RTW1

My vote would be connecting in ICN or just flying domestic in Japan. Lot's of options. The HNL options will be a lot more limited and most airlines don't fly there with their best material. And if you live in SFO there should be plenty of other opportunities to visit Hawaii :-).

robyng

Thanks for the translation . Robyn

robyng

I generally agree with you - but there are exceptions IMO. One for us was Cairo - where having an English speaking guide and his car and driver was terrific. Another was Kyoto - where we hired an English speaking guide with a taxi - Mr. Doi - for 2 half days. I've written up Mr. Doi elsewhere in this forum - and he is still around. We learned 100 times more about Kyoto with Mr. Doi than we could have learned on our own. So I wouldn't rule out using a guide in Kyoto or other parts of Japan.

BTW - did you ever decide on the season you'll be visiting (there was some discussion of it earlier - but I went back through the thread and didn't find a decision (perhaps I overlooked it)? And what year are you talking about? Perhaps spring of 2014? Robyn

robyng

A few random thoughts. First - if you like food - you will *have* to devote time to the department store food basements in Tokyo and elsewhere. Even the "pedestrian" ones are pretty amazing. Here's a website I bookmarked for our trip in September:

http://foodsaketokyo.wordpress.com/2...hika-in-tokyo/

The food basements are useful in several ways. First - you can learn about foods that you're not familiar with that you'll find on restaurant menus. Second - there are "tastings". Of things like various kinds of seaweed (who knew there were so many kinds?). Third - you can buy things. Ranging from a bottle of booze or some sweets for your hotel room to a take-out dinner. I don't know how young you are or how much energy you have. But - near the end of our trip - my husband and I were really dragging. We were staying at the Granvia in the Kyoto train station. And the train station had a department store with a pretty good food basement. So we'd just get take-out dinner at the department store food basement (some really tasty stuff) - go back to our room - and eat dinner and watch some TV. Fourth - you can ogle things that are a part of Japanese culture and very foreign to people in the United States - like "gift melons" - absolutely perfect exquisite fruit suitable for an important gift that costs a small fortune.

And I wouldn't spend all my time in the basements of these department stores either. There are some that are truly fabulous. I am in all honesty not much of a shopper (don't need much these days) - but I do like to look. I might be wrong - but I think it was Mitsukoshi that had a great design department. I bought some terrific looking chopstick holders. Most important - you have to buy at least something in a good department store to see how things are packaged. Those chopstick holders had nicer packaging than an engagement ring you'd buy at Tiffanys.

You'll also have to take a look at Kappabashi Dori - the "restaurant stuff" district. Where you can find everything from stores that sell great knives to stores that sell "plastic food". It's a lot of fun poking around.

As for Tsukiji - there's a new market in the works elsewhere - opening probably in 2014. The original is called to be downsized a lot when the new one opens. Check before you plan to go.

I don't know how you are with jet lag. Or what it's like from the west coast of the United States as opposed to the east coast. From the east coast - it's murder - and my husband and I couldn't stay awake past about 8-9 pm our first 3-4 days in Japan (we were up at 3-4 am). Luckily - lunch is usually our big deal meal of the day - and that's how we planned our first trip (although - in Japan - "lunch" felt like "dinner" for pretty much the first week). We plan to make lunch our big meal of the day on our second trip too. You might take this into account in planning your meals (and your "nightlife").

In terms of dining in general - my inclination on this trip - as with our first trip - is to stick only with Japanese restaurants in various flavors (and there are many ). I don't know all the restaurants you mentioned off the top of my head - but I'd probably go to a great tempura restaurant instead of an Italian restaurant. The only "non-Japanese" restaurant I'm considering on this trip is Robuchon - simply because it's open on Sunday and most higher end Japanese restaurants aren't.

Still - we may skip Robuchon - and spend Sunday in Shibuya (think I have that area right - perhaps not) bumming around and seeing how kids are dressing these days ("catch as catch can for lunch"). FWIW - that is how we did and will arrange our days in Tokyo - by geographical area. One day in this part - one day in that part. It's a huge city - and you don't want to spend most of your time getting from here to there to the next place. And bring your best walking shoes - it's a great walking city. Robyn

OliverB

Thank you so much, Robyn!!!

