Hipplewm

based on 737-8 or 737-Max, what are the farthest points inland they can originate from?
I am assuming anything in California is fine....

LAS?
DEN?
PHX?
DAL?
MDW?

EWR764

In WN's 175-pax configuration with the 8MAX, it would be West Coast plus LAS and PHX. Not much more than that.

The current -800 would struggle with ETOPS reserves in such a dense configuration, plus WN and Hawaii flights in general tend to have a higher % of checked bags. That's the main reason WN isn't already in the market.

GRALISTAIR

^ Yep - totally agree

cairns

I've flown them quite a bit and believe me UA could learn a lot from them. Opt for business select you can sit where you want, get on/off first and they don't screw you on bag fees or change fees. Their stretch is 32-33 inches on a 737-800 which is not much less than economy plus (34). The planes are always clean too. As a bonus I've never seen a crew that didn't seem absolutely welcoming.

You pay less and you get more. What a concept.

spin88

If I flew our of IAD, I agree. A direct on UA - if F or a non-HD 777 or a 767 - beats connecting on WN on a 737. @:-)

My point is that while WN is a direct competitor to United in places (BWI competes with UA ex-IAD, WN competes directly in CA markets, HOU flights compete with UA ex-IAH) WN is somewhat of its own ecosystem in many airports. I used BNA as an example, but I could have used a number of other second tier cities where SWA is the major airline as the example. These passengers are going to tend to stay on SWA, which means that SWA is not just competing for O/D traffic, it will also have build in demand for these flights from the rest of its network.

Hard to say who gets hurt most - SWA competes with all of the US airlines, hard to see who is most impacted at this point - but since United is a big player in Hawaiian markets, they will lose some traffic, especially since their service quality has fallen so badly that at this point in Y, WN is better, and give some of the new lift to Hawaii (HD 772) even E+ is unpleasant.

HNLbasedFlyer

Other things SWA has to address - UA has free personal device entertainment (although it can get buggy (not let you in) over the ocean it seems to be getting recently) - I also wonder if the wifi SWA has is compatible over the ocean.

But yes, the ability to get lie-flat seats on UA or a as a backup economy plus will trump at least for me as a Hawaii resident SWA

Kacee

Agree, WN has built in demand.

Personally, I'd rather have my eyes gouged out with a sharp stick than take a WN flight of more than 90 minutes, but there are plenty of consumers who are willing to fly WN cross-country so I'm sure they'll do well to Hawaii.

spin88

I agree on WN, I have taken them on short flights buying a BS ticket, so I get early boarding. But WN was bottom of my list for basically ever (but now is displaced by any HD UA flight in Y). However, you and I live in SF, and we have options. I can take VX and DL and lots of foreign carriers, that offer (1) better hard product, and (2) FC - FC which I get upgraged to on DL and AS.

But I know people in e.g. BNA who fly WN primarily. Most of their flights are shorter (other than to the west coast) and they get"A-list preferred", so they (a) board early, get the exit row, and (b) if they fly 100K they get a companion pass. It will be interesting to see if WN makes the companion pass feature applicable to Hawaii, but if it does, it will be a big draw for their program.

aoumd

I’d agree if WN didnt have Early Bird Check In. I’m pretty much always able to pick window or aisle, front or back of the plane to my liking when I use EBCI and thus jump ahead in the boarding queue.

For me it will come down to what WN’s fares (and thus mileage requirements are) for a HI trip vs. United saver availability, which at 45k round trip in Y isn’t too bad of a bargain from the DC area to Hawaii.

seigex

From what I'm reading, 737 Max 8's with 32" Pitch & 17.8" Width.

Kacee

Claims of wider seats on a 737 are just measuring tricks. The cabins are all the same width. The 32" pitch claim is also dubious. Effective pitch since WN slimlined is 31" or less.

seenitall

And remember that in addition to free checked bags, seat pitch at almost E+, early check-in availability, WN tickets are also changeable with no fees. The complete value of your old ticket gets transferred to your new one. You only pay any fare difference. This flexibility is a huge plus.

fly18725

Unless Southwest starts flying redeyes, either from Hawaii or the CONUS, convenient connections to Hawaii will be very limited beyond the west coast and won't exist for the east coast.

CA/NV/WA/OR/AZ are by far the largest markets to Hawaii and Southwest will almost certainly focus on leveraging its already strong market position to go after O&D.

It is worth noting that United is the largest carrier in the CONUS-Hawaii market, slightly ahead of Hawaiian.

IAH-OIL-TRASH

The value of this for Hawaii-bound vacation travelers is worth about zero in their calculation. The argument of legacy airlines vs WN will go on forever.

It'll be interesting to see WN's non-promotional fares. Free bags is going to hurt them to Hawaii - margin will have to be made up in airfare.

seenitall

Well, if you say this, it must be true.

I have had to cancel and reschedule leisure flights (including one to Hawaii with my family) on multiple occasions. Indeed, I would venture that I have had more need to reschedule for leisure travel that generally was booked long in advance than for business travel that generally is booked more close-in.

Keep drinking the UA kool-aid. WN has had a long history of success w/o bankruptcies characteristic of CO and UA.