Simon

exAC: I don't doubt what you posted about CB slagging the competitors -- do you have an actual quote, for interest's sake?

Simon

tcook052

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...iness/Canadian

shore9

well older planes = higher maintenance costs, and higher fuel costs per mile than the newer planes being developed these days. Leg room isn't exactly an issue, however if both airlines have the same price and similar departure time, which one do you think that I would chose??

Simon

[my mistake]

tcook052

Sorry Simon, the story doesn't directly quote anything CB said at the NYC do. The quote you mentioned was written by some stock analyst:


In his report, Mr. Cherniavsky speculated that if Jetsgo vanished from the domestic market on April 1, then seat capacity would fall 2.4 per cent instead of rising 5.4 per cent.

Amid high jet fuel prices, cutthroat fares and aging Jetsgo aircraft, "there is indeed a good chance that Jetsgo will disappear," he wrote. "We believe Jetsgo has spread its network too thin."


I included it here as it provided more details than we'd heard to date about Jetsgo speculation.

exAC

Simon:
This is the quote that sparked my accusation.
"Two U.S. hedge fund managers, who declined to be named, said they had acquired WestJet shares yesterday in the hopes of benefiting from the Jetsgo rumours. While there has been talk about Jetsgo running into trouble before, they said speculation intensified after Mr. Beddoe's visit to New York."

The stock analyst that wrote the damning report works for the same company that sponsored the conference that Clive spoke and where the report was released.

flyingstudent

Having someone at Raymond James and Westjet to collaborate and say something like that is quite damaging to Jetsgo! I'd expect Jetsgo to have an official press release on this on Monday.

I wouldn't say Jetsgo's fleet is exactly old. The average age of the MD80 and F100 are about 10-12 years, which is a healthy number for a LCC. I'd have to say though that the F100 market/resale value is relatively low right now. However, if 18 F100's cost less than a brand new B73G, I'd go for the F100. Jetsgo is using the F100 smartly on short haul routes like YYZ-YOW/YUL/EWR/YWG/YQB, where they can increase frequency without comprising load factors too much.

The quote that Jetsgo is spreading its network too thin is not true. Jetsgo actually has reduced capacity on all its transcon from last year. This winter, there's only 2 daily nonstop and 1 direct YYZ-YVR vs 3 daily non-stop and 2 direct YYZ-YVR last fall. For YYZ-YYC, it went down from 3 to 2 non-stop. For YYZ-YEG, it went down from 2 nonstop MD80 to 1 nonstop MD80 and 1 multistop F100 flight.

Ken hAAmer

So they got into the domesticly owned airline sector.

And bought WestJet instead of Air Canada?

Ken hAAmer

mine too.

Ken hAAmer

But how does this translate into slagging?

How do you know that Beddoe didn't just say something like "We have the resources and will to match JetsGo's fares on every route"?

Seems pretty weak to me to accuse someone based on a hunch. Companies and executives slag each other all the time, so it wouldn't surprise me that Beddoe said something less than flattering about JetsGo. 'Course that happens here all the time.

But is it slagging if what you say is true? Is it slagging to say that JetsGo had a fiasco over Christmas?

The definition fact is becoming looser by the minute.

I don't care if someone want to say that Beddoe slags his competitors. And I don't really care if he does. But if you're going to accuse someone, you should at least back it up with something resembling evidence.

Overwing

Well the WJ supporters have sure taken to kicking SG on the AEF Forum lately. Must be all apart of CB plan to placate his own troops. Some pilots have seen their options value vanish in front of their eyes the last while.

Simon

And, as you can see, I have now pulled that quote back out as I misread the article.

Are you ever wrong, Ken? I would imagine not.

Do you have a definition for the word "many" yet?

exoz95

After the aborted landing in YYC recently I know I won't give Michael the White any more of my money. You get what you pay for. To predict the future you must look at the past. Michael's past is littered with failed airlines and cooked books. When they demise I am sure all the pilots at Westjet will be happy campers!

Ken hAAmer

All the time.

But my point is this...

If you want to slag Beddoe, then feel free. As the CEO of a publicly traded company, he's making a ton of money, in part because he's the public face of the company, and fair game for any public comment. But if you are going to accuse someone of a specific act, particularly if the accusation is going to shed less than a good light on that person, it's important to have your ducks lined up before you make the specific accusation.

Do you?

My definition is probably more than a few, possibly more than some.

It would seem that several posters on this board did get the bump. So if we pick some numbers out of the air, that at least have some conservative resemblance to real life, let's say that there are 6 million Aeroplan members, 6 thousand regular posters on FT, and 6 of those got bumped over the threshold. If the same remains true for the entire membership, then then some 6000 people may have been bumped.

I don't think it's anywhere near that number. But even if it's only a tenth of that, and 600 got bumped, then I still think 600 is a reasonable approximation of "many."

And if you were expecting "very few" people would get bumped, then even if it was 1/100th of 6000, and 60 people got bumped, then 60 is still a reasonable candidate for "many."

BTW, it was me that asked if there was some concern or question about my use of the word "many." No one answered.

You may also recall that many other people stated that there would be at a minimum no cutbacks, and at least a hope of improvements in the program. I dare say that at least for most SE's, and probably for most E's and P's there were in fact significant cutbacks to the program, contrary to those rather insistent claims.

I did not suggest or even covertly try to imply that they were lying, or telling "un-truths", because I understand that they were opinions. I thought they were wrong at the time, and now it seems clear they were. But they were still legitimately held opinions, held by people who simply disagreed with me.

WR Cage

The following companies have made their RJ&A Growth Airline Conference presentations available to general public:
- JetBlue
- Frontier
- SkyWest
- Mesa Air Group

Guess who is missing from the list?