RVBOOS

Just to add to my original posts and to your questions.

First, thank you so much for taking the time to give such great opinions and thoughts.

Have already purchased the Oyster Travel Card - that seemed like a quick win.

My wife has never been in any part of Europe. I was in London 20 years ago, but I do not take a lot of stock in that.

We love history and sight seeing.

We are as excited about the Eurostar experience as we are about seeing Paris. I read the varying thoughts about this trip, and since I do not think we will be back in Europe anytime soon we are going to squeeze it in.

We also both love theater and were planning to leave a couple of "free" days where we sleep a little late and then take on a show and see London by night.

Thanks again for all the help

NWIFlyer

I'm so glad glg has written this. Football is our national game, it breeds a tribal passion (99%+ of the time in a very positive way) unlike most other sports we play, and the vast, vast majority of people talk about it and have a decent degree of knowledge. Bringing it into conversation is most certainly not, imho, likely to cause any problem at all - unless you attempt to compare it to American Football, or call it Soccer, which might bring a few disapproving looks and mean your opinion is slightly degraded as a result!

Going to a live football match, in whatever division, is something you should experience - provided you avoid local derby flashpoints, you'll see fans happily drinking together in pubs beforehand, walking to the ground together, supporting their respective teams and then walking out together at the end without a hint of a problem. To suggest otherwise is to totally overstate the hype and usually downright lies perpetrated by our and others' media.

There are lots of teams in London - I would pick one of the more traditional grounds if possible such as Orient, Brentford, Charlton or Fulham (of which Fulham would be my personal choice if they're at home - the ground has changed less than most, and still has the wonderful Cottage in one corner and the listed Stevenage Road stand along one side). If you want a corporate deal with a meal and a seat in a shared private box, from experience I know Fulham do that quite well and the prices are not outrageous - and they even welcomed me as an away (Norwich) fan in what was a vital Premier League relegation match!

London_traveller

This is clearly personal taste, but I wouldn't bother with football. Unless you're already 'into it', you may find it dull and wish you were doing something else with your time. It's one of those things only you and your wife can decide. I liken it to going to see a baseball game when I was in NYC. We all thought it was good in as much as we'd ticked it off as an activity, but none of us were particularly into it as a game so didn't get an awful lot from it. Up to you, of course.

A day trip to Paris is a lovely thing to do. I've been to Paris a number of times and the train journey as much as the visit to the city itself is a pleasant way of spending the time. Make sure you book 'Standard Premier' both ways though (as another poster mentioned). You get a bigger seat and complementary food and drink. Also, when travelling as a couple, the seating works out nicely with a pair of seats and a table for the two of you.

For the theatre, if there are particular shows you want to see then book well in advance. There are always some tickets last minute but I'd advocate booking something you want to see, otherwise you might be disappointed.

If there are particular cuisines you want to try then London pretty much has it all. The restaurant guide hardens.com is a good, unbiased reference point.

I would plan a bit for food in the evenings. Not every evening of course, but it's worth booking a couple of places you want to go to (decent places invariably get booked up).

One very specific option I'd suggest is for your first day: from your hotel you can walk along the Regent's canal to Camden Town (about 20 minute walk). There you'll find Camden Market, an amazing place that is a bit of an assault on the senses but fun and loads to see (Sunday is the best day to experience it). After spending a couple of hours there you could walk (or hop on a bus) up to Hampstead and get a roast lunch at The Flask (definitely book in advance). Given you're in Britain I think it's only right you experience a decent-quality Sunday roast

Lots of pubs do it but it's worth seeking out one that's recommended (if not The Flask then another).

One final thing: if ever you're stuck for conversation, or just want to make small-talk, talking about the weather never, ever fails.

Enjoy this great city.

Ldnn1

^ from me too for the Paris day trip. Staying at the Renaissance it literally couldn't be any easier. Paris is very compact and you'll have plenty of time to walk around much of the city at a leisurely pace during they day. Then perhaps metro up to Montmartre for sunset, before heading back to Gare du Nord for the train back.

I really wouldn't bother with organised group tours unless you specifically want to meet people. And I'm very much in the no camp on the tourist buses - both for London and Paris. I cycle past them sitting in horrible traffic every day and they always look to me like a waste of time. Unless you're not very mobile, both cities really are far better seen on foot. If you want to be guided, the Sandemans free walking tours are very good and very flexible.

I won't add more recommendations to the many good ones above and elsewhere other than to say London and Paris can be at their absolute best in October - sunny autumn days can't be beaten, though sadly can't be guaranteed either.

jt82

Yep, pretty much this, there are plenty of lower league clubs as listed - Leyton Orient, Fulham, Charlton, AFC Wimbledon, Brentford all good choices (although the latter may be a tough ask for tickets given the ground's small size, the club's relatively high league position and their forthcoming move to a new ground). As a tourist there's no need to consider anyone else, QPR's an overpriced tiny cramped dump, Barnet's a poor experience, while I'm doing Millwall next month and will probably find that the supposed problems there are vastly overstated, it's not worth considering regardless.

