Rudi

Comparison of mileage and Status-effects (UA or LH) of my next August/September 99 trips as follows:

*the ticket:
StarAlliance round-the-world "RTWSTAR2" (business, max 34'000 miles, SFr 6'875 = $ 4'700, with LH I am an "ordinary ff-member" with UA I am 1K which should favour UA !!!)

*trip-details:
Trip details are under the two months (August 99 and September 99 under the Buzz)

* Mileage Comparison:
LH 3677 Zuerich-Munich, real miles: 154, minimum LH 1'000, UA 500
business bonus: LH 100%, UA 25%
total miles: LH 2'000, UA 625
Status miles: LH 2'000, UA 500

LH 167 Munich-Frankfurt, real miles: 195, minimum LH 1'000, UA 500
business bonus: LH 100%, UA 25%
total miles: LH 2'000, UA 625
Status miles: LH 2'000, UA 500

LH 778 Frankfurt-Singapore, real miles: 6'390
business bonus: LH 100%, UA 25%
total miles: LH 12'780, UA 7'988
Status miles: LH 12'780, UA 6'390

SK 972 SIN - Bangkok, real miles: 893
business bonus: LH 100%, UA 25%
total miles: LH 1'786, UA 1'116
Status miles: LH 1'786, UA 893

TG 628 Bangkok-Hong Kong, real miles: 1'063
business bonus: LH 100%, UA 25%
mileage credit: LH 2'126, UA 1'329
Status miles: LH 2'126, UA 1'063

AN 888 Hong Kong-Sydney, real miles: 4'571
business bonus: LH 100%, UA 25%
mileage credit: LH 9'142, UA 5'714
Status miles: LH 9'142, UA 4'571

NZ 102 Sydney-Auckland, real miles: 1'345
business bonus: LH 100%, UA 25%
mileage credit: LH 2'690, UA 1'681
Status miles: LH 2'690 UA 1'345

NZ 12 Auckland-Honolulu, real miles: 4'389
business bonus: LH 100%, UA 25%
mileage credit: LH 8'778, UA 5'486
Status miles: LH 8'778, UA 4'389

AC 22 HNL - YVR Vancouver, real miles: 2'704
business bonus: LH 100%, UA 25%
mileage credit: LH 5'408, UA 3'380
Status miles: LH 5'408, UA 2'702

UA 6852 YVR - Seattle, real miles: 177, minimum 500
ff bonus: LH 0%, UA 100% (1K)
mileage credit: LH 500, UA 1'000
Status miles: LH 500, UA 500

UA 2109 SEA - San Francisco, real miles: 678
class bonus (domestic first): LH 200%, UA 50%
ff-bonus: LH 0%, UA 100% (1K)
mileage credit: LH 2'034, UA 1'695
Status miles: LH 2'034, UA 678

UA 1045 SFO - SNA, real miles: 372, minimum 500
class bonus (domestic first): LH 200%, UA 50%
ff-bonus: LH 0%, UA 100% (1K)
mileage credit: LH 1'500, UA 1'250
Status miles: LH 1'500, UA 500 !!!

UA 5112 SNA - LAX, real miles: 36, minimum 500
ff-bonus: LH 0%, UA 100% (1K)
mileage credit: LH 500, UA 1'000
Status miles: LH 500, UA 500

UA 126 LAX - MCO, real miles: 2'217
class bonus (domestic first): LH 200%, UA 50%
ff-bonus: LH 0%, UA 100% (1K)
mileage credit: LH 6'651, UA 5'543
Status miles: LH 6'651, UA 2'217 !!!

UA 91 MCO-LAX, real miles: 2'217
class bonus (domestic first): LH 200%, UA 50%
ff-bonus: LH 0%, UA 100% (1K)
mileage credit: LH 6'651, UA 5'543
Status miles: LH 6'651, UA 2'217 !!!

