Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Global Airline Alliances > SkyTeam
Reload this Page >

Who would be the next Skyteam member?

Who would be the next Skyteam member?

Old Jun 17, 2012, 7:25 am
  #811  
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Programs: UA Mileage Plus: Premier Silver
Posts: 340
Originally Posted by azpyre

Personally, I hope Skyteam can also recruit AirCalin, Air Pacific (soon rebranded as Air Fiji), Indigo Airlines, Philippines Airlines, Oman Air, Transaero, Iceland Air, Royal Air Maroc and Copa Airlines.
As far as Transaero goes, they are more likely to join *A more then anyone else. That's even assuming they join anyone at all. Even if they did join an alliance, skyteam is the least likely since it already has aeroflot (Although I suppose aeroflot could start up another merger).
rurouni212 is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 9:26 am
  #812  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 22,778
Originally Posted by azpyre
Well, Sri Lankan Airlines (UL) has just been taken by oneWorld. It's a good airline with value fares. I wished Skyteam had approached UL considering the mess the airlines in India are facing. UL covers India quite decently, and a major airline to the Maldives.

Now that it's no longer on the table, I hope Skyteam step up their pursuit of the remaining airlines. Among the major ones left, Etihad and Virgin Australia would be a scoop if Skyteam can convince them.

Personally, I hope Skyteam can also recruit AirCalin, Air Pacific (soon rebranded as Air Fiji), Indigo Airlines, Philippines Airlines, Oman Air, Transaero, Iceland Air, Royal Air Maroc and Copa Airlines.
Whether it's for Skyteam Associates or the main partner, it doesn't matter. It's a competition ... and the more the better ...
Why Iceland Air?
U.L. would have been a good addition, but not a replacement for an Indian carrier. There is no way UL can ever cover India. A full service Indian carrier can do everything UL can for Skyteam, than UL can.
Yaatri is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 9:29 am
  #813  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 22,778
Originally Posted by Dalat767
The sage continued to grow with 9W. Stay tuned.

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...w/14205609.cms
The sage?
Yaatri is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 9:48 am
  #814  
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: SEA/ORD/ADB
Programs: TK ELPL (*G), AS 100K (OWE), BA Gold (OWE), Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Plat, IHG Plat
Posts: 7,762
Originally Posted by Yaatri
The sage?
probably a typo - I'm thinking he meant saga
PVDtoDEL is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 10:09 am
  #815  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Four Seasons Contributor BadgeMandarin Oriental Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Seat 1A, Juice pretty much everywhere, Mucci des Coins Exotiques
Posts: 34,339
Originally Posted by T.A.Music
But some of Royal Air Maroc's stake are held by AF-KL, so there is still a chance...
If AF sells their stake in AT, then we'll really know AT isn't joining ST. Or maybe AF will say they desperately need the cash!
stimpy is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 10:14 am
  #816  
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: BHX, UK
Programs: FB GOLD, ST ElitePlus, IC Ambassador, Priority Club Platinum
Posts: 52
In regards to Royal Air Marco, the airline is owned 95.95% by the Moroccan government, 2.86% by.Air France .and 0.95% by international Airlines Group . Im sure IAG would be interested in buying a larger stake in the airline.
SeeTheWorld1984 is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 10:21 am
  #817  
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 71
Based on the article posted on this forum about 9W it seems they are aligning themselves with Star Alliance more then Skyteam with discontinuing service to JFK (Delta's Hub) and Keeping Newark which is a United Hub. The other Europe destinations they say they want to focus on are Frankfurt and Munich again Star Alliance Hubs. They already have a Brussels Hub another Star Alliance hub. The only SkyTeam Hub they are looking at adding service to is Paris CDG (Air France Hub). So I think 9W will more likely end up in Star Alliance based on these facts.
J_Fleish is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 10:29 am
  #818  
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: BHX, UK
Programs: FB GOLD, ST ElitePlus, IC Ambassador, Priority Club Platinum
Posts: 52
Originally Posted by J_Fleish
Based on the article posted on this forum about 9W it seems they are aligning themselves with Star Alliance more then Skyteam with discontinuing service to JFK (Delta's Hub) and Keeping Newark which is a United Hub. The other Europe destinations they say they want to focus on are Frankfurt and Munich again Star Alliance Hubs. They already have a Brussels Hub another Star Alliance hub. The only SkyTeam Hub they are looking at adding service to is Paris CDG (Air France Hub). So I think 9W will more likely end up in Star Alliance based on these facts.


