My question now is: Does it make sense to invest what would be required to invest in UA International First Class to bring it up to international competitiveness? Or just, carry over the CO BF model going forward?

Personally, I think UA/CO should go to a 2-class product, using CO BF as the springboard moving forward. I've heard nothing but good things about BF, and I believe UA/CO can improve upon BF and make it even more competitive and add to it.

3-class service is all good and dandy, but in the end, demand for it is erosing, and it may be better off to have 2-class service... maybe add a BF "lite" for those upgrading/opuped, and have a true "sleeper" section for those on paid J fares? There are many ideas that UA/CO can implement.

Also, adding E+ to all Int'l routes and maybe improving upon the E+ experience (better food, free drinks, etc) would bring in even more revenue.

Bring the ideas on!

Actually there are still F demand espeically on those routes that use a 744 like ORD-HKG, SFO-HKG, SFO-NRT, and LAX-SYD. Remember the 10MM flyer Tom Stuker buy paid F to SYD multiple times a year ? If you switch to 2 class that means you are giving away your business to QF ! Yes, F demand is lower compare to like 10 years ago, but it doesn't means there isn't any. UA survive by many high yield company contracts. F doesn't need to be full in order to make money, if I remember a friend of mine told me they only need 3 paid F, and certain numbers of paid C already make money on the flight.



That is a bad idea, better food and drinks would just means it would become a separate class, that most of us wouldn't be able to afford. Take a look at those airlines that sell premium economy, they are selling as full fare economy, not free to elites. Do you really want that to happen ? I would rather let it stay as it is.

So...that means they were showing the Harry Potter film that *was* out, which of course is the newest Harry Potter film, by definition.

Seems pretty evident to me.....

The OP had said that it was still in theaters... Which was at least a year ago. So it was not a current run film as implied.

I'd already admitted my mistake, so let's not exagerate. It was released on November 1, 2010 not even a year ago. It was still in some theaters as KLM was showing it. In KLM's listing it's under "recent" not "latest" in their menu headings. Latest actually has newer movies, but noting that really looked memorable to me.

Oh I am good with that... And I agree with your overall point that UACO needs to improve it's offering ;)

1998 was a better year :p ^

Market dependent; NRT, HKG, SYD, and LHR could support it, maybe some FRA flights with connecting LH F pax, but by and large as a whole a 2 class model could work. There's even some markets that would work better with more C and less F, such as ZRH, and GVA.

Disagree about the C, C-, Y lineup; I'd never pay for a C= product and economy plus is nice since it's free for elites.

As far as CO BF is concerned, on a recent trip this past month on my first CO BF flight, I found it comparable to UA F in many regards.

I get it - people don't like change. But this is not a SMI/J thing. UA's premium cabin soft product was in a deep dive long before the merger.

I've never experienced it, but it seems like the hard product was too?

That makes absolutely zero sense, given that in the past few years they've re-configured all 747s, 767s, and 1/3 of the 777s.

What leads you to believe this, especially since you haven't even tried it?

The international hard product has gotten much better over the past few years, but the domestic hard product has just slowly aged.

What are you talking about? I'm not the one who titled this thread, or started it, and I didn't contribute to it solely either. UA international First is far off the mark. I may not have been in it, but I've walked through it. I can say for sure what UA calls a FC Suite and what SG, NH, EK...and a very long list of others sell as a First Class Suite are not comparable.

Also, since UA has pulled the 'suite dreams' website that showed the conversion progress, we don't know how many 777 have been converted. But, those that haven't, FC is still offering pax a personal video tape system for movies?

Business Class is great though, on the new configuration!

From a hard product perspective, the new UA F may be a generation behind the asian and middle eastern airlines, but I don't find it too terribly different (or at least adequate) compared to european long-haul F.

So is it cheaper to offer competitive food and wine as well as pajamas vs. ripping out the new F seats to add more BF product? Seems like PJs and dom would be cheaper...