Takashimaya and Iseta were both on my radar and I definitely plan to spend some time exploring the "depachikas" (especially for pastries and inbetween snacks) so that link is very helpful! Thanks for the tip on Kappabashi Dori too - it sounds fascinating and we'll have to add it to the list along with the many market stalls and discreet cocktail bars of Golden Gei!

From what research I've done so far, the main districts to visit seem to be Ueno, Roppongi, Harajuku, Ginza, Yanesen, Asakusa, Akihabara, Ikebukuro-just for the cultural perspective!, Kabukicho Shinjuku and Shiba. Seven nights in the city should afford us plenty of time to cover good ground - and good eating!

With that said, we definitely intend to stick to Japanese cuisine throughout this trip, of course! However, accounting for the many smaller rural towns which make up such a large part of our itinerary and where we'll undoubtedly be experiencing a more rustic take on regional dishes, plenty of bento style dinners at the many ryokans, etc. it will be nice to contrast this type of eating with a more refined and high-end experience in Tokyo. That's not to say that we won't be eating our way through the heart and soul of the city, ie. the busy market stalls, bustling lunch counters and diverse selection of street food, but we're mostly planning these type of meals around mid-day. We have several Michelin starred dining spots on the evening list, a few of which are European influenced. I find this type of fusion really interesting, because while fine dining establishments in most continents will inherently look to the classic French kitchens for inspiration (modern American, South American, Spanish, Italian, African, Middle Eastern, etc) it becomes something entirely distinctive when filtered through a culture that is so diametrically opposite to the West, so traditionally solidifed and yet at the same time so cutting-edge, inventive and creative, and with unique preparation, techniques and ingredients so far-removed from what is normally associated with Western culinary practices, that it becomes something entirely it's own - not unlike modern/post-war Japan itself. The only restaurant which you might have noticed is not Japanese, is Argento Aso - an Italian restaurant. We're not 100% decided on it as of yet, however I felt it would be interesting since pasta really originated in the East and I'm curious to see how a modern Asian kitchen translates their version of this, which is so much a part of Eastern heritage yet was imported to Europe and the West, and has since become such a strong and symbolic cultural trait of their cuisine. When you think of Asian culture, noodles and rice almost come to define the food, so I decided that if we were to eat a single meal that was not Japanese while on this trip, it should be Italian! Don't expect typical Neopolitan red sauce though - more like noodles with roe and interesting Japanese flavors I would bet!

Pickles

I sense a Tange fetish. Anyway, that's a very, ahem, diverse list of sightseeing and food interests. Or more precisely, a bara bara list. Don't know how you put it together but it certainly is crowdsourced... Like, how did you end up with Fuglen and Argento Aso on the same list, I can't fathom. I don't think a single human mind can dig the attitude, crowd, and vibe of these two places at the same time.

Speaking of which, skip Argento Aso, not really that outstanding. Blacows is a fine burger, but there is better in town. Sarashina Horii is a special kind of soba, but probably not worth blowing a lunch or dinner on. And on your list of bars, you forgot the Old Imperial Bar at the Imperial Hotel. It's the only original bit left from the FLW building, and it comes with the same bartenders. It reminds me of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbLB21If2YA

Pureboy

A few suggestions- I never made it to the Sumo hall but right next to it is the Edo-Tokyo Museum. IMO this is a must-do. If you want to see the evolution of life in Edo (the old name for Tokyo) through the years and how it developed into the megalopolis it is today, you can't do better than this.

If you are interested in cultural experiences, check to see if a Sumo tournament overlaps with your trip, and where it will be. I went to one in Osaka and loved it. The kabuki theater in Ginza just reopened, see if you can catch a kabuki performance and rent the English in-ear translation. I would just pick one performance and get the standing room ticket, go with the one that looks like it has the most going on.

Also, while on the low end of gastronomic bliss, definitely spend some time in different conbinis (convenience stores like 7-11 or Lawsons). They are ubiquitous but a very different experience from the American version. Lots of cool food choices, items for sale you would never think would be in a store like that, and if you are lucky you can find drinks with special promo items attached that make great souvenirs.

OliverB

Haha thanks for the tip and thank you SO much for letting em know about the Old Imperial - I hadn't realized that there was anything left/salvaged of that tragic demolition so it's definitely rocketing to the very top of my list!

