class anyway, so no way that I could get an op-up. So let's do the math again:

15 years * 11 legs = 165 flights
50% on planes without First = 83 flights
25% booked in First anyway = 42 flights
25% where an upgrade would have been possible = 42 flights

So out of 42 flights I got op-upped 4 times. That's 10%, which is actually quite good. And what is more: 3 out of those 4 times the upgrade was not only for me but for my entire family, including 2 kids (despite "special meals" ordered before). That's actually really good.

So I do not complain about upgrade frequency, and I never have. I have been upgraded much more frequently to First with EK I think, but mostly on shorter routes in the Gulf region where they hopelessly oversell anyway. Upgrades to First on longhaul on Lufthansa and Swiss: yeah, maybe slightly more, but not dramatically more and certainly no "systematic" upgrading.

So the upgrade probability is not an issue for with AF. They manage their inventory well enough/resp. their J class isn't in high demand anyway, so rarely oversold, so there is no need for op-ups.

What for me was/is an issue with AF's upgrading is how and whom they upgrade. Op-ups, at least in the past, were given along criteria that were intransparent other than knowing that it was some mysterious score that determined it. At least I come from the (very European) school of thought where I believe that upgrades are not an entitlement of top tiers, but do happen when there is overselling of the lower classes, i.e. op-ups. But when op-ups happen I do expect top tiers to be top on the list, and not those that have some funny score which does not sufficiently take into account FFP status. The much bigger grievance with AF is of course that all the scoring and other policies do get overwritten and ignored when the number 1 mission is to be fulfilled: upgrade employees on leisure trips, their direct dependents, the acquaintances of direct dependents. A slap in the face for those that are told repeatedly that they are the company's most valuable customers.

I do not complain about having had only 3 or 4 op-ups to First. But what annoys is me that it could have been 5 or 6 if it weren't for the hairdresser of the wife of the CdC who got it instead. And it is not sitting in J instead which annoys me, it is the huge discrepancy between the "our best customers" claim and the reality.

So when you all quote your figures of how many op-ups you had, can you put them in context? Is it a lot relative to the number of flights were you could have been upgraded? Or not? Good or bad?

orbitmic

My maths is easy: since the early 2000s, I have been upgraded 0 times from J to P out of >120 paid AF J flights where a J to P upgrade would have been possible. My SO has been upgraded 0 times from J to P out of >50 paid AF J flights where a J to P upgrade would have been possible.

I fully agree with people who say that upgrades are not a given, that if people want to travel in a certain class they should pay for it, etc., and I have absolutely no issue with how AF ascribes upgrades, it is for them to decide how to best "share the love".

Nonetheless, while upgrades are a pure gift and not a given, in my humble opinion, it is certainly not irrational to include upgrade probability in one's utility calculation when deciding on which airline to fly. While I never take upgrades for granted, there are thus other airlines on which I know that I have empirically been upgraded to P in 10% of my J trips or so. Call me unfair, but it is part of my calculation alongside many other factors (fare, comfort and product, IRROPS experience, timings, miles, chance of downgrade, flexibility, etc) and has participated in my flying AF long haul J much less regularly than I used to.

San Gottardo

100% agree. My point was to give some context to the numbers quoted by people (because at least they didn't mean anything to me without that context).

RigpigMalta

Classic , but so often true.

I have been given one Opup to P from J in 5 years, from PNR to CDG. Knackered slept (badly) all through it (as usual because most African departures are very late PM) Kept the BP as a memento. Worst thing was, even though I slept fitfully some bigwig actor or a 'somebody" was onboard in P and the crew were constantly fawning over him in the cabin. (He was C2000, I know this only because I saw his tags on his hand luggage)