jiejie

Not meaning to answer for @moondog, but usually it's a bad idea for logistics reasons due to the geography, particularly when our usual GW recommendations are for Mutianyu, Jinshanling, or maybe Huanghua or Jiankou. The route you would take to get between any of those and the TofH puts you squarely in Beijing's worst traffic jams, and travel time could easily take an extra hour to get through that. Hence my suggestion of Badaling GW which I think is reasonable in certain situations and at certain times of the year. Your visit happens to fit this. While it would by no means be traffic-free, it is more direct and this part of the GW is closer to the city. And coming back into Beijing to the TOH, the middle of the day is not quite as bad as morning/evening rush hour, hence my suggestion to put this in the early afternoon.

If your co-worker has an itch to see the GW, I suggest you go ahead and scratch it. Certainly I'd rank it higher than the Summer Palace at this time of year, even if it is Badaling and even with the logistics. If you cannot come to an agreement, then maybe she goes to the GW with the driver (doesn't really need a guide) and you can go to the Summer Palace with or without the guide, and on their way back in, they can pick you up at an S.P. exit to go to lunch and the TofH.

While I would get a relatively early start, like leaving Beijing around 07:00-ish, in winter I don't see a lot of point to get up before dawn and trying to get to Badaling much earlier than 08:00. Certainly I'd try to get breakfast at the hotel before you leave, assuming it starts serving at 06:00 and is included in the room rate.

Hoyaheel

Thank you for clarifying - that is very helpful! I have to admit I've been caught up in work and not doing the preemptive trip planning I usually do and since I've only had a half day in Beijing before, this is all new to me.

For some reason, the guide my co-worker has hired (that her sister used, and he's been very responsive via email) is really pushing the Summer Palace. As I've said, I don't have a preference - I'll see whatever we can (I'm pretty laissez faire about travel - I'll see what I see, if we get back again great, and if not - I've enjoyed what I've done - I hate the "must see EVERYTHING right now" approach because it's not relaxing).

moondog

While it's true that most of us here aren't eager to plug the Summer Palace as part of a "1 in day in Beijing" plan and that winter is not its best season, consider the following:

-Apples to oranges aside, SP is much nicer than the ToH
-one of the biggest drawbacks to the SP the fact that it is kind of far away, but since you happen to be staying reasonably close to it, this doesn't apply to your case

Incidentally, jiejie summed up my objection to your ToH/GW plan quite nicely (next to impossible to do with sane logistics).

jiejie

Yes, maybe what you should do is skip the Temple of Heaven, and do Badaling GW and the Summer Palace, which makes more sense logistically and could fit quite nicely in a one-day plan. It sounds like the guide just doesn't want to go to the GW. Remember that the guide works for you, not the other way around, so figure out what you and coworker want and insist upon it. If you decide to do GW + SP then doing in either order is fine.

Hoyaheel

To be fair - we hadn't asked the guide about doing the Great Wall. I just didn't understand why he was preferring Summer Palace over Forbidden City. I'm sure he'll do what we want but have been somewhat deferring to his suggestions assuming he has greater knowledge of logistics than we do

We just asked the guide about GW and the recommendation came back that echoed JPDM's - do the Great Wall on our final day - luggage in the car - and the driver will bring us to the airport after the tour. So we're back asking him which section he's talking about and for more details....

Just printed my boarding passes......And finally got the agenda for our Mon/Tues meetings

JPDM

I am surprised to read the advice above. It is very typical to do the Temple of Heaven and Great Wall in the same day, especially for people who are only in Beijing for a short time.
I still support the idea of doing the ToH in the morning. You can head for Mutianyu between 10h and 11h at which time the rush hour is long over (although there is always a fair amount of traffic in Beijing).
You will get to Mutianyu sometimes around mid-day which gives you more time than you need to see it. I recommend doing the Great Wall in mid-day in the winter in any case as any ice on the steps will have melted by then and it won't be as cold as going early in the day.
I guess that it all comes down to individual opinions but I have been to the Summer Palace a few times and find it boring and I assume that it would be even more so in the winter.
People used to combine the Great Wall with the Summer Palace on the same day but that was before the subway to the Summer Palace. It made sense to have the driver take you to this attraction which was out of the way and without proper public transportation. No longer the case but geographically it is sort of in the same direction as Badaling if you choose to go there. Badaling and the Summer Palace make sense as a combination.
Personally, if friends were visiting, I would never ever suggest a Summer Palace + Badaling day. But hey, we all have our opinions.

