The Grass is NOT Always Greener - Back to UA from Delta
Apr 27, 2010, 11:36 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: ORD
Programs: ua 1k, hh diamond, spg PLT, marriott PLT
Posts: 617
The Grass is NOT Always Greener - Back to UA from Delta
So I was a 1K with UA for a few years, got a little frustrated at the end of 2009 and, due to living circumstances, decided to move to Delta's "Best in Class" service. Well, after 8 months, I'm happy to say that I've seen the other side and I've never been happier to be back with UA starting next week. I will try and highlight, briefly, my observations.
1) to get the easy ones out of the way first, UA dominates the SWU arena for obvious reasons. UA, despite Starnet blocking, dominates in the redemption arena for many reasons, including bookings in F, *A availability and the abundance of Saver awards. I am planning a trip to BKK and for Business, BL wants about 450k miles for almost any date and I can get 2 F tickets relatively easily for 140K a piece.
2) Check in. This is a HUGE one for me. while I seldom check bags, when I do, I want it to be quick. I can't tell you how much I miss the 1K check in at hubs or the 1K, GS, F lines at non-hubs. I have waited, multiple times, in lines for over 30 minutes to check in as a PM/DM because the queue up every elite in the same line. Drives me bonkers.
3) Boarding. at UA, there is no reason for Gate Lice. 1K/GS/F board and you will always board comfortably and easily. on Delta, EVERYONE boards first. therefore, you need to line up 15 minutes before or its chaos getting on the plane.
4) Domestic Upgrades. a wash now that both have UDU, except UA will upgrade you to Hawaii.
5) In Cabin Product
5a) Domestic. I do have to give the overall plus to Delta. Their live TV/Internet/US Power is a real benefit, if you're not on a NWA plane (which has NOTHING). However, on a separate note, the DL and NWA F seats drive me crazy. they are INCREDIBLY uncomfortable, as you almost lean awkwardly forward when the seat is *not* reclined, forcing everyone to recline the seats fully, limiting leg room. I know this is a random but makes a big difference being in the seats every week. Also, E+ is such an amazing benefit, words cannot describe. Overall, the entertainment, when you get it, is marvelous, but the other hard-products go to UA. Customer service is a wash- some good, some bad on both.
5b) International. Simple; UA by a landslide. I love the new C and F products and would take the best of UA C over the best of DL C any day. The fact that there is an F product to choose from makes it a no-brainer.
6) Extras. As much as we knocked on UA before for this, I've since longed for extra options for extra prices. If you don't want to use a SWU, many times on UA you can buy up for a somewhat reasonable price. This is not the case on DL, they just give their seats to non-revs or charge you 300K miles to upgrade.
7) Customer Service. I never thought I would say this, but I miss Mr. United asking "is this Mr. Playbbg?". I have struggled to get in touch with DL personel and, when I do, most of the time the answer is no. At least with UA, you always get someone quickly as a 1K and most of the time, they will do what it takes to work something out. Just a side note... I flew UA the other day for the first time this year from ORD-MCO and was upgraded to F (UDU). The plane got changed at the last minute to an Itl 767 and was (justifiably) put in C. I got an email that afternoon apologizing for the downgrade, offering 9k miles as compensation. WE TAKE SKYKITS AND ABUNDANT COMPENSATION FOR GRANTED!!!!! (as a side, someone in the DL forum was downgraded on an F award to Y on the plane and only got a $200 cert, what do you think UA would have given?)
Bottom line, I made the switch, hated it, and am extremely happy to be back. For all the people that question whether UA is the right option for them, I urge you to venture to the DL forum before making the switch.
Sometimes, its worth taking a step back and realizing how great you have it.
Now, its time to earn and make sure I maintain 1K for next year!
1) to get the easy ones out of the way first, UA dominates the SWU arena for obvious reasons. UA, despite Starnet blocking, dominates in the redemption arena for many reasons, including bookings in F, *A availability and the abundance of Saver awards. I am planning a trip to BKK and for Business, BL wants about 450k miles for almost any date and I can get 2 F tickets relatively easily for 140K a piece.
