Denied Boarding EI JFK-MAN

Old Jan 5, 2024, 6:35 am
  #46  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2022
Posts: 26
Never mind.. We will find out more in due course I hope.
joelwgcpc is offline  
Old Jan 5, 2024, 12:17 pm
  #47  
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: LHR / BHX / MAN / ATL
Programs: DL DM 2MM - IHG Diamond
Posts: 4,054
Originally Posted by Jeff767
When that last booking was made the flight was inside 74 minutes. TSA requires 74 minutes to vet all bookings. At that point its out of the airlines hands even if they caused the issue.
Jeff767 is correct here. I'm not sure if 74 is the magic number (DL has told me that it's 60) but the concept is correct. The carrier has to submit a manifest to TSA so that TSA can identify anyone on a no-fly list, etc. I found this out the hard way years ago (before online check-in) when the subway train I was on broke on the way to ATL. I eventually got to the counter 55 minutes before departure time and was (correctly) denied boarding even though I easily could have made it to the gate with my carry-on bag in time for the flight. Reticketed the next day + a $200 change fee.
ecaarch is offline  
Old Jan 6, 2024, 5:29 pm
  #48  
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: US
Programs: BA Silver
Posts: 109
I was on the MAN - JFK leg of that flight

My suspicion with the pricing was for one person. Getting two business class singles on that flight for 5k would have been very good going. I don't know about the JFK departure, but business class was completely full for the MAN departure and that is price pretty close to the regular going rate.
alserire likes this.
freelance is offline  
Old Jan 6, 2024, 6:04 pm
  #49  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2022
Posts: 26
Originally Posted by freelance
I was on the MAN - JFK leg of that flight

My suspicion with the pricing was for one person. Getting two business class singles on that flight for 5k would have been very good going. I don't know about the JFK departure, but business class was completely full for the MAN departure and that is price pretty close to the regular going rate.
indeed.. I double checked with the manager who was stood there who confirmed $5245 was for both Mrs and myself.. I suppose he may not have wanted to admit he made a mistake..
joelwgcpc is offline  
Old Jan 6, 2024, 11:52 pm
  #50  
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: New York, NY
Programs: AA ExPl, DL PM, UA Silver, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott Titanium, probably some others
Posts: 4,137
I suspect you are going to find that your TA is not as above-board as you believe. But certainly, EI should not have tried to double the price on you after initially quoting you half that figure.
steveholt is offline  
Old Jan 7, 2024, 1:08 am
  #51  
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Seat 1A
Programs: Non-status paid F/J (best value for $$$)
Posts: 4,127
Originally Posted by joelwgcpc
Something doesn't add up.. If the fare was available on BA site why would the TA need a consolidator.
Most airlines nowadays pay 0% commission to retail travel agents [ones that don't have high enough sales volume with the particular airline to warrant incentive commission contracts], yet at the same time sell net fares that are a bit lower than published to consolidators. Retail travel agents would first make the booking and then send the PNR over to the consolidator for ticketing at the lower net fare (but with the higher gross fare printed on the ticket). Travel agent and consolidator would then split the difference in between the gross and net amount.

It might be possible that the consolidator and/or travel agent got greedy and found a even lower fare for less than the EI net fare on the BA website on BA codeshare flights numbers operated by EI. Instead of issuing the ticket, the original booking got cancelled and they rebooked directly on the BA website using either the Travel Agent or Consolidator's personal credit card (so one of the parties in addition to receiving their higher "markup" between the gross and net fares [cheaper BA fare in this case] also got credit card points).

When travel agents and consolidator sign up for IATA BSP (Billing and Settlement Plan) Accreditation which allows them to issue tickets directly with the airlines and also use the "Cash" form of payment (they have to do periodic remittances to their local BSP which in turn pays the airlines) in addition to other forms of payment such as credit card, they fine print that they sign mostly likely would prohibit them from issuing tickets on their own personal credit cards.

It is possible that BA's systems flagged the credit card numbers as fraudulent as they were being used for many different tickets with different passenger names from different ticketing sources, including their own website as well as through BSP. Once flagged, the affected electronic coupons on the tickets would then get changed from "OPEN FOR USE" to "SUSPENDED" while the PNR containing the original reservation remains intact.
Menko and MM00LL2 like this.
daniellam is offline  
Old Jan 7, 2024, 9:10 am
  #52  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2022
Posts: 26
Originally Posted by daniellam
Most airlines nowadays pay 0% commission to retail travel agents [ones that don't have high enough sales volume with the particular airline to warrant incentive commission contracts], yet at the same time sell net fares that are a bit lower than published to consolidators. Retail travel agents would first make the booking and then send the PNR over to the consolidator for ticketing at the lower net fare (but with the higher gross fare printed on the ticket). Travel agent and consolidator would then split the difference in between the gross and net amount.

