RTW1

Let's end this discussion... you clearly feel you get all the information at the time of booking, and I clearly don't since no rates or no-show fees are ever mentioned.
And from the lack of response by GP Concierge when people point that out, nothing will change anytime soon.

skunker

Maybe get a prepaid CC and use it to secure the room. They shouldn't run anything when you book the room only when they try to charge some outrageous no-show fee.

When I booked the PH Maldives my Private Line rep was very clear that there was a no-show fee and a late cancellation fee (less than two weeks). I believe it was over $1,000. When I called back to change the dates the Diamond Line rep restated the fees, but suggested that if I did need to cancel within two weeks of the stay to just change the dates to further out and then cancel.

skywalkerLAX

Bluntly speaking, this wording alone is misleading in the following way.

I book a room on points and I am being charged 18,000 Points. Then I read the cancellation policy and it says "...charge for one night's room if it's not cancelled prior to that deadline." Who says anything about a charge in money? The currency I used to 'prepay' for the room were points. Just like when I prepay for a room in USD let's say 100$, that means the accommodation is paid for. They can't come to me and say you haven't checked in for your 100$ Prepaid Reservation so now we charge you the rack rate of 390$.

Why can't they just process the points and debit it to the program just like any other stay? It seems to me that the programs and corporate leave the door open or even encourage to a huge fraud operation in this matter.

I think one can argue this in three steps:

1) A universal disclosure hidden in fine print somewhere on the website about 'first night room [charge]' as penalty for no show/late cancellation is not sufficient.

2) The wording is generally misleading in combination with a points booking.

3) The wording fails to 'build the bridge' towards the assumption that real currency is being charged for failure to comply with cancellation policies.

Points 1 & 3 alone would be enough to have this matter decided against the hotel (Group) in certain jurisdictions. Not sure about the U.S. where it certainly depends on the state where this is being litigated but in the E.U. this would probably go against Hyatt et al.

GUWonder

Hyatt (and/or its hotels') policy is easily challenged legally, at least domestically in most of the US. If the dollar amount for a room is not disclosed at the time of booking and the room is unoccupied by the booking consumer, the hotels in the main are on doubtful legal foundations to charge an amount and in a currency not disclosed at the time of booking. This is a case where the hotels hope more people fail to challenge the charges than challenge the unauthorized charge amounts not disclosed at time of booking. Hotel bookings by retail consumers aren't blank checks (from consumers) that legally grant hotels an allowance to make up any dollar amount the hotel wishes to charge after the booking is already made.

1. Contact the hotel and ask them to remove the dollar charges that were never disclosed and agreed to by you.
2. If hotel refuses, contact the hotel at a later time, escalate and try again. Make them aware that you are considering disputing the charges with your card company.
3. Consider contacting bank card company to dispute the charges.
4. If card company isn't helpful, consider small claims court but first give the hotel another chance to remove the charges before filing in SCC by making the hotel aware of that option.

GUWonder

I've been looking into this matter and it's interesting.

It appears that this is probably something Hyatt should fix sooner than later -- for its own sake -- especially as it appears that Hyatt hotels are arbitrarily charging customers a dollar amount that varies greatly from night to night even as customers are never made aware that they may be subjected to variable dollar prices -- prices not numerically disclosed in advance -- after having been debited points and/or promotional awards for the "free night(s)". Even looking at just one Hyatt hotel in the course of a 7-day period, the no-show cash charges for such situations have been varying by more than even $100-$150 per night from one "free night" to another "free night". [The reason this change in price to the customer happens is because Hyatt GP generally reimburses properties on a variable basis, a basis whose details are not generally known by consumers since the hotel doesn't supply customers with the details.]

I am not sure what Hyatt is thinking in allowing for this situation to continue as is. This is the kind of stuff which makes for litigation -- even class action litigation -- and ought to be nipped in the bud as soon as possible. In other words, Hyatt GoldPassport should get Hyatt's legal department involved to help get this fixed for purposes going forward as well.

