Question: My 10-year old kid wants to sit alone, is it possible?
Jun 18, 2023, 8:41 pm
#1
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My 10-year old kid wants to sit alone, is it possible?
For a family trip, I have already upgraded my partner and I, as well as our little kid (2 years old) into the signature class.
My 10-year old is currently in the Premium Economy. I am going to apply a gate upgrade for him, although the chance of the upgrade clearing is slim.
If the upgrade is not cleared, I plan to leave my kids and my partner in the signature cabin and sit in the premium economy myself.
However, my 10-year old kid asks me to put them in the premium economy, because they love to sit on a window seat and see the ground below. It is probably difficult for them to have the same view sitting in a signature pod.
I tried to find AC policy on this, but cannot find a definite answer, so would like to ask the question here to see if anyone else has similar experience and can provide some suggestions.
Currently, three of us will occupy the three closest pods to the premium economy cabin, and the 10-year old kid will be seated on the second row window seat in the Premium Economy.
My 10-year old is currently in the Premium Economy. I am going to apply a gate upgrade for him, although the chance of the upgrade clearing is slim.
If the upgrade is not cleared, I plan to leave my kids and my partner in the signature cabin and sit in the premium economy myself.
However, my 10-year old kid asks me to put them in the premium economy, because they love to sit on a window seat and see the ground below. It is probably difficult for them to have the same view sitting in a signature pod.
I tried to find AC policy on this, but cannot find a definite answer, so would like to ask the question here to see if anyone else has similar experience and can provide some suggestions.
Currently, three of us will occupy the three closest pods to the premium economy cabin, and the 10-year old kid will be seated on the second row window seat in the Premium Economy.
Jun 18, 2023, 9:02 pm
#2
Join Date: Feb 2004
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child must be seated in the same cabin as a parent or guardian, unless accompanied minor service is purchased.
the A / K pods have windows though, and if you hold 3 of the 4 closest pods to premium economy, you already have at least one window seat held.
the A / K pods have windows though, and if you hold 3 of the 4 closest pods to premium economy, you already have at least one window seat held.
Jun 18, 2023, 9:14 pm
#3
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https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/...en.html#/foot2
If someone can provide me with a link that will be extremely helpful.
Having been 10 years old myself before, I probably can understand kids do not want to sit together with parents during flight ...
Jun 19, 2023, 12:42 am
#4
Join Date: Jan 2001
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See https://www.aircanada.com/jp/en/aco/...d-minor.html#/
my interpretation is that a 10 year old can sit in a separate cabin, but cannot travel alone.
my interpretation is that a 10 year old can sit in a separate cabin, but cannot travel alone.
Jun 19, 2023, 9:43 am
#5
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See https://www.aircanada.com/jp/en/aco/...d-minor.html#/
my interpretation is that a 10 year old can sit in a separate cabin, but cannot travel alone.
my interpretation is that a 10 year old can sit in a separate cabin, but cannot travel alone.
Also note that you can not get UMS on a code share or connecting flight.
Edit:
If you go to CTA: https://otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/publicatio...rplane-a-guide
They define the seating distance as:
3. Seating distance
Airlines must take steps to seat a child within a certain distance of their accompanying passenger. The allowable distance depends on the child's age. Airlines must take steps to:- Seat children under the age of 5 directly beside their accompanying passenger. They must not be separated by an aisle unless the plane's layout requires it (for example, where a plane has banks of single seats only). In those cases, the two passengers should be seated in the same row, separated only by the aisle.
- Seat children aged 5 to 11 in the same row as their accompanying passenger and separated by no more than one seat (or the space of an aisle).
- Seat children aged 12 or 13 no more than two rows away from their accompanying passenger. This means that there should not be more than one row between them.
Jun 19, 2023, 10:32 am
#6
Join Date: Jan 2001
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If the child is in a separate cabin, they are considered unaccompanied - UMS is mandatory between 8 and 11 years old. So they would need to pay for UMS for a 10y/o if they're in a different cabin from the rest of the family.
Also note that you can not get UMS on a code share or connecting flight.
Edit:
If you go to CTA: https://otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/publicatio...rplane-a-guide
They define the seating distance as:
Also note that you can not get UMS on a code share or connecting flight.
