And what about the half of the aircraft load that they provide, meaning without them the flight would not be viable at all, and that then impacts further on the London and UK economy.

How did Dallas progress from being a backwater cow town to a major corporate centre of the USA ? Could the enormous transfer hub airport that got built there just have a bit to do with it ?

I'm interested - presumably some modelling has been done to quantify not only how much capacity a third runway would add but also how a third runway would reduce average hold times at busy periods. To me that would certainly add weight to the argument.

Atlanta could of course be an example of that as well.

oscietra

You do know how many cargo flights and ad-hoc slots there are into LHR, don't you? Not much capacity to be had there.


...I don't but I'd hazard a guess at around 1% of movements, maybe 2%.

About a years' worth of slot growth, I'd imagine. Add to that the other 1%-2% slot generators, and suddenly you might be able to find enough capacity to *help* tied LHR over until a new hub can replace it. Slot massaging will never fill the demand Heathrow needs to supply, but then neither will R3.

...erm, they did find some Texas Tea there, too....

http://xfinity.comcast.net/blogs/tv/...rry-hagman.jpg

IMHO, the solution isn't to add a runway, or to build an airport in a marsh. A better solution would be to build a giant new airport between Birmingham and London, and take advantage of high-speed 2 construction to tie the airport into the high speed rail network- like LYS is tied in to the TGV system - kind of like the new Al-Maktoum airport in Dubai. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Du...2_Imresolt.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Makt...tional_Airport

you mean the airport whose opening keeps being delayed?

IMHO I disagree. I think a ten runway airport on an island in the estuary is the way to go. 250 mph trains into central London and connected to the mainland by bridges. It could link on to HS2, HS1 etc and have a German style plane to train system where you can board a train 15 minutes after departing your plane. Lord Foster envisages Europe's largest station in his airport design. Spot on. However I do not like his peninsula design as there are more birds on coasts than several miles out at sea.

I think the lesson here is that making policy based on cynical politics rather than what you genuinely believe to be the right option will end up digging a big hole. It's not just the 3rd runway, now it's a hook to hang all the backbenchers grievances on because they can see how hard the cabinet's squirming.

Actually, they didn't - the major oil fields are either well to the west around Midland Odessa or to the east and south east nearer Houston. So far as I can tell (I wasn't born at the time!) both Dallas and Ft. Worth were trading and finance centers first for cattle, then for the oil industry. Basically they're just like London - little actual wealth gets created, but they sure know how to cream off a percentage from everyone else!

But the problem with that is airports have a nasty habit of attracting people to them. In 50 years time it would be surrounded by a medium sized town of residents all moaning about the noise again. The only solution is to build it somewhere where noone can move next to it - the sea.

People will complain whatever you decide to do. The government knows that so is procrastinating long enough to ensure that its the next one who has to deal with making the decision.

Its a shame that instead of having men run this country, its a bunch of cowardly mice. :D

The only problem with sticking it out at sea is that if there is ever a problem with the access to the island that you build then you've got a whole heap of problems. Someone years ago commented to me that BOS was like this in that there was only one way of getting to the airport. I pointed out that not only were they were building a second tunnel but that it's still possible to reach the airport without needing to go through the tunnel. The easy access is via the tunnel and the local roads could also be used but to avoid serious congestion they put the tunnels in.

What a load of cobblers. :rolleyes: Of all the UK regions, there are only 3 that make a net contribution to the exchequer's coffers: London, the South East and the East and of these London is the largest contributor. Like it or not, but without London (and it's a lot more than financial services) the UK economy would be in even more dire straits. This weekend's Notting Hill Carnival alone is said to contribute around 100m to the economy.

I did despair at a quote by Justine Greening I heard today. It was (and I paraphrase) that "it is time to build on the growing consensus that a third runway is not desirable" - but the best bit was "and anyway, it is not a proper full-length runway so has very limited benefits as it will not be able to take the larger planes at LHR"

But she completely fails to mention that by the new R3 handling a good deal of the NB and short-haul WB aircraft it will free up a significant number of take-off and landing slots on the existing full-length pair of runways....so still providing a very worthwhile overall capacity increase.

A baffling (but highly predictable for a politician) statement by her