The situation at O'Hare
May 11, 2001, 6:13 pm
#16
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Portland, Oregon; seat 3A
Programs: UA 1K 2021-22-23-24;Formerly a longtime UA Premier Exec; NW silver (legacy), Alaska Gold (way back)
Posts: 2,318
If we can dream on an unlimited budget, how about this?
Connect ORD to Midway with a high-speed train (true high-speed rail as Chitown64 says, not "55 mph" high speed). An orthogonal route (not straight-line but following the grid pattern of the highways) would be about 25 miles long. The train could do the run in 12 minutes (run at 150 mph top speed and allow time for starting and stopping). Let's say that the train makes three stops at ORD and one at Midway. Still it should be 15 to 18 minutes, no more, to Midway from the farthest stop at ORD. Then move shorter flights to Midway and allow Midway-to-ORD transfers. Put the train stops inside security to cut a few minutes off transfer time. Then Midway effectively operates as a remote terminal for ORD as well as a reliever airport.
The same theory would work for connecting to Gary Regional, or even (less plausibly) to Milwaukee but the transfer time would be longer.
Connect ORD to Midway with a high-speed train (true high-speed rail as Chitown64 says, not "55 mph" high speed). An orthogonal route (not straight-line but following the grid pattern of the highways) would be about 25 miles long. The train could do the run in 12 minutes (run at 150 mph top speed and allow time for starting and stopping). Let's say that the train makes three stops at ORD and one at Midway. Still it should be 15 to 18 minutes, no more, to Midway from the farthest stop at ORD. Then move shorter flights to Midway and allow Midway-to-ORD transfers. Put the train stops inside security to cut a few minutes off transfer time. Then Midway effectively operates as a remote terminal for ORD as well as a reliever airport.
The same theory would work for connecting to Gary Regional, or even (less plausibly) to Milwaukee but the transfer time would be longer.
May 11, 2001, 9:08 pm
#17
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2000
Location: RDU
Programs: AA LT Gold, DL SM, HY Disc, Marriott LT Gold
Posts: 12,517
Also, the CTA should run a line between ORD, MDW, and Gary, maybe even Milwaukee..
It would NOT be high speed however, but it would have limited stops primarily at intersections with existing Metra services - that would allow connecting traffic of a wide wedge of Chicagoland bordered by Oak Park, Berwyn, Aurora, and Elgin) to both airports.
[This message has been edited by ElmhurstNick (edited 05-11-2001).]
May 11, 2001, 10:33 pm
#18
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA
Programs: UA Gold, DL Plat, SPG Gold, Hilton Gold, Marriott Silver, Hertz PC
Posts: 543
Completely agree that it would be fantastic to have a high-speed link between ORD and MDW.
Another interesting proposal would be to create a Hong Kong-like, in-town check-in system (ala "Airport Express"). Have a terminal downtown Chicago and then one in the suburbs...maybe the Oak Brook area to make it convenient for where a lot of highways come together.
If people are provided with viable alternatives to actually having to drive to either airport, then certainly ORD could expand quite a bit and not have to worry so much about the traffic congestion issue (noise and the environment still remain as contentious subject matter). In my opinion, the best possible way to achieve this desirable result is to allow people advance check-in away from the airports--meaning that they can get rid of their luggage remotely and travel to the airport quickly, comfortably, and conveniently.
This scenario, of course, does not take into account that it would cost billions of dollars and would mean relocating hundreds/thousands of homes/businesses. But we can dream, can't we?
Another interesting proposal would be to create a Hong Kong-like, in-town check-in system (ala "Airport Express"). Have a terminal downtown Chicago and then one in the suburbs...maybe the Oak Brook area to make it convenient for where a lot of highways come together.
If people are provided with viable alternatives to actually having to drive to either airport, then certainly ORD could expand quite a bit and not have to worry so much about the traffic congestion issue (noise and the environment still remain as contentious subject matter). In my opinion, the best possible way to achieve this desirable result is to allow people advance check-in away from the airports--meaning that they can get rid of their luggage remotely and travel to the airport quickly, comfortably, and conveniently.
This scenario, of course, does not take into account that it would cost billions of dollars and would mean relocating hundreds/thousands of homes/businesses. But we can dream, can't we?
May 12, 2001, 11:54 am
#20
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA
Programs: UA Gold, DL Plat, SPG Gold, Hilton Gold, Marriott Silver, Hertz PC
Posts: 543
Originally posted by nlp:
Does anyone know what happened to its World Gatewat Program? Is there any progress and the project was abandoned already?
Does anyone know what happened to its World Gatewat Program? Is there any progress and the project was abandoned already?
May 12, 2001, 9:15 pm
#21
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Valley Springs, Ca USA;Proud Retired AAer SJC Ramp/ AA- 2 MM Platinum;Hilton Diamond
Posts: 851
I grew up in Elk Grove Village. The NIMBY's who live there now never had it so good! When I was in school we literally had to stop all learning when 32L/R was in use because those were the days of Stage I and Stage II engines. The whole building would shake. The modern Stage III engines cause almost no interference with living and most residents fail to even notice them after a time. I saw this area grow from a tract home outpost to a teeming commercial center with all it benefits and rvenue and the reason is ORD!