2) Check in. This is a HUGE one for me. while I seldom check bags, when I do, I want it to be quick. I can't tell you how much I miss the 1K check in at hubs or the 1K, GS, F lines at non-hubs. I have waited, multiple times, in lines for over 30 minutes to check in as a PM/DM because the queue up every elite in the same line. Drives me bonkers.
3) Boarding. at UA, there is no reason for Gate Lice. 1K/GS/F board and you will always board comfortably and easily. on Delta, EVERYONE boards first. therefore, you need to line up 15 minutes before or its chaos getting on the plane.
4) Domestic Upgrades. a wash now that both have UDU, except UA will upgrade you to Hawaii.
5) In Cabin Product
5a) Domestic. I do have to give the overall plus to Delta. Their live TV/Internet/US Power is a real benefit, if you're not on a NWA plane (which has NOTHING). However, on a separate note, the DL and NWA F seats drive me crazy. they are INCREDIBLY uncomfortable, as you almost lean awkwardly forward when the seat is *not* reclined, forcing everyone to recline the seats fully, limiting leg room. I know this is a random but makes a big difference being in the seats every week. Also, E+ is such an amazing benefit, words cannot describe. Overall, the entertainment, when you get it, is marvelous, but the other hard-products go to UA. Customer service is a wash- some good, some bad on both.
5b) International. Simple; UA by a landslide. I love the new C and F products and would take the best of UA C over the best of DL C any day. The fact that there is an F product to choose from makes it a no-brainer.
6) Extras. As much as we knocked on UA before for this, I've since longed for extra options for extra prices. If you don't want to use a SWU, many times on UA you can buy up for a somewhat reasonable price. This is not the case on DL, they just give their seats to non-revs or charge you 300K miles to upgrade.
7) Customer Service. I never thought I would say this, but I miss Mr. United asking "is this Mr. Playbbg?". I have struggled to get in touch with DL personel and, when I do, most of the time the answer is no. At least with UA, you always get someone quickly as a 1K and most of the time, they will do what it takes to work something out. Just a side note... I flew UA the other day for the first time this year from ORD-MCO and was upgraded to F (UDU). The plane got changed at the last minute to an Itl 767 and was (justifiably) put in C. I got an email that afternoon apologizing for the downgrade, offering 9k miles as compensation. WE TAKE SKYKITS AND ABUNDANT COMPENSATION FOR GRANTED!!!!! (as a side, someone in the DL forum was downgraded on an F award to Y on the plane and only got a $200 cert, what do you think UA would have given?)
Bottom line, I made the switch, hated it, and am extremely happy to be back. For all the people that question whether UA is the right option for them, I urge you to venture to the DL forum before making the switch.
Sometimes, its worth taking a step back and realizing how great you have it.
Now, its time to earn and make sure I maintain 1K for next year!
Last edited by playbbg; Apr 27, 2010 at 11:53 pm Reason: typo
Apr 27, 2010, 11:44 pm
#2
Join Date: May 2008
Location: 39°51'31"N 104°40'23"W
Programs: UA 1.5K MM/SPG Plat/Various Random Golds lol
Posts: 1,071
Pretty well said! I am a former (last year) DL PM. Last year I had status on both UA and DL. I agree with you on almost every point. I'm UA only this year. Will soon requalify for 1K.
One question, I don't understand what you mean about the chairs in recline leaning you forward in DL F?
One question, I don't understand what you mean about the chairs in recline leaning you forward in DL F?
Apr 27, 2010, 11:54 pm
#3
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: ORD
Programs: ua 1k, hh diamond, spg PLT, marriott PLT
Posts: 617
Pretty well said! I am a former (last year) DL PM. Last year I had status on both UA and DL. I agree with you on almost every point. I'm UA only this year. Will soon requalify for 1K.
One question, I don't understand what you mean about the chairs in recline leaning you forward in DL F?
One question, I don't understand what you mean about the chairs in recline leaning you forward in DL F?
