Another Rules Question
Aug 5, 2004 | 2:48 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Boston
Programs: UA MM, Marriott LT Plat
Posts: 71
Another Rules Question
Everyone has been so helpful that I just have to ask. I searched but did not come up with a clear idea of what the rule is or maybe its vague for a reason...
Here goes - Upgrade lists. I have heard of the infamous PA and PB lists but 2 other issues...
1) Why do miles upgrades clear before certs?
2) Why don't all upgrades clear at the designated times for elites? I requested 2 weeks out on a miles, called at the appropriate time and was told I was now waitlisted and something about the upgrade seats being already full and I had to wait till the gate.
What are really the guidelines for one day getting an upgrade confirmed weeks out in one case but then having to wait until 20min before to see what happens in another.
Do I just need to follow the "call 3 times until I get the answer I want" rule.
If there is a post on this already I apologize. Just please point me in the right direction....
thanks
ordskier
Here goes - Upgrade lists. I have heard of the infamous PA and PB lists but 2 other issues...
1) Why do miles upgrades clear before certs?
2) Why don't all upgrades clear at the designated times for elites? I requested 2 weeks out on a miles, called at the appropriate time and was told I was now waitlisted and something about the upgrade seats being already full and I had to wait till the gate.
What are really the guidelines for one day getting an upgrade confirmed weeks out in one case but then having to wait until 20min before to see what happens in another.
Do I just need to follow the "call 3 times until I get the answer I want" rule.
If there is a post on this already I apologize. Just please point me in the right direction....
thanks
ordskier
Aug 5, 2004 | 3:22 pm
#2
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: BRS
Programs: BA GLD
Posts: 1,927
1) I don't think it's true that miles take priority over certs.
2) There may not be any upgradeable seats available when the upgrade window opens. Or, for example, there may be 5 1Ks and only 2 upgradeable seats 100 hours out. The first 2 get the seats, the other 5 are waitlisted.
2) There may not be any upgradeable seats available when the upgrade window opens. Or, for example, there may be 5 1Ks and only 2 upgradeable seats 100 hours out. The first 2 get the seats, the other 5 are waitlisted.
Aug 5, 2004 | 4:59 pm
#3
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: aspen,co usa
Posts: 189
Originally Posted by sftrvlr
1) I don't think it's true that miles take priority over certs.
2) There may not be any upgradeable seats available when the upgrade window opens. Or, for example, there may be 5 1Ks and only 2 upgradeable seats 100 hours out. The first 2 get the seats, the other 5 are waitlisted.
2) There may not be any upgradeable seats available when the upgrade window opens. Or, for example, there may be 5 1Ks and only 2 upgradeable seats 100 hours out. The first 2 get the seats, the other 5 are waitlisted.
Aug 5, 2004 | 6:14 pm
#4
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: DEN
Programs: UA 1P-1MM, Marriott LT Titanium
Posts: 4,153
Originally Posted by sftrvlr
1) I don't think it's true that miles take priority over certs.
Aug 5, 2004 | 7:00 pm
#5
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 1,722
Below is something I posted as a response to another thread, but I thought I would also post it here because it should also answer some of your questions.
I am not entirely sure about all of this, but I will attempt to explain things as I understand them. Someone please correct my mistakes. Prior to departure there is the waitlist for upgrades and a waitlist for awards. For an upgrade, one is awaiting NC/NF space to open up. For awards, one needs XY/XC/XF space to open up. According to what I have read here, there is a PA, PB, and PD waitlist. While I am not positive, I think the way it works is that the entire PA list is cleared based on dated added, and then the PB list, and then the PD list.
At a certain point prior to departure, the airport takes control of everything that hasn't cleared yet. At this point I believe everyone awaiting an upgrade gets up on the UGDG list, which I believe is part of the Departure Management List. This list is cleared based on status, fare paid, time added, and then alphabetically based on last name. However, someone who has a BP code of FFCC (meaning paid for F/C, but isn't confirmed on a flight) on a flight will trump a 1K who is trying to upgrade. Some FTers have been successful getting FFCC on awards even when s/he was never confirmed in an F cabin, but did get an F award. For example, if one has a XC award for JFK-LAX-SEA-LAX-JFK, and everything has cleared except LAX-SEA, some FTers have gotten CSRs to make them FFCC on the DM so that s/he clears before 1K just trying to upgrade using miles/certs.
There is also the standby for passengers who desire to take a flight other than the one on which s/he is confirmed. Once a CSR beings to dump confirmed reservations and passengers, the CSR will then start to clear the DM list starting with BP5As. BP5A is generally reserved for disserviced and full-fare passengers. However, some FTers have been able to get BP5A even when on cheap fares. The BP5A list is sorted by status, fare, time added, and then alphabetically by last name. After the BP5A list is cleared, if seats are still open, the BP5B list is then cleared, which contains all other revenue standbys. It is cleared in same order as BP5A. This means that a 2P with a BP code of 5A will receive a seat before a 1K with a BP code of 5B. I think the BP5A code is rarely used. If seats are still open after all revenue standbys are accommodated, non-revenue passengers (BP5C through BP10) are then accommodated on the flight. These are the passengers referred to as NRSA. There is also a PSUG list for UA employees traveling on company business who are allowed to upgrade to the next class of service. This list is cleared after all revenue upgrades are accomidated. However, I am not sure exactly how that works, or how NRSAs travel in premium cabins of seats are still available.
I hope have gotten all the information correct. If anything is wrong, please correct me, and I will change it, but this is my general understanding based on FT, my experiences, and conversations with CSRs/RSSRs.
At a certain point prior to departure, the airport takes control of everything that hasn't cleared yet. At this point I believe everyone awaiting an upgrade gets up on the UGDG list, which I believe is part of the Departure Management List. This list is cleared based on status, fare paid, time added, and then alphabetically based on last name. However, someone who has a BP code of FFCC (meaning paid for F/C, but isn't confirmed on a flight) on a flight will trump a 1K who is trying to upgrade. Some FTers have been successful getting FFCC on awards even when s/he was never confirmed in an F cabin, but did get an F award. For example, if one has a XC award for JFK-LAX-SEA-LAX-JFK, and everything has cleared except LAX-SEA, some FTers have gotten CSRs to make them FFCC on the DM so that s/he clears before 1K just trying to upgrade using miles/certs.
There is also the standby for passengers who desire to take a flight other than the one on which s/he is confirmed. Once a CSR beings to dump confirmed reservations and passengers, the CSR will then start to clear the DM list starting with BP5As. BP5A is generally reserved for disserviced and full-fare passengers. However, some FTers have been able to get BP5A even when on cheap fares. The BP5A list is sorted by status, fare, time added, and then alphabetically by last name. After the BP5A list is cleared, if seats are still open, the BP5B list is then cleared, which contains all other revenue standbys. It is cleared in same order as BP5A. This means that a 2P with a BP code of 5A will receive a seat before a 1K with a BP code of 5B. I think the BP5A code is rarely used. If seats are still open after all revenue standbys are accommodated, non-revenue passengers (BP5C through BP10) are then accommodated on the flight. These are the passengers referred to as NRSA. There is also a PSUG list for UA employees traveling on company business who are allowed to upgrade to the next class of service. This list is cleared after all revenue upgrades are accomidated. However, I am not sure exactly how that works, or how NRSAs travel in premium cabins of seats are still available.
I hope have gotten all the information correct. If anything is wrong, please correct me, and I will change it, but this is my general understanding based on FT, my experiences, and conversations with CSRs/RSSRs.