757-300

A thread on another message board on the old, tired issue of COS prompted me to post this. On the website of the National Association to Advance Fat Acceptance (it cracks me up that a group by that name actually exists), the following is given as a tip for customers of size:

"ARMREST UP - When you get to your seat during pre-boarding, raise the armrest between seats. This may give you the inch or two of extra space you need. The chances are that the passenger who will be seated next to you won't say anything; if he does, smile pleasantly and say that you'll both be more comfortable if the armrest is up."

So what would you say in this case? Myself, I would say, "No, I would not be comfortable with you in part of my seat" as I put it back down, but this "tip" seems to be based on the premise that most people would be afraid/unwilling to say anything.

lecter

I would tell the person to relocate to a roomier area of Y if the plane is not full, or to buy his sensitive fat ... a J/F seat.

Thankfully I haven't experienced this so far, but I would find such an idea offensive and annoying...I myself am not exactly "light" at 75kg and on small jets seats can feel truly cramped, but that's no reason to tell the passenger next to me that we'd both be more comfortable if I just expanded over him/her like a gelatinous blob

kuroneko

This brings to mind an incident where the window pax said to me, as a means to get to my coveted aisle seat, "It's probably better if we switch, because I have to get up a lot during flights--you'll be more comfortable". My answer: "Well, I have to get up a lot during flights, too, which is why I made the extra effort to check-in early and get an aisle seat. I won't mind if you have to get up"

The window pax didn't even get up once during the flight.

If a COS used a "We'll both be more comfortable..." line on me, I'd would just counter with the truth--"Well, no, we wouldn't. I need the armrest down, please".

It's a pity, but I bet many infrequent fliers would indeed be too afraid/surprised etc. to say anything.

Philoj

The airlines designed the armrests to go up, it's my right to put them up if I choose.

(that argument seems to work for reclining seats, I thought I'd try it here)

(and no, the only time I put up the armrest is when the seat next to me is empty)

flyrights

I believe if there is a disagreement whether the armrest goes up or down, it should stay DOWN. Again, it comes down to the airline NOT doing their job to protect people, and provide reasonable seating, even if someone is 1,500 pounds, they should be entitled to as many seats as it takes the airline to accomodate them within reasonable comfort and safety.

It isn't/should be a question of "this fat person is taking up too much space", but rather a question of "this airline owes ME and EVERYONE ELSE a seat of our own".

If someone told me "putting the armrest up is for both of our comfort", I would be VERY turned OFF by that comment/unilateral decision. And I would NOT agree to it. If I were the COS, I would then, rightfully GO TO THE AIRLINE and complain that THEY OWE ME A SEAT I CAN FIT IN.

Does anyone know if there have been any court cases where a COS sued an airline for forcing them to buy additional seats?

indufan

If they do, they will lose. Airlines sell seats.

SAT Lawyer

Would you expect a successful lawsuit where an obese customer sued Pizza Hut for requiring him pay for all three extra large Meat Lover's Pizzas he consumed instead of merely one?

kuroneko

Further, the Department of Transportation's stance is that the purchase of a single airline ticket offers the use of a single seat.

"Airline travel is covered by the Air Carrier Access Act, 49 U.S.C. 1374(c) and the regulations implementing the Act issued by the Department of Transportation as 14 CFR Part 382, et seq. As regulated under 14 CFR §382.38 Seating accommodations (i) "Carriers are not required to furnish more than one seat per ticket or to provide a seat in a class of service other than the one the passenger has purchased.""

WHBM

[deleted by the moderator]

Coathanger

The armrests stay down as far as I am concerned. It takes two to tango

flyrights

But, is there a definition of "seat"? I think that is the KEY issue. And someone could make a case, probably a very GOOD case, that "one seat" may mean "one seat large enough to accomodate the ticket buyer". It certainly ISN'T defined as an area between two armrests. And that ticket buyer may be 1,500 pounds, cause that isn't defined either... And I think someone could make an argument, a GOOD argument, that "one seat" could mean, "when the armrests are up, you basically have a bench, which could be though of and interpreted by some as one seat".

And I'm surprised at how mean and insulting some of you can be toward people who may weigh more than you do. Naturally, on an anoymous board, it's EASY to be mean-spirited and nasty. I'm quite certain in your non-anoymous life, you keep your mouths shut.

Macspreader

Bad choice of words, when talking about POS ?

LapLap

I’ve heard the onboard announcements state many times that arm rests have to remain down during take off and landing.

I would have a problem with anybody requesting that the armrest be pulled up. What the website posted by 757-300 has probaby neglected to address is the acute discomfort felt by many women (and indeed many men) when a stranger presses a part of their body into them.

Alas, too many of us have experienced situations where someone else has engineered (or taken advantage of) an opportunity to press themselves against us. An arm rest acts as a barrier – without it, it is hard to stop someone from encroaching further and further into our space. Give an inch, people take a mile.

I have a lot of sympathy for people who are wider and bigger than me. Unfortunately there are too many creeps and ‘perverts’* around and someone isn’t less likely to be one just because they are heavy.

Mind you, having read this, I will take this into account. If I do sit next to someone very large on a long flight, and if I feel completely comfortable around them, I’ll probably offer to stick the armrest up. But I doubt this would happen if they initially took the approach suggested on the website. And yes, I most certainly would say something.


(* I keep this term solely for those who act without another’s consent)

kuroneko

All I can say is that if the COS who sued WN could have used this angle, wouldn't she have? Obviously, she couldn't (because of the Dept. of Transportation rule) and had to play the race card instead. As we all know, she still lost.

flyrights

Macspreader, you made me laugh...