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-   -   Conservative party admits wrong on Heathrow (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/u-k-ireland/1328600-conservative-party-admits-wrong-heathrow.html)

Wally Bird May 29, 2013 7:15 am

Certainly not in my lifetime. Maybe yours.

InternationalLiving May 29, 2013 8:02 am

Oh dear, I see there is already a 50+ page thread on the subject in the UK forum. Might as well just merge my first post...

stut May 29, 2013 9:43 am


Originally Posted by InternationalLiving (Post 20829504)
Oh dear, I see there is already a 50+ page thread on the subject in the UK forum. Might as well just merge my first post...

I did consider holding a 5-year inquiry on the matter, but instead went ahead and merged the threads :)

stut
Moderator
UK & Ireland

NickB May 29, 2013 10:17 am


Originally Posted by stut (Post 20830098)
I did consider holding a 5-year inquiry on the matter, but instead went ahead and merged the threads :)

stut
Moderator
UK & Ireland

You, reckless you. I mean, how can one take FT seriously with all that moderating on the hoof. ;) Evidence-based moderation, that's what we need! :D

alanR May 29, 2013 10:46 am


Originally Posted by InternationalLiving (Post 20828455)
-Heathrow only recently got a very expensive new terminal, T5
-Heathrow is well linked to the motorway, with coach connections to the SE, SW, and W of England.
-Heathrow is connected by an Underground line into the centre of London, as well as a faster rail link, as well as the soon-to-be-finished Crossrail project - and may even be connected by the planned "HS2" rail project.
-Heathrow has a direct fuel pipeline running to it all the way from Southampton.

The real biggy is that Heathrow directly employees tens of thousands of people, indirectly hundreds of thousands and many businesses set up in the area because of Heathrow. How do you move them?

NickB May 29, 2013 11:02 am


Originally Posted by alanR (Post 20830475)
The real biggy is that Heathrow directly employees tens of thousands of people, indirectly hundreds of thousands and many businesses set up in the area because of Heathrow. How do you move them?

Yes but that is true whenever you relocate a major airport, or indeed any major facility. This is an important issue that must be put in the balance. It is not necessarily per se conclusive.

flyingcrazy May 29, 2013 11:28 am


Originally Posted by alanR (Post 20830475)
The real biggy is that Heathrow directly employees tens of thousands of people, indirectly hundreds of thousands and many businesses set up in the area because of Heathrow. How do you move them?

Do the areas deserve the jobs?
In the referendum recently in Hillingdon, [redacted by moderator] said they didnt support a 3rd runway but didnt support Boris Island either because of all the jobs LHR provides the area. I think for the stupidity of that statement alone they deserve to lose LHR.

NickB May 29, 2013 11:41 am


Originally Posted by flyingcrazy (Post 20830754)
Do the areas deserve the jobs?
In the referendum recently in Hillingdon, [redacted by moderator] said they didnt support a 3rd runway but didnt support Boris Island either because of all the jobs LHR provides the area. I think for the stupidity of that statement alone they deserve to lose LHR.

I would hope that such decisions would be based on an informed, dispassionate, analytical and professional approach to the questions rather than the Jeremy Kyle style of decision-making that you seem to favour.

InternationalLiving May 29, 2013 12:47 pm


Originally Posted by stut (Post 20830098)
I did consider holding a 5-year inquiry on the matter, but instead went ahead and merged the threads :)

stut
Moderator
UK & Ireland

haha, that made my evening, thanks. :)

(Yes, anything will make your evening if you are studying for an exam on transport economics...)

InternationalLiving May 29, 2013 12:54 pm


Originally Posted by Wally Bird (Post 20829224)
Certainly not in my lifetime. Maybe yours.

Indeed... big projects take so long these days, aviation will be in decline due to the high prices of oil by the time that it happens. So, might as well not bother.


Originally Posted by alanR (Post 20830475)
The real biggy is that Heathrow directly employees tens of thousands of people, indirectly hundreds of thousands and many businesses set up in the area because of Heathrow. How do you move them?

Indeed, it's a huge political no-no. I think the issue with Heathrow just comes down to 3rd runway/no third runway, not whether to move it. If they can't have the third runway, then they might have to get creative. I'm sure there are plenty of ways to continue increasing passenger numbers, and even flights, such as limiting the number of small aircraft slots and increasing operating hours. I wonder if people are sometimes considering the problem the wrong way...
(I'm sure these ideas have been covered in the first 50 pages, which I'll have to read after tomorrow's exam)

flyingcrazy May 29, 2013 2:15 pm


Originally Posted by NickB (Post 20830855)
I would hope that such decisions would be based on an informed, dispassionate, analytical and professional approach to the questions rather than the Jeremy Kyle style of decision-making that you seem to favour.

Unfortunately informed, dispassionate, analytical and professional approach's do not exist in many cases in the UK.
From what we have seen Conservative and Lib Dem politicians, green groups and many of the residents of West London certainly do not take informed, dispassionate, analytical and professional approach's.

NickB May 29, 2013 2:58 pm


Originally Posted by flyingcrazy (Post 20831808)
Unfortunately informed, dispassionate, analytical and professional approach's do not exist in many cases in the UK.
From what we have seen Conservative and Lib Dem politicians, green groups and many of the residents of West London certainly do not take informed, dispassionate, analytical and professional approach's.

and your point is....? Is it "Miss, miss, ... he started it..."?

flyingcrazy May 29, 2013 3:46 pm


Originally Posted by NickB (Post 20832025)
and your point is....? Is it "Miss, miss, ... he started it..."?

I have no idea what to reply to this. Nor do I see any point to this discussion with you whatsoever.

I think from previous encounters it is just easier for us to ignore each other.

flyingcrazy May 29, 2013 3:49 pm


Originally Posted by InternationalLiving (Post 20831327)
I'm sure there are plenty of ways to continue increasing passenger numbers, and even flights, such as limiting the number of small aircraft slots and increasing operating hours. I wonder if people are sometimes considering the problem the wrong way...
(I'm sure these ideas have been covered in the first 50 pages, which I'll have to read after tomorrow's exam)

I think in the short term and perhaps even in this government LHR will be allowed to increase movements to 540,000 a year by introducing mixed mode. George Osbourne is in favour of this as a short term solution. This will probably give a UK government an extra 3 or 4 years to dither before deciding whether to build a new runway, airport or just decide to let the Dutch do all the hubbing business.


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