It might be possible that the consolidator and/or travel agent got greedy and found a even lower fare for less than the EI net fare on the BA website on BA codeshare flights numbers operated by EI. Instead of issuing the ticket, the original booking got cancelled and they rebooked directly on the BA website using either the Travel Agent or Consolidator's personal credit card (so one of the parties in addition to receiving their higher "markup" between the gross and net fares [cheaper BA fare in this case] also got credit card points).

When travel agents and consolidator sign up for IATA BSP (Billing and Settlement Plan) Accreditation which allows them to issue tickets directly with the airlines and also use the "Cash" form of payment (they have to do periodic remittances to their local BSP which in turn pays the airlines) in addition to other forms of payment such as credit card, they fine print that they sign mostly likely would prohibit them from issuing tickets on their own personal credit cards.

It is possible that BA's systems flagged the credit card numbers as fraudulent as they were being used for many different tickets with different passenger names from different ticketing sources, including their own website as well as through BSP. Once flagged, the affected electronic coupons on the tickets would then get changed from "OPEN FOR USE" to "SUSPENDED" while the PNR containing the original reservation remains intact.
thanks very much! Very enlightening. That explains what happened with the first ticket. The rest was just the check in staff having a go, certainly with the third ticket.
joelwgcpc is offline  
Old Jan 7, 2024, 1:18 pm
  #53  
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: JFK, MAN
Programs: BA Gold, Hilton Diamond, Amex Plat
Posts: 440
I booked a few tickets with a TA for EI MAN-JFK-MAN (months out ahead of travel dates). How can I find out in advance if I am impacted similarly?
destone is offline  
Old Jan 7, 2024, 1:30 pm
  #54  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2022
Posts: 26
If its a Travel Agent you know, you can ask him if he booked direct or through a consolidator.

MAN. Airport staff are adept at losing luggage.. Had 3 incidents in last 6 months all with EI. The support you get from baggage desk at JFK is rubbish too.

PS If you go MAN DUB JFK, platinum VIP service is a nice option. It also means you can use any Airline to the States as they take care of the luggage
joelwgcpc is offline  
Old Jan 7, 2024, 1:47 pm
  #55  
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: EIDW
Programs: Aer Lingus Concierge, Radisson Rewards Platinum, BW Diamond, Hilton Gold
Posts: 2,002
Are they BA codeshare or regular EI tickets? BA is fairly aggressive with its fraud measures

Let's be clear here ticketing issues are very very rare and typically can be sorted by ensuring you show up early as recommended for check in. I've the odd issue with tickets and every time the check in agent was able to sort matters in under 3 minutes.
ROKNA is offline  
Old Jan 8, 2024, 3:24 pm
  #56  
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: JFK, MAN
Programs: BA Gold, Hilton Diamond, Amex Plat
Posts: 440
Originally Posted by ROKNA
Are they BA codeshare or regular EI tickets? BA is fairly aggressive with its fraud measures

Let's be clear here ticketing issues are very very rare and typically can be sorted by ensuring you show up early as recommended for check in. I've the odd issue with tickets and every time the check in agent was able to sort matters in under 3 minutes.
Thanks! Regular EI tickets through sites like TravelUp and BudgetAir.
destone is offline  
Old Jan 9, 2024, 2:10 am
  #57  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,868
Originally Posted by destone
Thanks! Regular EI tickets through sites like TravelUp and BudgetAir.
There was a long thread on TravelUp on the BA forum of FT a while back.Its worth reading.

You will probably be fine, but many of these budget TAs even if they arent breaching their contractual obligations as appears to have happened in this example, are run on a shoestring and have no customer service staff. So if there are IRROPS or schedule changes requiring ticketing amendments then this is when problems occur.

You get what you pay for and its generally preferable to book directly with the airline. People seem to forget that when you book via an agent, until the flight you are the customer of the TA, not the airline.
irishguy28 and destone like this.
Kgmm77 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.