Blacows is knocked off as I don't really need to eat hamburgers in Tokyo. We probably won't do Argento. In fact, here's the same list again, slightly refined, with bullet points - the ones marked with 2 bullet points are the places that we're putting higher priority towards and are "must-visit"...


DINNER

•• Sushi Saito - (Sushi)
•• Sushi Araki - (Sushi)
• Sukiyabashi Jiro - (Sushi)
• Sushi Kanesaka - (Sushi)
• Sushi Yoshitake - (Sushi)
• Hagazumi - (Omakase)
•• RyuGin - (Modern Kaiseki)
•• Ginza Okuda - (Modern Kaiseki)
•• Ishikawa - (Modern Kaiseki)
• Kanda - (Modern Kaiseki)
•• Aronia de Takazawa - (French-Japanese)
•• Seiju - (Tempura)
•• Kondo - (Tempura)
•• Yokota - (Tempura)
• Raku-tei - (Tempura)
• Tofuya Ukai - (Tofu)
• Argento Aso - (Italian)


LUNCH

•• Hatsunezushi - (Sushi)
•• Hirosaku - (Kaiseki/Soba)
•• Nodaiwa - (Unagi)
•• Butagumi - (Tonkatsu)
• Maisen - (Tonkatsu)
•• Tempura Tsunahachi Honten - (Tempura)
•• Rokurinsha Tokyo Ramen Station - (Ramen)
•• Chukasoba Suzuran - (Ramen)
• Shichisai - (Ramen)
• Honda Ramen - (Ramen)
• Ichiran - (Ramen)
• Sarashina-Horii - (Soba)


INBETWEEN

• Shinjuku Takashimaya (Depachika)
• Shinjuku Iseta (Depachika)
• Nihonbashi Takashimaya (Depachika)


BREAKFAST

•• Tsukiji Fish Market
•• Omusubi Gonbei



I've read that Araki Sushi has closed which is really disappointing!
Kanesaka and Yoshitake are also on my radar, but Seito and Araki seemed the most interesting and distinctive. I'd considered Sukiyabashi Jiro and had also heard wonderful things about Hatsunezushi in Kamata (perhaps a lunch option?) but I'm not sure if that's on the same level as the others. We would like to have 2 high-end omakase experiences while in Tokyo and I'm trying to decide what would be the closest equal or substitute for Araki and offer a nice contrast to Seito as well.

We are planning 3 evenings at RyuGin, Ginza Okuda, and Ishikawa and I'm wondering whether these choices may be too similar? They all serve modern kaiseki style meals and I wonder if any should be altered or swapped out as I don't want things to get boring. Kanda was also on my radar, but the above 3 seemed most interesting. Do you have an opinion on any of these or advice to offer?

Aronia de Takazawa is a must for me. I've been following feedback on Chowhound and through travel blogs, review sites, etc. and I'm very much looking forward to our meal at this restaurant; it seems like a unique dining experience!

On to lunches... Nodaiwa for unagi seems a must.

Butagumi for tonkatsu as well, although Maisen was also a consideration.

If you had to chose between a single tonkatsu lunch in Tokyo, which of the two would it be and why - Butagumi or Maisen?

Tempura Tsunahachi Honten is on the short list for lunchtime tempura and a contrast to the more refined Michelin dining selections above. A good call?

For ramen, I have Rokurinsha in Tokyo Ramen Station as well as Chukasoba Suzuran at the top of the list. Rokurinsha seems a must, although I'm told the lines can be crazy unless you arrive at opening. I don't mind lines so much (within reason) if the food is worth the wait! Honda, also on Ramen Street, and Ichiran were also recommended to me, but seemes less interesting from what research I've done. Any thoughts on these choices?

For soba, I'm told that Hirosaku is divine, however it seems to be more of a kaiseki restaurant. From what I've seen on blogs and reviews, I'm really looking forward to this place! Do you have any other suggestions for a more casual and strictly soba experience? Sarashina-Horii was also on the short list, but if you don't feel it's worthwhile, I'll scratch it off. I'd love to get some other recommendations as well!

For breakfasts, brunches and snacks, we'll be wandering the Shinjuku Takashimaya, Iseta and Takashimaya as well as the market stalls. Omusubi Gonbei also seems like a good breakfast option.