JPDM

Ok, you posted as I was writing and I kind of lost track of the story here as it goes back and forth over a few pages. If you are planning to catch a flight after the Great Wall then for sure you have to go to Mutianyu. Based on your recent posts, I was under the impression that you were trying to fill a full day and this is what my previous post addressed.

Hoyaheel

Sorry to have asked too many questions and changed options over a couple of pages (and threads)

Here is the current plan:
1. Fly to Beijing on Sat, arrive Sunday Dec 6. Will go to dinner somewhere Sunday night - probably Dali Courtyard? (not wedded to that so if you have a better suggestion, tell me!^)

2. Mon & Tues - meetings, purpose of trip. Presumably will have a group dinner on Monday but if we're free on Tues we could go to dinner again if you have recommendations.

3. Wednesday - tour with driver & guide, Summer Palace and Temple of Heaven. Then shopping & dinner, hopefully (that would be on our own)

4. Thursday - Great Wall (Huanghuacheng or Mutianyu) then airport for late afternoon flight.

jiejie

Now that we can see the entire context, this is making more sense. I had the impression you were on a transit visit, in on Sunday late afternoon, departing Tuesday early afternoon. With this amount of time, I think the plan is OK, but it is sad that you are skipping the Forbidden City, which I'd rank as a higher-value target than either the SP (in winter) or the TofH.

Hoyaheel

I think I am sad about Forbidden City too so will email the guide to ask for his reasons for preferring/pushing Summer Palace. He basically said it's the same as FC but he likes it better....(in the context of religious site vs "household" site to justify seeing TofH instead of SP and FC together - that I get, but he hasn't said why one "house" is better than the other...)

moondog

There's no need to be sad.

Thoughts:
-Swap out ToH for Forbidden City
-You could devise a walking plan that starts at Tiananmen and ends at your hotel (covering Forbidden City, Beihai, and Gulou)
*if you do this, pass on the Summer Palace unless you possess exceptional endurance

Flamenguista

Myself and the wife will be breaking up the long journey to Cambodia by stopping in Beijing, where we will take advantage of the 72 hour TWOV. We don't want to rush and see tons of things, but given the small amount of time, I want to plan this intelligently. The only "musts" for us are The Great Wall at Mutianyu, The Forbidden City, and food. We will be there during xmas time in winter.

Monday - Arrive at 17:55 - Eat Dinner and Sleep
Tuesday - ???
Wednesday - ??? - Depart for Siem Reap at 18:45

My big doubt is when to hire the driver? I read earlier in the thread where someone recommended to combine the GW with the flight departure to take advantage of the driver. But will this allow proper time to get to Mutianyu, enjoy the GW without rushing, and get back to the airport with proper time (2-3 hours early) for a 18:45 departure? And further complicating this is the weather in December. So should we give the wall its own day and maybe use the driver to combine it with something else on the way if we have time? Or should we combine the Wall with our departure flight? Thanks.

jiejie

Usable daylight hours in late December are around 08:00-16:00.

Tuesday Plan: Forbidden City, followed by Houhai/Shichahai hutong exploration. Duck dinner. Do this on your own, by taxi/subway/foot.

Wednesday Plan: Hire the driver for full day service hotel door to airport door. Have breakfast and check out of hotel around 08:00. Temple of Heaven 08:30-10:30 (assuming you are in a central hotel not one on the north/northeast side). Drive to Mutianyu arrive around 12:00. Have lunch first in Mutianyu village. Up on Wall 13:00-15:00. That is about all you can likely stand in winter, especially if the wind is up--it's quite cold and exposed. Depart by 15:30, to airport 16:30. I presume you are taking the Air China nonstop to REP. This is more than enough time before an 18:45 flight departure.

Flamenguista

Thanks a lot for the advice.

sxpsxpsxp

I'm going on a business trip to China in July and decided to take advantage by side-tracking to Beijing for a day. I am going to arrive on a saturday, probably in the afternoon (I expect 3-5pm), and will be leaving sunday, probably in the evening (there's a 7pm flight I'm looking at). I'm overwhelmed by what to do and where to stay.

My preference would be SPG hotels, but the website is giving me 12 choices! I would also consider a HHonors hotel. Any advice on which hotel for the best location would be appreciated.

For my sight-seeing, I am thinking of hiring a driver/guide to go to the Great Wall on Sunday. Mutianyu was recommended by a co-worker, who hired Stretch-a-Leg Travel to take her there.

I was thinking that perhaps I could so some walking/sight-seeing saturday evening after my arrival, either on my own or with a guide. Any recommendations?