Must agree with this. Skyteam will have to offer 9W a lot to convince them to join. Looks more likely they've lost 9W to Star. However I doubt the Indian government will allow them to join until Air India joins an alliance!
SeeTheWorld1984 is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 10:33 am
  #819  
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: SEA/ORD/ADB
Programs: TK ELPL (*G), AS 100K (OWE), BA Gold (OWE), Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Plat, IHG Plat
Posts: 7,762
Originally Posted by J_Fleish
Based on the article posted on this forum about 9W it seems they are aligning themselves with Star Alliance more then Skyteam with discontinuing service to JFK (Delta's Hub) and Keeping Newark which is a United Hub. The other Europe destinations they say they want to focus on are Frankfurt and Munich again Star Alliance Hubs. They already have a Brussels Hub another Star Alliance hub. The only SkyTeam Hub they are looking at adding service to is Paris CDG (Air France Hub). So I think 9W will more likely end up in Star Alliance based on these facts.
Not at all. The dropping of JFK is because they just got new nonstop competition on the route from Brussels Airlines. Since they already codeshare with SN for European feed, and SN's JFK flight fits into the 9W bank, I wouldn't be surprised at all if they are planning to use a codeshare on that flight...

Their current destinations have very little relevance in the choice of alliance based on what their chairman has said in the past - if they choose Star Alliance, they are expected to move their scissor hub to MUC. If they choose SkyTeam, they are expected to move their scissor hub to AMS or MXP.

Also, one factor you didn't mention is the government of India. They are pretty pissed off with Star Alliance over the Air India debacle (and Star Alliance is pissed with them too). However, since the government of India is far more powerful than Star Alliance, and Star needs India more than India needs Star, it would not surprise me if AI ended up in Star Alliance instead of 9W. On the other hand, it also would not surprise me if AI ended up in SkyTeam and 9W in SkyTeam... Nothing is clear enough to be drawing conclusions right now.
PVDtoDEL is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 10:36 am
  #820  
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: SEA/ORD/ADB
Programs: TK ELPL (*G), AS 100K (OWE), BA Gold (OWE), Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Plat, IHG Plat
Posts: 7,762
Originally Posted by SeeTheWorld1984
Must agree with this. Skyteam will have to offer 9W a lot to convince them to join. Looks more likely they've lost 9W to Star. However I doubt the Indian government will allow them to join until Air India joins an alliance!
While I agree that SkyTeam will probably have to work harder than Star to woo 9W (because Star is more desirable for 9W in terms of synergies). But I definitely would not write SkyTeam off.

Government of India is more interested in AI being the sole Indian carrier in the alliance they join than AI being the first Indian carrier in an alliance. That's why the Star Alliance issue is being held up - GoI is refusing to let 9W join the same alliance as AI, and Star is therefore refusing to let AI join. 9W joining SkyTeam would fix this problem up nicely.
PVDtoDEL is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 8:27 pm
  #821  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 22,778
Originally Posted by PVDtoDEL
While I agree that SkyTeam will probably have to work harder than Star to woo 9W (because Star is more desirable for 9W in terms of synergies). But I definitely would not write SkyTeam off.

Government of India is more interested in AI being the sole Indian carrier in the alliance they join than AI being the first Indian carrier in an alliance. That's why the Star Alliance issue is being held up - GoI is refusing to let 9W join the same alliance as AI, and Star is therefore refusing to let AI join. 9W joining SkyTeam would fix this problem up nicely.
There are basically two forces at play, which are at odds with each other vis-a-vis Jet's preference for an alliance.
  1. The Govt of India, that wants AI and only AI to join *A
  2. Indian flyers, who are in love with *A and will through a fit if AI joins *A.

If we can understand why Indian frequent flyers prefer *A, we can get a better understanding of why Jet would prefer *A. (When I say Indian frequent flyers, I mean Indian flyers based in India)
Indian frequent flyers a re a tough bunch--very demanding and exacting.
Here is my take on it. Indian flyers based in India form the newest segment of significant to join the community of flyers at large and FT like BBs in particular. India based passengers do not have as many opportunities for mileage runs as Americans and Europeans do for economic reasons, as well as for practical reasons. There are very few countries Indians can fly to without a visa. It's important for them to get status as quickly as possible, i.e. without a whole lot of flying. Star Alliance carriers offer some of the best opportunities for Silver and Gold levels. It's not that Indians are very price conscious, ( I would dare not use any other phrase to describe this tendency), Indians have to rely on easier path to elite status. This, in my opinion is the main reason why Indian flyers are enamoured with *A to the extent that they don't see any value in SkyTeam. Moreover, Star Alliance is the largest alliance and has been able to rope in some of the nicest Asian airlines better known in India, which ads to the perception of quality. It's easier for Indians to get a visa to Singapore, Thailand etc than it is to the U.S. and Europe. Indians are very brand conscious. Star Alliance has a good number of brand name airlines too.
With an overwhelming support for Star Alliance in India, and the perception favouring *A, it's natural for 9W to tilt towards that alliance.