Sorry, it was a typo. I meant when the seat is not reclined (changed in the OP).
Apr 27, 2010, 11:57 pm
#4
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: DFW
Programs: UA MM, QF Plat, Hilton, Hyatt, Marriott
Posts: 2,563
And my thoughts as a cheapo 1k customer since I also fly some DL, but give a lot of business to UA.
1. SWUs win by a mile and though there is starnet, saver Y awards for any member bead Delta by a mile.
2. Checkin is generally equal IMO, but this new SkyPriorit thing from DL is nothing special 1 agent for SkyPriority in NRT on Monday compared to 8 for coach.
3. Generally, I would say they are equal.
4. Equal to a bit better on UA if you are a 1k compared to a Platinum on DL. However DL loses out on Hawaii with either a $225 charge for LAX-HNL or 17.5k miles for a Platinum.
5a. Delta here in premium cabins. PTVs on most planes in F, onboard internet on almost all the domestic fleet, but the seat pitch is a bit tighter yet tolerable. In Y on many planes DL offers internet and AVOD, however the lack of E+ takes away a lot of the lead for elites. In regards to the former NWA fleet, they are dirty old planes throughout.
5b. In premium cabins UA wins by a mile. In coach, UA wins across the board in seat comfort in Y and E+ only adds to the lead. Delta is nice for the GM if they are on any other plane besides the 747. Delta's 747s are absolute garbage and would lose even to the interior before United refurbed theirs. The Delta 747s are so worn out with such worn out cushions that they are the most uncomfortable planes ever IMO and they are plain and simple filthy dirty planes.
6. Extras: DL wins by miles on the lounges plain and simple. Free booze, better snacks, hassle free internet, and better maintained as a whole.
7. Customer Service: UA by a thousand miles. When they screw up you can generally get someone to make it right on the phone and the airport too. Over the phone, Delta's agents will only follow a script and at the airport, that seems to often be the same. I will give Delta credit for rebooking being available over the internet to save some calls.
I've picked up Delta to try something new alongside United because of some good MRs and while I am at 70k EQM, I doubt I will fly them in the future once I after I requalify for Platinum because they don't know how to treat their elites.
With UA, I'm already booking trips to lock in 1k for 2012.
1. SWUs win by a mile and though there is starnet, saver Y awards for any member bead Delta by a mile.
2. Checkin is generally equal IMO, but this new SkyPriorit thing from DL is nothing special 1 agent for SkyPriority in NRT on Monday compared to 8 for coach.
3. Generally, I would say they are equal.
4. Equal to a bit better on UA if you are a 1k compared to a Platinum on DL. However DL loses out on Hawaii with either a $225 charge for LAX-HNL or 17.5k miles for a Platinum.
5a. Delta here in premium cabins. PTVs on most planes in F, onboard internet on almost all the domestic fleet, but the seat pitch is a bit tighter yet tolerable. In Y on many planes DL offers internet and AVOD, however the lack of E+ takes away a lot of the lead for elites. In regards to the former NWA fleet, they are dirty old planes throughout.
5b. In premium cabins UA wins by a mile. In coach, UA wins across the board in seat comfort in Y and E+ only adds to the lead. Delta is nice for the GM if they are on any other plane besides the 747. Delta's 747s are absolute garbage and would lose even to the interior before United refurbed theirs. The Delta 747s are so worn out with such worn out cushions that they are the most uncomfortable planes ever IMO and they are plain and simple filthy dirty planes.
6. Extras: DL wins by miles on the lounges plain and simple. Free booze, better snacks, hassle free internet, and better maintained as a whole.
7. Customer Service: UA by a thousand miles. When they screw up you can generally get someone to make it right on the phone and the airport too. Over the phone, Delta's agents will only follow a script and at the airport, that seems to often be the same. I will give Delta credit for rebooking being available over the internet to save some calls.
I've picked up Delta to try something new alongside United because of some good MRs and while I am at 70k EQM, I doubt I will fly them in the future once I after I requalify for Platinum because they don't know how to treat their elites.
