Son denied OHB bag help by flight attendant
Jul 5, 2022, 3:35 pm
#76
Join Date: Jul 2019
Programs: United
Posts: 30
This got me reading Americans with Disabilities Act. Turns out it does not cover aviation because that is covered by Air Carrier Access Act
https://www.transportation.gov/indiv...ded-assistance
"When providing assistance to passengers with disabilities who are navigating the airport, airlines are required to assist passengers in carrying their gate-checked or carry-on luggage when passengers are unable to carry the luggage due to their disability."
"Advise airline personnel at the boarding gate of any assistance you may need (e.g. pre-board, assistance with carry-on luggage or moving within the aircraft)"
"Advise the flight attendants if you need assistance stowing/retrieving your carry-on luggage or other assistance during the flight."
Doesn't say FAs are required to help with baggage themselves, but you can advise them to seek assistance.
https://www.transportation.gov/indiv...ded-assistance
"When providing assistance to passengers with disabilities who are navigating the airport, airlines are required to assist passengers in carrying their gate-checked or carry-on luggage when passengers are unable to carry the luggage due to their disability."
"Advise airline personnel at the boarding gate of any assistance you may need (e.g. pre-board, assistance with carry-on luggage or moving within the aircraft)"
"Advise the flight attendants if you need assistance stowing/retrieving your carry-on luggage or other assistance during the flight."
Doesn't say FAs are required to help with baggage themselves, but you can advise them to seek assistance.
Jul 5, 2022, 3:52 pm
#77
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 2,925
In summary
The main controversy is if FAs should be more willing to help, even if not required.
Airlines are required to help with OHB for those with qualified disabilities if requested
FAs are not required to help with OHB but may.
Many FAs will help but some will not YMMV
Other passengers may help
Checking bags is an option
Did I miss anything?FAs are not required to help with OHB but may.
Many FAs will help but some will not YMMV
Other passengers may help
Checking bags is an option
The main controversy is if FAs should be more willing to help, even if not required.
”Round and around and around and around we go
Oh, now tell me now, tell me now, tell me now you know” Rihanna
Jul 5, 2022, 4:30 pm
#78
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I think that really is a it depends - regardless of ADA or ACA. I'd say a broken collarbone definitely isn't a disability. I broke a toe a couple of years ago and couldn't run - for awhile so no, I wasn't disabled. If I broke my legs - had surgery - needed a wheelchair - I'm disabled.
The ACAA defines “Individual with a disability” as "any individual who has a physical or mental impairment that, on a permanent or temporary basis, substantially limits one or more major life activities, has a record of such an impairment, or is regarded as having such an impairment."
Jul 5, 2022, 5:24 pm
#79
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 532
Quite a controversial topic.
But close to home. I injured my left ring finger on Saturday, but essentially can't use my left hand. Without surgery, 12 week recovery; with surgery longer. I have planned travel. In any case, there is no way I could lift my carryon into an overhead bin with my right hand, without risking that it slips and it injures somebody.
I'm checking my bag; not chancing it with a gate check. I do not expect anyone's, FA's or passenger's, assistance in this circumstance.
But close to home. I injured my left ring finger on Saturday, but essentially can't use my left hand. Without surgery, 12 week recovery; with surgery longer. I have planned travel. In any case, there is no way I could lift my carryon into an overhead bin with my right hand, without risking that it slips and it injures somebody.
I'm checking my bag; not chancing it with a gate check. I do not expect anyone's, FA's or passenger's, assistance in this circumstance.
I think we can all agree the OP's question ("is this usual?") has been answered. IANAL but I would like to point out that there are very real legal differences between "may", "will", and "shall" -- at least, there have always been very real differences in how those words are used and understood in every contract I have been a party to or seen.
While a broken collarbone may not fall under the ADA, it is a very real, painful, and limiting injury which may not be immediately obvious to visual inspection. The same goes for sciatica and a number of other physical conditions. At the same time, this thread has exposed a number of reasons why FAs shouldn't be expected to assist with loading carry-ons into the overhead bins. It would be a lot easier for all concerned if travelers planned to be as self-sufficient as possible rather than assume they'll get someone else to put their 18 kg carry-on in the overhead for them and the rest of us help out a fellow traveler in distress if/when we can. I grew up as a Boy Scout and was a Scout Leader for over 25 years -- I'm happy to help people when and where I can but my willingness to do so is inversely proportional to their assumption or expectation that I have some kind of implied burden to help them.