UA 7921 LAX-SNA, real miles: 36, minimum 500
ff-bonus: LH 0%, UA 100% (1K)
mileage credit: LH 500, UA 1'000
Status miles: LH 500, UA 500

UA 5160 SNA-LAX, real miles: 36, minimum 500
ff-bonus: LH 0%, UA 100% (1K)
mileage credit: LH 500, UA 1'000
Status miles: LH 500, UA 500

UA 18 LAX-JFK, real miles: 2'475
business-class bonus:LH 100%, UA 25%
ff-bonus: LH 0%, UA 100% (1K)
mileage credit: LH 4'950, UA 6'188
Status miles: LH 4'950, UA 2'475

LH 405 JFK - Frankfurt, real miles: LH 3'855
business-class bonus: LH 100%, UA 25%
mileage credit: LH 7'710, UA 4'819
Status miles: LH 7'710, UA 3'855

LH 3662 FRA - Zürich, real miles: LH 178, minimum 1'000 (LH), 500 (UA)
business-class bonus: LH 100%, UA 25%
mileage credit: LH 2'000, UA 625
Status miles: LH 2'000, UA 500 !!!

Comparison UA versus LH of the whole trip:
total real flight-miles: 33'981 (just under the 34'000 limit for this ticket)
total mileage credits (not counting promotions): LH 81'681, UA 57'605
total Status miles: LH 81'681, UA 36'797 !!!

* Commentary:

- The total mileage comparison is not fair with UA, as UA miles "weight" better for awards by an average of I guess 25% (but even than: 57'605*1.25 = 72'006 UA compared with 81'681 for LH)

- But the Status miles are more or less fully comparable (with LH 100'000 status miles for non-german-residents also qualify for the highest level = Senator as with UA for 1K). And UA is FAR behind with Status miles: LH 81'681, UA 36'797, that's 55% less Status miles with the UA-program then with LH !!!. FIFTY FIVE PERCENTS BEHIND, for the same trip, with the same ticket, flying the same StarAllaince partners!!! What a difference that makes also in flight-ticket-money to become UA's 1K compared to LH's Senator!!!

[This message has been edited by Rudi (edited 03-17-99).]

BlondeBomber

Don't forget also that on LH you only need 50% for companion award (and we do like to take along friends or family) so you are significantly ahead on both miles and status miles. My opinion is that if you are flying mostly on business or first class fares, especially internationally, LH's program is the one to be in. You don't get the domestic upgrades but you make up for it with higher status, free lounge access worldwide and you can always use some of your miles to purchase domestic upgrades if travelling in the U.S.

If you are flying mostly discounted fares on AC, then AC is the one to be in (given that you get points on AC based on cabin seated in and not fare paid) and it is relatively easy to get upgrades when you are a top tier member.

I haven't figured out when it is best to be a UA Mileage Plus member but probably if you are flying mostly in the U.S. on discounted fares.

It also looks to me that SAS needs to revamp its program to at least be competitive with LH!

Now we need to get details of NZ, Thai, Varig into our comparison chart and see who should seriously consider those programs.

Austman

I agree that SAS needs to update especially in the upgrades area. But one thing to note (and the comparision chart does not really show it BlondeBomber) it that if you are in EuroBonus and fly on SAS's own routes, they use a milage chart that is more than the true milage. For example on your SIN-BKK sector Rudi, EuroBonus would award you 2400 status points for your 893 mile trip instead of LH's 1786 points. Similarly Stockholm to London is 890 miles but EuroBonus members get 2400 status miles in business class. Do any of the other Star-Alliance airlines have this 'rounding up' policy?

Rudi

LH "grants" for flights ZRH-Germany, which are somewhere between 180 to 300 miles, a minimum of 1'000.

[This message has been edited by Rudi (edited 03-17-99).]

3544quebec

You may not get the US domestic upgrades in Miles and More but for each 50000 status miles (which equates to 17000 real miles if you fly 1st class) you get an intra-Europe upgrade and you can combine two of these for a confirmable Intercontinental upgrade. This to me is worth more than US domestic upgrades. And correct me if I'm wrong but the upgrades from Mileage Plus only count the United miles you fly whereas M+M's upgrades count all STAR Alliance mileage.