Is there any "must try" places that you feel we're overlooking or missing out on in Tokyo? Are we leaning too much to the delicate high end meals? I figured that at least 1/3 of our trip would be spent in more rural towns eating plenty of bento style dinners at the many ryokans and more rustic regional food, so we're using Tokyo, in all it's overblown excesses, as our grand splurge on everything - food, drinks, nightlife, etc! We'll be eating our way through the heart and soul of Osaka's street food and standing-room lunch counters, etc. so I planned a more refined dining itinerary for Tokyo.

What do you think, are we off to a good start??

OliverB

PS - What is the attitude/crowd/vibe like at Fuglen?

I'm not very familiar with it at all, but read about the unique concept of vintage Scandinavian mid century design shop and nighttime cocktail bar which seemed really interesting. I'm an enthusiast and somewhat of a collector of Danish Modern design and so I thought it would be really fascinating to see what this place is all about, but if it's an unbearable crowd and atmosphere, it's definitely not a "must visit" type of place. It was more of a curio.

OliverB

Thanks so much!!!

I will definitely check out the Edo-Tokyo Museum (are the exhibits tourist friendly?) and it would be my dream to catch a kabuki show and/or a sumo tournament. We'll be travelling throughout the entire month of October 2014 (possibly into the first week of Nov.) so I'm keeping my fingers crossed that we somehow overlap with one of these events!

Pickles

Insufferable, flatulent hipsters with a "curated" fetish, and the service is slow as all hell. But the coffee is great. Go early in the day when it isn't too busy (the hipsters don't get up before noon) and it is definitely a fine place to spend an hour, great coffee and pastries. I don't know how much "Danish Modern" design you could fit in a space the size of an average living room, but you can try it out, the building isn't exactly conducive to showcasing anything, it's just a small converted house that they've fitted with a couple of tables, sofas, and chairs.

For the record, I go there all the time, the owner of the building and lead investor in Fuglen Tokyo is a friend of mine. I just find it odd to see it pop up in a visitor's list. Maybe that insufferable, flatulent uber-hipster with a "curated" fetish, Tyler "Creme" Brule wrote about it in some gasbag screed or another, and so it pops up in people's screens. Good for my friend, but odd.

Pureboy

Sorry, the sumo schedule is September in Tokyo and starting November 9 in Fukuoka. Nothing in October.

Yes, the museum is totally English-friendly and very visual. There are lots of models and full-sized displays of life in Tokyo.

There are plenty of other things to see/do in Tokyo as well (obviously) but I'm sure that will be fleshed out later, and you can find tons of ideas in previous threads and all over the interwebz.

Also, I just wanted to check the Himeji restoration timeline since you trip is 1.5 years out. Looks like you will miss the full reopening by a few months, but it'll be ready for your next trip.

Pickles

Actually, the Imperial demolition wasn't all into the garbage pile. The lobby and hotel entrance are at Meiji Mura, in Nagoya, and you can visit. If you're an architecture freak, the Meiji Mura is a very worthwhile place.

Okuda and Ishikawa are similar, and both are very different from Ryugin. I prefer Ishikawa to Okuda, it's more daring and Ishikawa-san is a great guy.

Aronia de Takazawa is no more, now it's only called Takazawa, but I heard it isn't that different.

Butagumi vs. Maisen... Butagumi has better tonkatsu, but Maisen is a cultural experience, so it's a toss up. If you want a cultural experience, though, Tonki is where you should go.

Tsunahachi Honten is fine, but it gets a lot of airplay because the white water buffalo have deemed it the place to go. I don't think it is that outstanding, and probably about average relative to many other options, but whatever.

Now, for breakfast, if you're heading to Taniguchi's Okura, you should have breakfast at the Orchid Room, it'll take you back to 1962 and their French Toast is killer.

OliverB

Thanks Pickles, perhaps I can x this one off the list then. Do they not serve cocktails in the evening? I was under the impression that it was a vintage furniture (mid century Scandinavian design) shop during the day and cocktail bar at night, unless I'm confusing it with another. This place has a second shop in Oslo, right? Regardless, if it's a hipster hangout I'd sooner catch a cab in the opposite direction! I guess it's not entirely an unfortunate attribute of American middle-class society then? At least there's probably less facial hair and moustaches in Japan, ha!

OliverB

Best advice ever, thank you!!!!