Edit:
If you go to CTA: https://otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/publicatio...rplane-a-guide
They define the seating distance as:
3. Seating distance
Airlines must take steps to seat a child within a certain distance of their accompanying passenger. The allowable distance depends on the child's age. Airlines must take steps to:- Seat children under the age of 5 directly beside their accompanying passenger. They must not be separated by an aisle unless the plane's layout requires it (for example, where a plane has banks of single seats only). In those cases, the two passengers should be seated in the same row, separated only by the aisle.
- Seat children aged 5 to 11 in the same row as their accompanying passenger and separated by no more than one seat (or the space of an aisle).
- Seat children aged 12 or 13 no more than two rows away from their accompanying passenger. This means that there should not be more than one row between them.
5. What to do if passengers cannot be seated together
If an airline has followed all the steps and is still unable to arrange seats within the required distance of each other, they should talk to the affected passengers about their options. The passengers may choose to sit farther apart, or decide not take the flight at all. [my bolding]I stand by my interpretation.
Jun 19, 2023, 10:57 am
#7
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I have left my 3 kids in Y and my wife and I had sat in J (all under 16) There were no issues.
Jun 19, 2023, 11:36 am
#8
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Reading the document you quote, it appears this is for the case where the passengers WANT the child near them. See for example Section 5 of the document:
I stand by my interpretation.
5. What to do if passengers cannot be seated together
If an airline has followed all the steps and is still unable to arrange seats within the required distance of each other, they should talk to the affected passengers about their options. The passengers may choose to sit farther apart, or decide not take the flight at all. [my bolding]I stand by my interpretation.
I am surprised it's not called out more explicitly online, unless something has changed.
Emirates, for example, calls it out very specifically: https://www.emirates.com/ca/english/...irates-flight/
Jun 19, 2023, 11:50 am
#9
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Thanks for @visitor and @mjrobson for providing reference. I never knew it was a Canadian Government requirement. I believe the following paragraph is applicable:
So if the business cabin has space, I can choose to upgrade my 10-year old kid (which I planned to do anyway with gate upgrade).
If not, I can choose to downgrade myself to sit next to them. Technically, AC should refund me my eup credits, but I got so many of them so probably would not care if they do not.
Also I believe Section 5 explicitly says I can choose just to let them sit alone.
I probably will save the screen shot of this regulation on my phone and show it to the SD. Thanks everyone for helping.
"4. Class of service
Airlines must do everything they reasonably can to meet these seating requirements in the same class of service that the child and accompanying passenger reserved. If changing the class of service for one or both of the passengers is the only way to seat them within the required distance of each other, the airline may suggest an upgrade or downgrade to the passengers.
If the passengers agree to a downgrade in the class of service, the airline must refund the price difference between the two services. If the accompanying passenger chooses to be seated in a higher class of service than their original booking, the airline can require that they pay the difference. Airlines should explain in their tariff how they will calculate the price difference between the two services and how they will either refund or collect the difference from passengers.
If another passenger volunteers to give up their seat in a higher class of service and agrees to a downgrade in class of service so that a child and accompanying person can sit close together, the airline should also refund the price difference between the two services to that volunteer.
Examples:
At check-in, a confirmed passenger tells the airline that he is traveling with a 6 year-old child. These passengers are booked in Business Class but the only available seats in the same row are in Economy Class. The airline should let the passenger know that
The only available seats in the same row are in Economy Class;
They will seek volunteers at the boarding gate and on board the plane before take-off (if necessary), and
If the passenger wishes to downgrade the tickets in order to be sure to be seated together, the airline must reimburse the difference in price between a Business Class and Economy Class ticket on that flight.
If the passenger does not want to be downgraded, the airline must try to seat the two passengers in the same row by asking at the boarding gate and on board the aircraft before take-off for volunteers to change seats in Business Class.
If no one in Business Class volunteers, the passenger and child may choose to be seated apart, or to be seated together in Economy Class, if seats are still available."
Airlines must do everything they reasonably can to meet these seating requirements in the same class of service that the child and accompanying passenger reserved. If changing the class of service for one or both of the passengers is the only way to seat them within the required distance of each other, the airline may suggest an upgrade or downgrade to the passengers.
If the passengers agree to a downgrade in the class of service, the airline must refund the price difference between the two services. If the accompanying passenger chooses to be seated in a higher class of service than their original booking, the airline can require that they pay the difference. Airlines should explain in their tariff how they will calculate the price difference between the two services and how they will either refund or collect the difference from passengers.