With UA, I'm already booking trips to lock in 1k for 2012.
Apr 28, 2010, 12:08 am
#5
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: ORD
Programs: ua 1k, hh diamond, spg PLT, marriott PLT
Posts: 617
And my thoughts as a cheapo 1k customer since I also fly some DL, but give a lot of business to UA.
1. SWUs win by a mile and though there is starnet, saver Y awards for any member bead Delta by a mile.
2. Checkin is generally equal IMO, but this new SkyPriorit thing from DL is nothing special 1 agent for SkyPriority in NRT on Monday compared to 8 for coach.
3. Generally, I would say they are equal.
4. Equal to a bit better on UA if you are a 1k compared to a Platinum on DL. However DL loses out on Hawaii with either a $225 charge for LAX-HNL or 17.5k miles for a Platinum.
5a. Delta here in premium cabins. PTVs on most planes in F, onboard internet on almost all the domestic fleet, but the seat pitch is a bit tighter yet tolerable. In Y on many planes DL offers internet and AVOD, however the lack of E+ takes away a lot of the lead for elites. In regards to the former NWA fleet, they are dirty old planes throughout.
5b. In premium cabins UA wins by a mile. In coach, UA wins across the board in seat comfort in Y and E+ only adds to the lead. Delta is nice for the GM if they are on any other plane besides the 747. Delta's 747s are absolute garbage and would lose even to the interior before United refurbed theirs. The Delta 747s are so worn out with such worn out cushions that they are the most uncomfortable planes ever IMO and they are plain and simple filthy dirty planes.
6. Extras: DL wins by miles on the lounges plain and simple. Free booze, better snacks, hassle free internet, and better maintained as a whole.
7. Customer Service: UA by a thousand miles. When they screw up you can generally get someone to make it right on the phone and the airport too. Over the phone, Delta's agents will only follow a script and at the airport, that seems to often be the same. I will give Delta credit for rebooking being available over the internet to save some calls.
I've picked up Delta to try something new alongside United because of some good MRs and while I am at 70k EQM, I doubt I will fly them in the future once I after I requalify for Platinum because they don't know how to treat their elites.
With UA, I'm already booking trips to lock in 1k for 2012.
1. SWUs win by a mile and though there is starnet, saver Y awards for any member bead Delta by a mile.
2. Checkin is generally equal IMO, but this new SkyPriorit thing from DL is nothing special 1 agent for SkyPriority in NRT on Monday compared to 8 for coach.
3. Generally, I would say they are equal.
4. Equal to a bit better on UA if you are a 1k compared to a Platinum on DL. However DL loses out on Hawaii with either a $225 charge for LAX-HNL or 17.5k miles for a Platinum.
5a. Delta here in premium cabins. PTVs on most planes in F, onboard internet on almost all the domestic fleet, but the seat pitch is a bit tighter yet tolerable. In Y on many planes DL offers internet and AVOD, however the lack of E+ takes away a lot of the lead for elites. In regards to the former NWA fleet, they are dirty old planes throughout.
5b. In premium cabins UA wins by a mile. In coach, UA wins across the board in seat comfort in Y and E+ only adds to the lead. Delta is nice for the GM if they are on any other plane besides the 747. Delta's 747s are absolute garbage and would lose even to the interior before United refurbed theirs. The Delta 747s are so worn out with such worn out cushions that they are the most uncomfortable planes ever IMO and they are plain and simple filthy dirty planes.
6. Extras: DL wins by miles on the lounges plain and simple. Free booze, better snacks, hassle free internet, and better maintained as a whole.
7. Customer Service: UA by a thousand miles. When they screw up you can generally get someone to make it right on the phone and the airport too. Over the phone, Delta's agents will only follow a script and at the airport, that seems to often be the same. I will give Delta credit for rebooking being available over the internet to save some calls.
I've picked up Delta to try something new alongside United because of some good MRs and while I am at 70k EQM, I doubt I will fly them in the future once I after I requalify for Platinum because they don't know how to treat their elites.
With UA, I'm already booking trips to lock in 1k for 2012.