While a broken collarbone may not fall under the ADA, it is a very real, painful, and limiting injury which may not be immediately obvious to visual inspection. The same goes for sciatica and a number of other physical conditions. At the same time, this thread has exposed a number of reasons why FAs shouldn't be expected to assist with loading carry-ons into the overhead bins. It would be a lot easier for all concerned if travelers planned to be as self-sufficient as possible rather than assume they'll get someone else to put their 18 kg carry-on in the overhead for them and the rest of us help out a fellow traveler in distress if/when we can. I grew up as a Boy Scout and was a Scout Leader for over 25 years -- I'm happy to help people when and where I can but my willingness to do so is inversely proportional to their assumption or expectation that I have some kind of implied burden to help them.
Last edited by WineCountryUA; Jul 5, 2022 at 5:36 pm Reason: merged consecutive posts by same member
Jul 5, 2022, 5:43 pm
#80
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100%. I bet dozens on any one flight would be willing to help, including myself. The FAs can be put in an unfomfortable position here. The bag got in an overhead. I think this is a non-issue.
Jul 5, 2022, 6:37 pm
#81
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When I had a broken shoulder, I had already read messages like this and simply asked a fellow passenger for help, which was always graciously offered. That said, I think a disabled pax should be assisted and if the FA has to call someone to assist, then that should be done politely and graciously without imposing burdens on the passengers that most (especially those with a temporary disability) would not know about. I expect a volunteer passenger would step up in 99.9% if not 100% of the situations anyway. I’m always happy to help polite people with bags, except when I had a broken shoulder and was the one who needed help!
Jul 5, 2022, 7:11 pm
#82
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I agree that it would be the only controversy, except that UA does charge for checked bags. I do not believe that morally (or legally), an airline can charge for a disability accommodation. If the FA was unwilling to help (within her right), she should have offered the passenger the option to check the bag free of charge as an alternative to stowing it.
Jul 5, 2022, 7:22 pm
#83
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 413
I agree that it would be the only controversy, except that UA does charge for checked bags. I do not believe that morally (or legally), an airline can charge for a disability accommodation. If the FA was unwilling to help (within her right), she should have offered the passenger the option to check the bag free of charge as an alternative to stowing it.
Jul 5, 2022, 7:57 pm
#85
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Nothing else????
Sorry - they are there PRIMARILY for your safety. Their written job description includes also providing food/beverage service, directing passengers to their seats, numerous other non-safety duties, etc.
Sorry - they are there PRIMARILY for your safety. Their written job description includes also providing food/beverage service, directing passengers to their seats, numerous other non-safety duties, etc.
Jul 5, 2022, 7:59 pm
#86
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I figured this red herring would pop up because it's one of the classic FT topics. IMO, they are definitely also there to pour PDBs for us in addition to safety. However, expecting a 100-pound lady to lift your 40-pound bag over her head seems like a tall ask IMO.
Jul 5, 2022, 8:06 pm
#87
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yes but they happily lift your bag out of it if they think they deserve the space above your seat
Jul 5, 2022, 8:07 pm
#88
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It depends. If they heal as expected, they are not a disability under ADA. If they fail to heal for an extended duration, they can become an ADA disability. But, as stated elsewhere, the ACAA covers temporary disabilities, as well as ADA ones.
Jul 5, 2022, 8:16 pm
#89
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https://media.united.com/images/Medi...escription.pdf
I can’t tell how old this is.
Specific Duties and Abilities
Proactively assists passengers with stowage (i.e., floor to above shoulder level) of carry-on bags, garments and other belongings.
I can’t tell how old this is.
Specific Duties and Abilities
Proactively assists passengers with stowage (i.e., floor to above shoulder level) of carry-on bags, garments and other belongings.
Jul 5, 2022, 8:35 pm
#90
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https://media.united.com/images/Medi...escription.pdf
I can’t tell how old this is.
Specific Duties and Abilities
Proactively assists passengers with stowage (i.e., floor to above shoulder level) of carry-on bags, garments and other belongings.
I can’t tell how old this is.
Specific Duties and Abilities
Proactively assists passengers with stowage (i.e., floor to above shoulder level) of carry-on bags, garments and other belongings.