SKyteam is a better choice for any Indian carrier, as it would give the former a definite advantage over other Indian carriers on certain routes from India. An Indian member of SkyTeam would have no competition within the alliance for India to South East Asia and East Asia routes whereas Star Alliance has SQ and TG, while OneWorld has MH.
Yaatri is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 9:08 pm
  #822  
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: SEA/ORD/ADB
Programs: TK ELPL (*G), AS 100K (OWE), BA Gold (OWE), Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Plat, IHG Plat
Posts: 7,762
I think that the average Indian frequent flyer cares more about 9W joining some alliance quickly than continuing with this unaligned crap and still dreaming about *A.
PVDtoDEL is offline  
Old Jun 17, 2012, 9:45 pm
  #823  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 22,778
Originally Posted by PVDtoDEL
I think that the average Indian frequent flyer cares more about 9W joining some alliance quickly than continuing with this unaligned crap and still dreaming about *A.
Absolutely. But average Indian is not as vocal as an FTIndian. Does W9 hear an average Indian?
Yaatri is offline  
Old Jun 18, 2012, 5:25 am
  #824  
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: SIN
Programs: KL Life Platinum, QF Platinum, OZ Diamond, Marriott Ambassador
Posts: 213
Thanks for all your comment. Very insightful views ...

Originally Posted by Goldorak
Air Calin : I think they don't want to join an alliance, otherwise they would have already joined Skyteam easily, ...
I'm quite surprised by this. Yes, they are currently using FB as their FFP. So the next logical step would be to take part in the alliance, no?
Are they holding out so that they can have codeshares with other non-ST airlines?

Originally Posted by Goldorak
Royal Air Maroc : ... So it seems that AT is moving away from Skyteam, unfortunately.
I read this news too ...
But I hope that the discontinuation of the codeshares with DL will not discourage AT joining ST. ST needs to improve the connections within Africa, or at least that part of Africa. Star Alliance is well ahead in this part of the world.

Originally Posted by Goldorak
Copa : ... So I don't see why and how they could come back to Skyteam.
The fact that they have not formally joined Star Alliance gives a chance to rejoin ST. They left ST mainly because CO (their main partner) at that time left ST. It would be good to have another Central American airline to compliment the coverage in the Americas. Copa is currently expanding into South America, and would provide connections to the northern South America, with Aerolinas Argentinas providing coverage on the southern continent.


Originally Posted by Goldorak
There is no more associate status, only full membership.
Is this true as a permanent change?
I thought they did a one-time upgrade for the then associate members to full members. But the associate status is still available, except that there are no airlines in this category at the moment.

Originally Posted by rurouni212
As far as Transaero goes, they are more likely to join *A more then anyone else. That's even assuming they join anyone at all. Even if they did join an alliance, skyteam is the least likely since it already has aeroflot (Although I suppose aeroflot could start up another merger).
Agreed that Star Alliance is the only alliance without a Russian partner and would be most likely to snatch Transaero. But I hope ST can pull a fast one, like they did in China, and swipe most of the major airlines within the same region. Transaero is quite a nice airline.
Not sure if the Russian government has any rules to prevent more than one major airline into the same alliance (similar to the Indian rule) ...

Originally Posted by Yaatri
Why Iceland Air?
U.L. would have been a good addition, but not a replacement for an Indian carrier. There is no way UL can ever cover India. A full service Indian carrier can do everything UL can for Skyteam, than UL can.
Iceland Air is perhaps the few remaining of the full-service airlines within Europe that is not taken yet. Quite a nice airline and decent coverage between North America and Europe.

UL would not replace an Indian carrier, I agree. But with the situation now in a standoff, OW did a good pitch to invite UL to provide decent coverage in terms of network. For OW, they do have a gap in that part of the region between CX and RJ. Also, I love their fares. Would have loved to rake up miles on UL, especially the premium miles.

Last edited by azpyre; Jun 18, 2012 at 5:37 am
azpyre is offline  
Old Jun 18, 2012, 10:50 am
  #825  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Four Seasons Contributor BadgeMandarin Oriental Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Seat 1A, Juice pretty much everywhere, Mucci des Coins Exotiques
Posts: 34,339
Originally Posted by azpyre
I read this news too ...
But I hope that the discontinuation of the codeshares with DL will not discourage AT joining ST. ST needs to improve the connections within Africa, or at least that part of Africa. Star Alliance is well ahead in this part of the world.
Huh? That's not at all true. Skyteam is number one in Africa (and China) by far. Have you looked at the routes? Especially all the new KQ destinations popping up regularly, with lots more to come. Plus Nairobi is a much, much, nicer place to have a hub than Addis. Star doesn't go to half the places that ST goes to in Africa. That said, it's good to have top status in both and OW too because a number of African cities are covered by only one alliance.
stimpy is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.