As for domestic products, flying out of DTW, I'm relegated to mostly crap, so perhaps I'm biased.
Please explain, though, how one line for all "Sky Priority" is "a wash" with dedicated lines for each traveling class/elite level? as a 1K, I have NEVER waited in line to check bags, even in ORD. At DTW, i feel as thought I ALWAYS wait to check in (when checking bags) because everyone queues at the same place.
Apr 28, 2010, 12:12 am
#6
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Northeast Kansas | Colorado Native
Programs: Amex Gold/Plat, UA *G, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott LT Gold, NEXUS, TSA Disparager Unobtanium
Posts: 21,605
Welcome back from the Dark Side!
As others have mentioned, UA excels in a number of areas, such as customer service, IPTE and the check-in/boarding process. However, I would love to see liveTV on UA flights and more in-seat power!
As others have mentioned, UA excels in a number of areas, such as customer service, IPTE and the check-in/boarding process. However, I would love to see liveTV on UA flights and more in-seat power!
Apr 28, 2010, 12:13 am
#7
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,358
Until last year I tried to keep some allegiance to both United and Delta. However, over the years it became obvious that United has a superior FF program than that of Delta.
My biggest grip with Delta is in connection with trying to get an award in business. Although Delta claims it is possible to get such an award for 100,000 miles, just try to get one with that many miles.
I and several friends tried various dates looking for an award ticket in business. Each and every time we tried, the supposed 100,000 miles changed to 240,000 miles.
United has never pulled that stunt to my knowledge.
As a result of the foregoing fact, I flew Delta only once last year. I might try them again this year but I doubt it.
-
Apr 28, 2010, 7:42 am
#8
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: ORD
Programs: ua 1k, hh diamond, spg PLT, marriott PLT
Posts: 617
Thanks! I do have to say, when I had it, the live tv and power was pretty nice, but a small price to pay!
Apr 28, 2010, 7:57 am
#9
Join Date: May 2008
Location: 39°51'31"N 104°40'23"W
Programs: UA 1.5K MM/SPG Plat/Various Random Golds lol
Posts: 1,071
Yeah, if UA had WiFi and AVOD- it is not even a discussion. That is the only thing I would bring to UA from DL. It's pretty nice getting email done/paying bills/whatever at 38,000 ft on a transcon! But I wouldn't trade what we have just to get those. If it was either or, UA wins the day.
Apr 28, 2010, 8:14 am
#10
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: DFW
Programs: UA, DL, LH, Marriott, Amex
Posts: 554
^^ +1 OP
Unfortunately, I am in the same boat. Coming from US Airways, I had such a bitter taste about *A carriers that I felt obligated to try Delta/SkyTeam. I guess I just assumed United would be like US, and US was awful. After flying Delta for the first quarter of this year, I can echo everything the OP has said. I'm amazed at how little Delta cares about anyone who flies on their airline. It seems the only thing they're concerned about is making sure their employees fly in first class. It's certainly a nice perk if you work there, I'll give them that, but it's not competitive with other airlines. I'm astounded at how ridiculous the mileage redemption rates are. I'm appalled at how customers, from Diamond Medallion down to non-status, are treated. I rolled the dice and picked DL, and I should have listened to friends when they said go with UA. I'm in the process of getting comped, and, hopefully, the third time picking a legacy carrier will be the charm
Unfortunately, I am in the same boat. Coming from US Airways, I had such a bitter taste about *A carriers that I felt obligated to try Delta/SkyTeam. I guess I just assumed United would be like US, and US was awful. After flying Delta for the first quarter of this year, I can echo everything the OP has said. I'm amazed at how little Delta cares about anyone who flies on their airline. It seems the only thing they're concerned about is making sure their employees fly in first class. It's certainly a nice perk if you work there, I'll give them that, but it's not competitive with other airlines. I'm astounded at how ridiculous the mileage redemption rates are. I'm appalled at how customers, from Diamond Medallion down to non-status, are treated. I rolled the dice and picked DL, and I should have listened to friends when they said go with UA. I'm in the process of getting comped, and, hopefully, the third time picking a legacy carrier will be the charm
Apr 28, 2010, 9:05 am
#11
Join Date: Nov 2006
Programs: UA, AA
Posts: 212
Frequently do UA-DL struggle
Am PM and 1K. I fly often to JFK and being in Seattle i like the SEA-JFK flight on DL especially now with business elite product servicing this route.
