Huh? E+ is not a class of service at all. It is widely known that it is not protected. UA freely sells tickets when no seats are available, noting that seats (in E+, often) well be assigned at the gate. Of course that's the policy.

This is a bit like the twilight zone. Lots of airlines charge for advanced seat assignments and guaranteed good seats in economy. They all give those seats away for free day-of to folks who didn't want to pay for the guarantee. It's totally normal. The only thing that wasn't was this particular agent's approach to determining who got the seats. They were probably just trying to be nice, but I agree that the approach was bad.

Agree. And it wasn't bad because the seats were given away for free, it was bad because it potentially encouraged a free-for-all.

I'm wondering why those who actually paid $3-$4K for B/S Lax-JFK aren't pissed about $279 TODs. Hopefully if word gets out they may actually start having R seating again and let GPU/RPUs clear.

It's a slap in the face to full fare business customers. Free E+ shouldn't tick off any important customers who paid an extra $79.

I suspect that on many flights, the Y+ seats assigned at the gate go to standbys, some of whom may be elite, and nonrevs, rather than non status coach passengers on discount fares.

Separate issues handled at different times.

First, any passengers without seat assignments are assigned seats, first in E-, and then in E+ is E- is full. This can happen as soon as the GA reaches the gate.

Later, at T-30, the GA processes the standby list. If done automatically, as I understand it the system will assign standby seats where possible in the following way: elites, forwardmost non-exit-row seat; non-elites, forwardmost E- seat: NRSA, forwardmost seat.

Yes, and the final result is that many of those "free" Y+ seats assigned at the gate go to nonrevs and elites, all of whom are entitled to get them for free anyway. The end result is that one doesn't observe many Y+ seats being given away for free by the GA to folks who otherwise would have been forced to pay to get a Y+ seat in advance.

Not true for my flights. E+ is given away to non-elite non-standbys on most flights I take.

True of course, but I suspect that elites are more likely to be standby than nonelites relative to their percentages on the route/flight. My statement is about likely relative numbers. I never claimed that Y+ isn't given to nonelites, or even nonelite standbys, on any given flight.

Because of the existence of SDC, my observation is actually that revenue standbys are pretty rare. Never at any elite level, on any flight, have I ever had another revenue standby on the list above me.

If the flight isn't full you're generally correct. However if the flight is full you can definitely expect standbys.

Sure. But (and again, this is just my experience) most of my flights aren't completely full (rather, more like 95-99% full) until the NRSAs clear.

And you could try and apply for one, they even have a webpage where you can request one. But you'd (rightfully) get nothing.You paid for a benefit and you received it. That's all you need to be concerned about.

This. With not just UA, I've been given things that I know others have had to pay for. And on the flip side, there have been things I've had to pay for that I'm sure others have gotten for free. I can't say conclusively whether I've given more than I've gotten, or vice-versa, and its useless to even attempt to figure out which it is. In short, that's life.

Exactly. If we take the argument that one deserves the refund, the sliding scale could keep going...where does it stop? First its the E+ seat. Then the op-up that got given. What about CPU...should anyone who pays for F be given a refund on a flight when at least one other person in F has been CPUd? And when I'm talking to the guy sitting on the plane next to me, and I determine he's paid $75 less to be on the same flight as me, should UA refund me that amount?

In fact, I came back BOM-EWR a few weeks ago, and was able to confirm into R using miles/money at booking. I'm pretty certain there were probably some op-ups (I wasn't at the gate long - got there from the lounge and they were already boarding) - Y was "full" for at least a couple of weeks prior to departure, maybe more, R had availability every time I looked between booking and departure, and C was only ~60% full until the day of. There were a handful of empty C seats, but not 40%. Assuming I was able to determine there were op-ups, does that mean I should be able to get the miles/money back? Sure, I could have hoped for an op-up at the gate instead, however, I wanted the C seat. I paid to upgrade to guarantee me the seat, and that's what I got. IMO, its pretty irrelevant what happened at the gate - I assume UA did what it needed to do to most efficiently serve their business needs, even if it means a handful of folks that paid for Y got seated in the C cabin. They paid less than me for the same cabin...unfortunate for me, but I'm sure there have been many people who have paid less than me to fly in the same cabin on the same flight as me...in fact, it probably happens on most, or at least many, flights I've been on.

Yup - and that's how airfare works in general, in a way. I may pay $200 for a seat on a given flight, and the guy in front of me might pay $125. Same seat, different price. And on the next flight on the same route, I may pay the same $200, while the guy in the seat behind might pay $300. That's the way the industry works. So if the refund argument holds, why shouldn't we all just demand a refund after each flight so that all passengers pay the lowest price paid by anyone on that specific flight?

At times its not, but I've seen it protected a lot over the last few years, including pre-merger. I've seen GAs or FAs do counts in E+ and send poachers back to their E- seats. On more than one occasion. Of course, these days, when flights are as full as they are (at least the flights I've been traveling), its pretty difficult for anyone to help themselves to a different seat then they are assigned as they are all full.

I fly a lot to central america and routinely see a full E- and empty E+ but I've never seen the E+ offered to the general population for free. On these flights the gate agents and/or flight crew will make announcements that "E+ is reserved for people who have paid and MP members. If you would like to purchase a E+ seat please see an agent or flight crew member".

I think I can explain how it's different. I, as an individual, am a subset of "everyone." And I was asked to pay for that E+ seat. And then they included the superset of "everyone" as a group that did not need to pay for an E+ seat.

If they had kept to subsets, with at least some people denied free E+, then paying for E+ would retain value in the eyes of the person who purchased it.

STT - IAD ;)
Beautiful view out the window all flight long btw.