Baby Almost Dies Due to Airplane Temperature
Jun 27, 2017, 11:27 pm
#61
Join Date: Aug 2013
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And everything is interrelated. UA is perceived by many as having abandoned customer service over the years. This latest episode only reinforces that perception. And some would even go so far to say that UA pilots started the whole thing with the Summer from Hell in 2000. <shrugs>
You can try to say that this incident should only be seen in an isolated lens. That's not how most people are going to integrate this into their overall thinkng.
I stand by my statement. Comfort and UA are not particularly congruent in 2017. When a pilot makes a claim that "comfort" is second on the priority list, I will push back, because as a customer, I just don't see it.
You can try to say that this incident should only be seen in an isolated lens. That's not how most people are going to integrate this into their overall thinkng.
I stand by my statement. Comfort and UA are not particularly congruent in 2017. When a pilot makes a claim that "comfort" is second on the priority list, I will push back, because as a customer, I just don't see it.
Jun 28, 2017, 4:26 am
#62
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Sounds like Trans States and UA did everything they could. Once again a fake news story. What was good service is spun as bad service because it's an airline. The ultimate kicker is that the mother GOT BACK ON the known warm plane. Stupid. That baby should have stayed in the cool terminal and gotten attention.
We almost had to divert on one of my recent mainline DL flights. It was uncomfortably warm on the plane, and on the ground the air simply wasn't enough to cool it down. And to top it off, we had a small delay at the gate for a mechanical issue, so we sat and warmed the plane even more. Once we got into the air, the passenger directly front of me got very overheated. He was in his early 20s and in the middle of a big life changing move, so that didn't help. It all compounded to where he was very visibly not doing well. The crew brought ice and kept monitoring him, keeping help ready in case he got worse. The pilots were notified of the situation and that a divert might be necessary. Thankfully he cooled down and felt better, allowing the flight to continue as planned.
We almost had to divert on one of my recent mainline DL flights. It was uncomfortably warm on the plane, and on the ground the air simply wasn't enough to cool it down. And to top it off, we had a small delay at the gate for a mechanical issue, so we sat and warmed the plane even more. Once we got into the air, the passenger directly front of me got very overheated. He was in his early 20s and in the middle of a big life changing move, so that didn't help. It all compounded to where he was very visibly not doing well. The crew brought ice and kept monitoring him, keeping help ready in case he got worse. The pilots were notified of the situation and that a divert might be necessary. Thankfully he cooled down and felt better, allowing the flight to continue as planned.
This is no where close to fake news. This event actually happened, not a figment of someone's imagination.
The 2nd link in the OP has apparently been updated to include the GMA video segment, which includes some additional details, as well as a picture of the mother and baby trying to cool down at the front door. Here again: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...rs-tarmac.html
Jun 28, 2017, 5:07 am
#63
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It's usually 10-15 degrees warmer in the cockpit than it is in the cabin. I found it comical that people buy in to the fact the pilots are willing to sweat their butts off to save on APU fuel costs. Folks, that's just not the case.
Passenger (pilot comfort) takes precedence over fuel savings. Always has, always will...
Passenger (pilot comfort) takes precedence over fuel savings. Always has, always will...
Jun 28, 2017, 5:34 am
#64
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 75
In fact I usually "ice it" down to 68-70 during boarding because people are moving around and then adjust to 73 degrees right before push.
Extremely common especially if the aircraft is being towed up from remote parking in the summer.
Jun 28, 2017, 6:05 am
#66
Join Date: Feb 2015
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Ah, but you see, you're using the 2016 definition. "Fake news" used to mean "something that never happened", then a particular political wing took co-opted term some time in early 2017, and now it means "something that doesn't deserve to be news" ie "something I don't like whether it's true or not".
Last edited by axck; Jun 28, 2017 at 6:15 am
Jun 28, 2017, 6:35 am
#67
Join Date: May 2014
Location: DMV
Posts: 2,092
This is a problem, but I don't know if it's an airline-specific problem rather than an industry problem. Tarmac delays are often outside the airlines' control and some types of planes are simply much harder to climate control than others. The U.S. happens to be among those nations where extreme heat is a fact of life in many places for a significant chunk of the year, but it's also a nation where there's quite a few ways in every day life to insulate yourself from such heat (AC as a way of life). So once you hit an environment where that heat is inescapable, many people won't be used to it at all.
On two DL domestic flights recently the plane was very, very warm. The FAs tried to combat the problem by distributing drinks but it didn't help a huge deal. In both cases, the plane had sat on the ground in the mid-day sun during 85+ conditions for longer than intended. Once due to the flight crew having been delayed by IRROPS elsewhere in the country, the other time simply due to JFK congestion. I found the situation uncomfortable but *barely* tolerable. Now, one thing to remember though is that passengers aren't all fit, healthy people. Airline passengers do include the very old, the very young, the chronically sick and disabled. What's merely uncomfortable for one person could well be deadly for another person.
But there's very little DL, for example, can do about the 45+ minutes it may take from push-off to take-off at JFK. And in a tiny CRJ they're not gonna be able to keep the temperature down on a steaming New York summer day. It's just the way it is.