Agree with all that if UA could just add even more in-seat power there would be virtually no benefit to DL. Of course, adding WiFi and inflight tv would be even more ideal. Anyone have a sense if UA would move in this direction?
Agree with all that if UA could just add even more in-seat power there would be virtually no benefit to DL. Of course, adding WiFi and inflight tv would be even more ideal. Anyone have a sense if UA would move in this direction?
Apr 28, 2010, 10:08 am
#12
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: MHT/BOS <--> World
Programs: AA Plat 2.8MM
Posts: 4,629
1) to get the easy ones out of the way first, UA dominates the SWU arena for obvious reasons. UA, despite Starnet blocking, dominates in the redemption arena for many reasons, including bookings in F, *A availability and the abundance of Saver awards. I am planning a trip to BKK and for Business, BL wants about 450k miles for almost any date and I can get 2 F tickets relatively easily for 140K a piece.
DL/US have very brown grass for the 100K flyer.
CO - it depends on your needs. SWU can be used on all fares, better than UA, but you only get 4 and no CR1s. UA has better upgrade clearance rates.
playbbg - as a Chicago flyer where AA has about 500 nonstops (versus UA's ~700), where AA has an excellent FF program versus DL's crap, why would you try DL rather than AA?
Apr 28, 2010, 10:19 am
#13
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: SFO
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 4,449
LH also
I will hit the 100K mark this year fairly early, so I was looking where else to put my miles (still flying UA though). I looked at LH's senator program. They only get 2 e-vouchers at 100,000 miles. We get 6 SWU's. Seems like UA blows away LH in that category also.
Apr 28, 2010, 10:33 am
#14
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: MHT/BOS <--> World
Programs: AA Plat 2.8MM
Posts: 4,629
Look elsewhere and you will be disappointed 100% of the time (not 99%).
-------------------------------------------------
For the deep discount coach buyer who does 100,000 miles of travel per year and is looking to upgrade long flights, in the entire airline industry worldwide, only AA and UA have a generous upgrade program (CO is #3). Not a single non-USA airline comes close.
Last edited by wanaflyforless; Apr 28, 2010 at 10:39 am
Apr 28, 2010, 10:41 am
#15
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: ORD
Programs: ua 1k, hh diamond, spg PLT, marriott PLT
Posts: 617
AA competes well with UA for the 100K flyer. (8 SWU valid on all fares and free domestic upgrades that clear better than UA because on average, AA has more F seats on similar size planes) Depending on your needs as a frequent flyer, the grass might be greener for you at AA. Redeeming AA miles to BKK, for example, would be no problem. Between CX and JL, AA could get you there at the low miles level - none of that 450K miles crap DL pulls.
DL/US have very brown grass for the 100K flyer.
CO - it depends on your needs. SWU can be used on all fares, better than UA, but you only get 4 and no CR1s. UA has better upgrade clearance rates.
playbbg - as a Chicago flyer where AA has about 500 nonstops (versus UA's ~700), where AA has an excellent FF program versus DL's crap, why would you try DL rather than AA?
DL/US have very brown grass for the 100K flyer.
CO - it depends on your needs. SWU can be used on all fares, better than UA, but you only get 4 and no CR1s. UA has better upgrade clearance rates.
playbbg - as a Chicago flyer where AA has about 500 nonstops (versus UA's ~700), where AA has an excellent FF program versus DL's crap, why would you try DL rather than AA?
As for why I'm going to UA as opposed to AA, I did like UA, more now looking back at it, and I am still 1K and will fly enough to make 1K again this year. I just don't know if its worth it starting over at another new airline (even is they match whatever the middle level is.