While true, it's easy to work it in so that it takes a small portion of your day -do whatever you're wanting to do in the morning-lunch, watch game, then grab tea and carry on your plans for the evening. It's not like someone being in NYC and thinking that watching a Giants/Jets game is a good idea, which with the length of the game and the ballache it is to get to takes up most of a day

edit - having just reread the OP, that he arrives on a Sunday and leaves Saturday makes the entire question moot unless he lucks out and there's midweek games scheduled

NWIFlyer

Enjoy The Den - as an experienced UK fan you'll probably not see any issues, but it's not somewhere I'd recommend for a tourist, both for the area the ground's in which you'd hardly describe as picturesque and the potential for lower than average crowd behaviour. In my experience, a few people there do want to live up to their reputation and that's not going away in a hurry. QPR - absolutely, words do not exist to describe Loftus Road! Barnet is identikit. My Fulham suggestion was because the area's pleasant to walk through from the tube station, the ground is historic, and capacity is currently well above the demand for tickets to the extent that the Club even has a neutral area. Brentford ticks some of those boxes as well, but as you say ticket availability is a bigger issue. Of course, the lower down the divisions you go, the better chance of finding that great British institution - the (standing) terrace!

Or a game moved to a Sunday for TV coverage, of course.

RVBOOS

Thank you again everyone for all of the helpful tips.
What we have planned so far:

Saturday, 10/22: Leaving Arizona, flying through ATL to LHR (Delta One)
Sunday, 10/23: Arrive London, St Pancras Renaissance Hotel - leisurely day
Monday, 10/24: Full Day London Tour - Premium Tours of UK
Tuesday, 10/25: Late riser day, leisure day, London by night, perhaps Wicked show
Wednesday, 10/26: Bullet train trip to Paris, full day tour, Premium tours of UK
Thursday, 10/27: Late riser day, leisurely walking tour of London
Friday, 10/28: OPEN - not decided
Saturday, 10/29: LHR to Arizona, via Atlanta, Afternoon. Delta One service

krispy84

I won't repeat the great ideas already mentioned up thread but I am a big fan of the TimeOut city guides. I tend to use them for major cities in Europe and the US and think they cover all the main topics very well. Have a read through and see what areas of London or sights that take your fancy (maybe one of the less well known ones, I love the walk from Bayswater to the Royal Albert Hall through Hyde Park / Kensington Gardens). TimeOut is also good on restaurants and bars etc and tends to highlight the current hotspots, in as much as a guide book can.

Whatever you do, please, please, please do not go to anywhere that calls itself a 'Steak House', 'Scottish' 'Aberdeen' or otherwise. They have almost died out but I fear still trap some unwitting tourists.

Badenoch

LOL. They are still there although not as many. Anthony Bourdain justifiably savaged them in a chapter entitled "Warning Signs" in his book "Nasty Bits." He didn't name the restaurants but anyone whose been to London knew exactly the chain he was talking about. I've never set foot in one but they do seem to attract tourists.

stut

They are bafflingly popular, given the tacky decor and high prices. Surely in this day of data roaming and obsessive Tripadvice, it's a lot easier to stumble into a Hawksmoor or Cau instead.

krispy84

"drools"

My diet-shake lunch is now feeling really inadequate

Badenoch

Their popularity does make some sense. London can be a daunting place for a visitor and the "Angus/Aberdeen" steakhouses look very much like an American casual restaurant. Bright, good location, familiar menu options and would be a comfortable choice for a North American who didn't know any better. Depressingly they don't score all that badly on Trip Advisor.

Another one to warn visitors about is Garfunkels. Awful places.

The_Diamond_Z

+1 to all of the above and I'll add The Spaghetti House

London_traveller

The reality is many tourists don't plan. They're happy to wander and 'stumble' into a restaurant so these kinds of mid-range places that aren't bad but aren't good either fit the bill.

OP, seems like you have some spare time factored into your plan, which is great. On the food theme, take a look at www.hardens.com for good, unbiased reviews of restaurants. If you wanted to make a thing of it then weekday lunch options in top restaurants which would be very expensive in the evenings/at weekends, can be an excellent option. For example, The Ledbury is one of the top rated restaurants around. Their normal tasting menu is £115 per person. But at lunch time you can get their four course set lunch for £50. Still not cheap but a great way to do it. (There are many options like this if you search a little).

Whether or not you do that, it is worth a little bit of research for food. One option very close to your hotel is Karpo, on the other side of the Euston Road. Doesn't look anything from the outside - bizarrely-painted exterior, next to a Burger King. But, inside, it's very pleasant and the food is good.

The Gilbert Scott, inside your hotel, is also a very good option. You are spoilt for choice

ajGoes

I remember wandering up and down that bit of the Euston Road on my last visit to London, looking for (and failing to find) somewhere appealing to eat. I now have two places starred in Google Maps: Karpo and the Euston Flyer. Thanks.