Maybe the reality we need to accept is that flying in an airplane is not the same as driving your AC-controlled Toyota to the AC-controlled grocery store. On hot days, there are warnings from the NWS advising people to avoid strenuous activities, advising that vulnerable people should take special precautions and avoid going outside. Maybe what we need is awareness that air travel is one of those activities that people with medical vulnerabilities need to avoid on hot days.
On two DL domestic flights recently the plane was very, very warm. The FAs tried to combat the problem by distributing drinks but it didn't help a huge deal. In both cases, the plane had sat on the ground in the mid-day sun during 85+ conditions for longer than intended. Once due to the flight crew having been delayed by IRROPS elsewhere in the country, the other time simply due to JFK congestion. I found the situation uncomfortable but *barely* tolerable. Now, one thing to remember though is that passengers aren't all fit, healthy people. Airline passengers do include the very old, the very young, the chronically sick and disabled. What's merely uncomfortable for one person could well be deadly for another person.
But there's very little DL, for example, can do about the 45+ minutes it may take from push-off to take-off at JFK. And in a tiny CRJ they're not gonna be able to keep the temperature down on a steaming New York summer day. It's just the way it is.
Maybe the reality we need to accept is that flying in an airplane is not the same as driving your AC-controlled Toyota to the AC-controlled grocery store. On hot days, there are warnings from the NWS advising people to avoid strenuous activities, advising that vulnerable people should take special precautions and avoid going outside. Maybe what we need is awareness that air travel is one of those activities that people with medical vulnerabilities need to avoid on hot days.
Jun 28, 2017, 8:42 am
#68
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UA would certainly have given her a full refund or placed her on another flight. But to her the convenience of being on that flight outweighed the baby's risk of dying.
The only thing UA did wrong was allowing her to reboarded. Pop
Jun 28, 2017, 8:50 am
#69
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Jun 28, 2017, 8:27 pm
#70
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Because knowing the baby could not handle the temperature, she reboarded with the baby.
UA would certainly have given her a full refund or placed her on another flight. But to her the convenience of being on that flight outweighed the baby's risk of dying.
The only thing UA did wrong was allowing her to reboarded. Pop
UA would certainly have given her a full refund or placed her on another flight. But to her the convenience of being on that flight outweighed the baby's risk of dying.
The only thing UA did wrong was allowing her to reboarded. Pop
While the little planes simply don't have the cooling power to cope with the situation that is something that could be changed, or they could have mobile carts that blow cool air into an airplane.
Jun 28, 2017, 9:11 pm
#71
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She reboarded when the plane was planning to take off, expecting to get up in the sky away from the heat. Instead they got a bunch more time on the ground and the baby got hot again.
While the little planes simply don't have the cooling power to cope with the situation that is something that could be changed, or they could have mobile carts that blow cool air into an airplane.
While the little planes simply don't have the cooling power to cope with the situation that is something that could be changed, or they could have mobile carts that blow cool air into an airplane.
They have those.
https://www.aerospecialties.com/prod...tioning-units/
Jun 29, 2017, 12:44 am
#72
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Because knowing the baby could not handle the temperature, she reboarded with the baby.
UA would certainly have given her a full refund or placed her on another flight. But to her the convenience of being on that flight outweighed the baby's risk of dying.
The only thing UA did wrong was allowing her to reboarded. Pop
UA would certainly have given her a full refund or placed her on another flight. But to her the convenience of being on that flight outweighed the baby's risk of dying.
The only thing UA did wrong was allowing her to reboarded. Pop
Jun 29, 2017, 7:33 am
#74
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Missing throughout this discussion is the question of how hot did it get on this plane and how hot is too hot to be permissible? Is it 80 or 90 or 100 degrees? Some people handle heat very differently from others. I know of people who claim they will "pass out" if the temperature is above 80 degrees. Should that be the standard? If so, there will be a lot cancelled flights. Or should it be higher? I think so.
Jun 29, 2017, 10:41 am
#75
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No. The ground crews can't service and load the aircraft with engines running. It wouldn't be safe.
Even if they could, the engines at ground-idle don't provide enough air pressure to keep the cabins cool. The APU does a better job on the ground.
Lots of people are saying that the airplanes are hot because we are supposed to save money and not run the APU but our manuals say otherwise. Comfort comes second only to safety.
The order of operating priorities, straight from our flight manual, are:
1. Safe
2. Comfortable
3. On-time
4. Efficient
Even if they could, the engines at ground-idle don't provide enough air pressure to keep the cabins cool. The APU does a better job on the ground.
Lots of people are saying that the airplanes are hot because we are supposed to save money and not run the APU but our manuals say otherwise. Comfort comes second only to safety.
The order of operating priorities, straight from our flight manual, are:
1. Safe
2. Comfortable
3. On-time
4. Efficient
Regardless, they had the option to return to a gate and cool down there or offload everyone. What is the safety or comfort reason for not doing this? Returning to the gate affects on-time and efficiency. So I don't think comfort (and perhaps even safety in some cases) goes above ontime and efficient all of the time. That may be the policy but it isnt always practiced.