What makes this so amusing in some ways is that hotels are charging no-show fees in local currency (USD in the main) even for award stays with the following kind of rate details:

Notice the use of the word "free" above in the rate information.

The cancellation information in the confirmation is followed by a mention of applicable taxes, but hotel taxes in the main are not charged/collected by the government for no-show reservations and thus not applicable. In other words, there generally are no applicable taxes due in such situations except perhaps because the hotels want there to be some and charge an arbitrary amount to the customer without proper disclosure.

saaru

Completely agree. In my case it was resolved in my favor though it left me with a sour taste in the mouth. I am not sure if it was resolved for me since I am a diamond but irrespective of the status there is no reason to have to go through this nonsense. SPG policy is what Hyatt should follow. IF the room was booked ith points, deduct the points. Nothing gives them a carte blanche to deduct what they please.

JetAway

Any litigation by a guest over these kinds of issues would/should go to small claims court, which, in most jurisdictions, is a court of equity. A small claims court would award the hotel its actual, provable losses resulting from the no-show and nothing more. It would not get bogged down construing the T&Cs.

BKKLEE

-1
If the guest has agreed to the T&Cs they would be enforced unless they are determined to be punitive.....
If legal action is undertaken, why limit one self to small claims court - since this seems to be a general way for Hyatt, file it as a claim with request for "class action" certification....

GUWonder

I wouldn't be so sure about that.

The hotel is due what amount of money and from whom? Bookings using Hyatt points or promotional awards for "free night(s)" are in the main settled in money terms between Hyatt/Hyatt GoldPassport and the hotel while Hyatt/Hyatt GoldPassport charges the customer in GoldPassport points or promotional awards for "free night(s)".

The "free night" no-show guests are the ones with actual, provable losses. The hotel has no contract with the guest that stipulates the amount of money due from a no-show guest when it comes to GoldPassport "reward" nights.

TallestHotelInJapan

Cancelling is not so easy with Hyatt's user-unfriendly policy (i.e. 24 hours before). Every once in a while I must cancel on very short notice (e.g. same day). One other reason to book more user-friendly chains, e.g. SPG or Swissôtel

jayer

Not that I understand how the penalty for no-show becomes money rather than you are stuck eating the points, but . . .

Way more than once I've called the hotel direct to cancel on very short notice. The only problem was getting to the front desk and not having some operator try and transfer me to central reservations. I suppose this would be more difficult if it was on the other side of the world and there were language barriers.

GUWonder

Class action litigation is much more costly and slower to pursue than small claims court claims, of that there is no doubt, at least in the US. [The US isn't the only jurisdiction where class action/group litigation is possible and may be pursued.]

Given how Hyatt operates across borders, why even leave open increased chances for group/class-action litigation in one or more jurisdictions by not revising policy and practices in this regard?

Current Hyatt practices in many -- if not even most -- "free night" no-show cases lead to customer accounts being double-charged for a given night; first, the GP account is debited; and then the credit/debit card account is debited.

peteropny

Lets stop the bickering in this thread.

Clearly, at least practically, Hyatt's penalty for a no show on an award needs to be clarified - perhaps in a way similar to Starwood which clearly identifies the penalty (which is clearly outrageous - the "rack rate" the possibly the room you were upgraded to (suites possibly for Platinums at properties that pre-block them).

peteropny - co-mod - Hyatt

nnn

Do Hyatts have a no-show policy on pre-paid, nonrefundable cash stays? To me, that would be analogous, as the hotel stands to lose only the profit it would have expected to make off of your purchase of incidentals. (By contrast, they save some small amount by not having to service the unused room.)

GUWonder

I wouldn't consider that analogous at all, as the monetary charges are explicitly numerated in the reservation for the rate booked for the kind of stay you mention above.

The Hyatt policy for no-shows on "pre-paid", non-refundable cash rates allows for the hotel to charge the monetary amount explicitly numerated in the reservation for the rate booked. The GP reward night bookings include no explicitly-numerated monetary amount in the reservation for the rate booked -- that is the difference which has led to this thread about the legality of what is occurring.