If another passenger volunteers to give up their seat in a higher class of service and agrees to a downgrade in class of service so that a child and accompanying person can sit close together, the airline should also refund the price difference between the two services to that volunteer.
Examples:
At check-in, a confirmed passenger tells the airline that he is traveling with a 6 year-old child. These passengers are booked in Business Class but the only available seats in the same row are in Economy Class. The airline should let the passenger know that
The only available seats in the same row are in Economy Class;
They will seek volunteers at the boarding gate and on board the plane before take-off (if necessary), and
If the passenger wishes to downgrade the tickets in order to be sure to be seated together, the airline must reimburse the difference in price between a Business Class and Economy Class ticket on that flight.
If the passenger does not want to be downgraded, the airline must try to seat the two passengers in the same row by asking at the boarding gate and on board the aircraft before take-off for volunteers to change seats in Business Class.
If no one in Business Class volunteers, the passenger and child may choose to be seated apart, or to be seated together in Economy Class, if seats are still available."
If not, I can choose to downgrade myself to sit next to them. Technically, AC should refund me my eup credits, but I got so many of them so probably would not care if they do not.
Also I believe Section 5 explicitly says I can choose just to let them sit alone.
I probably will save the screen shot of this regulation on my phone and show it to the SD. Thanks everyone for helping.
Last edited by Changeup2000; Jun 19, 2023 at 1:28 pm Reason: Formatting
Jun 19, 2023, 12:17 pm
#10
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While families not sitting together is a common complaint, I'm not sure we have any data points on how AC will deal with those trying to split up.
Jun 19, 2023, 1:15 pm
#11
Join Date: Mar 2001
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If the SD has something referencing what to do in their manual, they'll do what that says, not what your screenshot says.
Jun 19, 2023, 1:30 pm
#12
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Just note that this guidance is from the perspective of an airline having the obligation to ensure that parents and children are not seperated when assigning seats, it's not from a Safety/CARS perspective for which there may be other rules/regulations which may or may not be published.
If the SD has something referencing what to do in their manual, they'll do what that says, not what your screenshot says.
If the SD has something referencing what to do in their manual, they'll do what that says, not what your screenshot says.
My fallback position is for me to sit in the PY, which I do not care. The other three pods in the signature cabin appear to be compliant with the requirements posted by AC.
Jun 19, 2023, 2:01 pm
#13
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,607
Policy or not, if those are the assigned seats your party have -- one in PY and two in J -- I think if you ask nicely and explain that the child would actually prefer it that way you stand a very good chance of being allowed to seat everyone the way they want. It's not like you're putting an infant 30 rows back in Y without telling anyone who they belong to... there are only a few rows of PY after all. Of course every child is different but if your child is independent enough to have expressed this wish they sound likely to be not a problem when it comes to whatever else might come up. And having already managed to snag the J seats closest to PY seems like it was prudent and would alleviate any concerns.
Last edited by zkzkz; Jun 19, 2023 at 2:06 pm
Jun 20, 2023, 12:27 am
#14
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Policy or not, if those are the assigned seats your party have -- one in PY and two in J -- I think if you ask nicely and explain that the child would actually prefer it that way you stand a very good chance of being allowed to seat everyone the way they want. It's not like you're putting an infant 30 rows back in Y without telling anyone who they belong to... there are only a few rows of PY after all. Of course every child is different but if your child is independent enough to have expressed this wish they sound likely to be not a problem when it comes to whatever else might come up. And having already managed to snag the J seats closest to PY seems like it was prudent and would alleviate any concerns.
As partly summarized above,
- A child age 11 and under is required to have an "accompanying adult" - that adult is required to be over age 16 and in the same cabin otherwise they are an unaccompanied minor
- The unaccompanied minor service is not available for: connecting flights, pets in the cabin, or when the accompanying adult is onboard the aircraft
I was too lazy to find it but it is ultimately a Transport Canada rule that a person in charge be in the same cabin. It relates to requirements regarding oxygen masks if the cabin depressurizes or correct procedure for an evacuation.
From what I see above, Air Canada's obligation to you is to help you downgrade to join your minor. They may propose an upgrade but they should not help with skipping the line.
To be clear, you are asking for the rules to be bent. In that respect, your mileage may vary.