Rudi

If have to correct tmy first reply here: YES UA only counts UA-flight (status) miles for redeeming their upgrade vouchers, LH indeed counts the miles flown with all StarAlliance partners for their upgrades.

[This message has been edited by Rudi (edited 03-17-99).]

Rudi

But with all StarAlliance carriers-ff-programs ALL FLIGHT-miles with ALL StarAlliance-carriers count as status. But with Lufthansa (I am not aware of others), the CLASS-BONUS (100% for business, 200% for FIRST) counts for STATUS miles too.

[This message has been edited by Rudi (edited 03-17-99).]

BlondeBomber

Thanks for the input Austman. I will add the "rounding up" as a bonus to the comparison chart. I look forward to more news from SAS.

AC and SAS provide status miles on fare class bonus too. UA needs to get with the program and give status miles for fare class bonus too but then they would have a quadrillion 1Ks -- they would need to create a new category for million milers "MEGAFLYER".

Axey

I've been pondering about this topic for a while now. I'm taking a RTW trip later on this year too, and have been contemplating putting all the miles into my LH M&M account instead of my UA MP account, even though 99% of my flights are domestic on UA. Am I nuts?

I already am going to make PremEx this year with UA anyhow, and putting the RTW trip into M&M would make me an instant Senator in their program (Doing the RTWSTAR3 in First).

Now, LH charges 7500 miles for a domestic upgrade on UA. UA charges 10,000. Senator would allow me access to any lounges, anywhere, anytime (as I understand it). The only downside with being Senator is that you can't request an upgrade on UA at the gate, which is fine anyhow, because most of my travel is booked far enough in advance for me to request the (confirmed) award from LH anyhow. And besides, I could always use my UA miles.

What do the experts here think? It's difficult weighing the two. I guess it would come down to whether I'd like to be 1K on UA or PremEx on UA and Senator on LH. It seems to me being Senator has it's advantages over 1K even domestically.

Thoughts? Opinions?

Rudi

that's the future - I am pretty sure - the airlines don't want to honour anymore in the first place the wild accruel of miles at lowest fares - they (UA) will honour, in the very near future, the $ you spend more by granting class bonus (and including that for status counting). To avoid to many 1K - they (UA) will - very unfortunately increase those limits - what a sad future we have ...

BlondeBomber

I think LH is the way to go if you are paying full fare and flying business or first class a lot. If you are flying discount on UA domestically I haven't made up my mind which would be better. UA still has a lot more partners and survey bonuses etc. than any airline I know. I guess you could still earn those miles as "pocket change".

I think Rudi is going to give it a full year of testing before he makes up his mind and he is flying mostly internationally.

kyklin

I would say UA if you don't plan on flying LH often. In addition, I don't think you can upgrade within domestic North America using miles; the 7500 miles you quoted is for within S. America and has to be used in addition/conjunction with international upgrades.

A better question is, Axey, what are you dong flying RTWSTAR3 in F when you are only 19?!?

baobab

OMNI...
I was reflecting on that, ken, but then I decided that Axey was the smartest 19-year-old about.

My younger brother assured me when I turned twenty (some time ago, alas), that it was all downhill from there: my brain cells would die and not be replaced. I had my revenge, as he is now well over 20 himself.

Axey

Bomber-- I fly what my company pays for, which is usually discount unless I need to get somewhere asap. But yes, I'd say 90% of the time, my travel is planned and booked at least 14 days in advance.

Kyklin-- It is indeed possible. I've done so in the past, and in fact, will be doing so this week. I used to fly LH a lot (Lived in Europe with parents for a while) and still have around 40k M&M miles.

As for what I'm doing flying RTW in F, a friend and I have been dreaming about this for a while now, and what better time to do it than around New Years 2000? Just to prove I'm looney, we'll be celebrating New Years in Cairo at the pyramids. I really hope Y2k doesn't affect our flight out (Jan 2).

[This message has been edited by Axey (edited 03-17-99).]

BlondeBomber

It's good to see that there are "kids" (at heart anyway), both young and old, on this board. And while some of the old f*rts like me might seem a little cranky at times, generally we are still just having fun and learning lots.