stimpy

A friend has a Euro passport which is part of the visa-waiver program. He wants to stay in the US for about 5 months, but the visa-waiver program has a maximum of 3 months I hear. If after 2 months he heads across the border for a Canadian weekend and then re-enters the US, does the clock start again for another 3 months?

Gargoyle

That is what I understand. A friend from Italy was in the U.S. last year with work permission under this, and the job took too long- he overstayed by a couple weeks, and he said that if he had gone to Canada he would have been ok. Instead they caught him on his exit, deported him (why? he was on his way out anyway), and he will not be permitted back for five years.

A shame, he's a very highly specialized craftsman, comes here to do installations, and is in his mid to late 60's. So it's not so likely he'll come back to work, and that is our loss. DHS caught him, but they miss 12 million others.
(lets not go there!)

stimpy

Question. How could they catch him or anyone on exit? There is no immigration check when you leave the US.

Gargoyle

I'll be back in Italy in a few weeks, I'll ask him the details. Maybe the airline cross-checked his passport and outted him? Perhaps he didn't have an open return and had to get the ticket reissued?

dodo

At the port of entry, the INS rep must validate the I-94 form - Record of Departure/Arrival - which notes the length of stay for admission in the US.

I believe that once the visitor leaves the US, that I-94 form is removed from his passport and returned to the INS office ( don't know whether this is done by the Airline or security before boarding international flights from the US)

As a Canadian, I am used to transborder flight and I don't know exactly who removes the I-94 from the passport but I have a relative who is on a G-visa in DC. She travels a lot and she goes through that process of getting the I-94 form every time she goes through a port of entry. During her last trip back to the US, she came through IAD late during the night and the INS officer didn't include the I-94 in her passport and she has been requested to go back to Dulles with proof of that recent flight so that they can issue another I-94 form and the proper authorization to enter the States ( believe that since she is canadian, the INS officer didn't think that she needed one). Otherwise she may be in trouble the next time she tries to leave the US for another overseas trip

dodo

I believe that this is the answer you were looking from this source

Q: I am in the United States on a tourist visa (no visa, Visa Waiver Program). I heard that if I go to Canada or Mexico, I can come back to the U.S. for another 90 days, is this true?

ANSWER: No, generally, any person going to Canada or Mexico for less than 30 days is readmitted on the same I-94, so if you leave, say, after the 60th day you are in the U.S., you would merely be admitted for the 30 days left on your I-94. If your I-94 is expiring, it is really up to the border patrol to determine if they will admit you into the United States. It depends on if you can convince the CBP that your intent to re-enter is as a tourist, even though you have already spent 90 days in the U.S. as a tourist. We have also heard of persons obtaining new I-94 cards, even though the I-94 is not expired. Although this is not the official policy, the ultimate discretion lies with the CBP and if you convince them or if by error, you do receive a new I-94 with 90 days, consider yourself lucky, since it is far from automatic.

jpdx

Going to Canada or Mexico does not have any implications on the 90-day limit. The I-94 will remain in your passport. You may be able to sweettalk a DHS agent, but this is just a tad more likely than winning $100m in the lottery just in time to bribe someone.

In reality, you'll have to leave the US/Canada/Mexico and then re-enter. Even this advice isn't perfectly sound (as there are other limitations to stays on the visa waiver program), but it usually works.

B747-437B

The VWP grants admission for upto 90 days to "contiguous territory" which is defined as the United States, Canada, Mexico and "adjacent islands"*.

As per this rule, travel within "contiguous territory" does not relinquish the status conferred at the initial POE and hence a person may be found to be "out of status" (and hence subject to removal and disbarment) even though they may not have violated their terms of admission by virtue of physical presence in the United States.

(* - "adjacent islands" in turn is defined as "Anguilla, Antigua, Aruba, Bahamas, Barbados, Barbuda, Bermuda, Bonaire, British Virgin Islands, Cayman Islands, Cuba, Curacao, Dominica, Dominican Republic, Grenada, Guadeloupe, Haiti, Jamaica, Marie-Galante, Martinique, Miquelon, Montserrat, Saba, Saint-Barthelemy, Saint Christopher, Saint Eustatius, Saint Kitts-Nevis, Saint Lucia, Saint Maarten, Saint Martin, Saint Pierre, Saint Vincent, Grenadines, Trinidad, Tobago, Turks and Caicos Islands and Other British, French and Netherlands territory or possessions bordering on the Caribbean Sea")

In brief, the person would have to travel at least as far as Guatemala in order to qualify to "reset" the VWP clock.

hfly

Years ago with great difficulty I was able to convince an INS agent at a land crossing into the US to issue a new one for a girlfriend at the time. Back then (late 80's) it was incredibly difficult to do, so difficult in fact that the officer outside couldn;t believe that I had gotten the guy inside to do it. I've got to believe that in today's climate it would be near impossible. The guys best bet would be to find the cheapest flight available to venezuela or Ireland or somewhere, spend the weekend and then come back.

ContinentalFan

You've been given the correct information on the 90-day rule; there is no easy way to restart the clock.

If you want a good resource on all things to do with immigration, check out "The Immigration Procedures Handbook": it's a step-by-step guide on applying or petitioning for different visas or residency. Unfortunately, the only visa that seems to be missing from the latest few editions is the H-1B, but it is an excellent resource. It's normally available in major libraries--or law libraries.

alanh

What about getting a visa? If they'll do it, at $100 it's going to be cheaper than flying to South America.

jpdx

Obtaining a visa for the US is an awful hassle these days, and anyone who ever stood in line at a US consulate would surely prefer spending a fun weekend in Guatemala to this experience. I mean, really, 75% of visa holders would probably prefer getting robbed in Guatemala to returning to a US consulate. Btw., the true visa cost (travel to the interview site, hotel stays, etc.) is significantly higher than the visa fee.

stimpy

Thanks. The J1 visa really has me confused. A family member has a 5 year J1 visa, but only the first year was arranged by AFS. This next year is on our own and I don't really know for sure if the visa is still legal or not. The State dept website is quite confusing.

jpdx

I assume this is not the person you mentioned in the OP.

It's a difficult question to answer, as it depends on a lot of variables. What type of J-1 is it? Research, student, practical training, seasonal worker, etc? J-1s are typically linked to a sponsoring organization (or purpose of stay), and the 5-year validity is uncommon. How was your relative admitted (D/S or date on the I-94)? You'll probably be better off contacting the sponsor than talking to the INS or listening to advice from FTers.

Gargoyle

The J-1's I've been familiar with have all been 18 month max. So, yours is an unusual situation (J-1's are unusual anyway, there are no more than a couple thousand of them a year, unlike H1-B's which are in the 100,000 range); you'll need either an immigration lawyer who has experience with J-1 or a good contact at the INS.

As jpdx mentioned, normally there is a sponsoring organization like AIPT, and they handle all the paperwork. (they also offer very inexpensive health insurance for the people they sponsor, so that is a great benefit). Note the "global reach seminar" link on their site- they give J-1 seminars.