May 13, 2001, 6:23 am
#22
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Waukesha, WI. USA
Posts: 6
As the situation at O'Hare continues to erode residents of northern Illinois do yourself a favor and journey north, and use Milwaukee's General Mitchell. Less congested, less expensive(parking $7.00/day in the parking structure), and home to Midwest Express. The 40-50 miles drive is well worth it. Also you'll encounter a better worker attitude than what you would find in Chicago.
May 13, 2001, 8:06 am
#23
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2000
Location: RDU
Programs: AA LT Gold, DL SM, HY Disc, Marriott LT Gold
Posts: 12,517
I'm fortunate because I don't live directly under a runway path for ORD - the path from the Southwest is about eight blocks WNW of me. Those folks have it rough and if anybody's been there since the 50s, I feel sorry for them. But then again I have a friend that built a brand new home right there, so I have no compassion for her.
From my location, I rarely hear any airplane noise and I'm about three miles to the airport on a straight line.
From my location, I rarely hear any airplane noise and I'm about three miles to the airport on a straight line.
May 13, 2001, 1:28 pm
#24
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 24
Regarding questions of the world gateway program.. Terminal 6 is now underway (on the drawing boards), Chicago has brought together 4 companies I believe called T6 Partners. Terminal 6 will be constructed for sure, but I can't say when.
As for the new One World terminal 4, that is planned but nothing has been started, same with the star alliance terminal 2, that may not show up for a while either, but terminal 6 is underway.
As for the new One World terminal 4, that is planned but nothing has been started, same with the star alliance terminal 2, that may not show up for a while either, but terminal 6 is underway.
May 13, 2001, 7:17 pm
#26
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Highland Park, IL USA
Programs: AA PLT 2MM, UA Plat, SPG Gold, HH Gold
Posts: 561
Another Chicago suburbanite chiming in...
My previous house was right under 22R's flight path...I could stand on my front lawn and watch the parade of nations as all the heavies came in during the afternoon. Never bothered me and I knew what I was getting into. Like others have said, that airport has been there longer than most of the area residents.
So, I of course support expansion, since I now live only 20-30 minutes from O'Hare, over an hour from Midway, and who even wants to think about how far to Peotone.
Still, when you look at how many airports are serving the #1 and #2 population areas of the US (NYC, LA), having only two reallyserving Chicago doesn't seem like it will be enough in the future. So I think a third makes sense. I think you could build a new one a whole lot closer than Peotone, though. I like the Gary idea.
And I'll bet with Boeing's HQ coming to town, Meigs Field has a long and vibrant future ahead. Can an RJ land there?
My previous house was right under 22R's flight path...I could stand on my front lawn and watch the parade of nations as all the heavies came in during the afternoon. Never bothered me and I knew what I was getting into. Like others have said, that airport has been there longer than most of the area residents.
So, I of course support expansion, since I now live only 20-30 minutes from O'Hare, over an hour from Midway, and who even wants to think about how far to Peotone.
Still, when you look at how many airports are serving the #1 and #2 population areas of the US (NYC, LA), having only two reallyserving Chicago doesn't seem like it will be enough in the future. So I think a third makes sense. I think you could build a new one a whole lot closer than Peotone, though. I like the Gary idea.
And I'll bet with Boeing's HQ coming to town, Meigs Field has a long and vibrant future ahead. Can an RJ land there?
May 14, 2001, 3:25 pm
#27
Join Date: Nov 2000
Programs: AA Plat, Alaska MVP, HHonors Gold, IHG Plat, Hertz PC, National Executive Elite, UA Kettle
Posts: 897
I like O'Hare and I'm just barely in the Chicago city limits. I'm directly in the flight path, planes approach two by two right over the house. The noise doesn't bother me too much, it's not insanely loud and there doesn't seem to be a heck of a lot of traffic at night.
While O'Hare is nice and the L is certianly convinent, I fly out of MKE quite a bit because fares are often cheaper. Parking is cheaper and the staff at MKE are friendly.
Last time I flew out of MKE, the security agent at the checkpoing actually handed my bag to me, smiled and thanked me. I haven't had this happen at O'Hare, or any other airports that I can remember.. with the possible exception of much smaller airports such as Juneau, Yakutat and Cordova
I wouldn't have a problem flying in and out of Gary, some carriers just need to shift some traffic there.
-Robert
While O'Hare is nice and the L is certianly convinent, I fly out of MKE quite a bit because fares are often cheaper. Parking is cheaper and the staff at MKE are friendly.
Last time I flew out of MKE, the security agent at the checkpoing actually handed my bag to me, smiled and thanked me. I haven't had this happen at O'Hare, or any other airports that I can remember.. with the possible exception of much smaller airports such as Juneau, Yakutat and Cordova
I wouldn't have a problem flying in and out of Gary, some carriers just need to shift some traffic there.
-Robert
May 14, 2001, 9:20 pm
#28
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 24
It's nice to see so many suburban residents who think way differently than the SOC. I agree about building up Gary, but ORD needs runways just to handle the existing delays anyway.
I read an article in the Tribune a while ago about how people don't favor Governer Ryan running for a second term. Maybe that means new runways will be approved since now he doesn't have to please anybody, unless the SOC totally bought him out.
As for Meigs field, I don't think Boeing means anything for it. Their business jets can't use Meigs and they'll use Midway anyway, plus if they want straight downtown flights, they've got helicopters.
Meigs needs to be a park, its 100 daily flights can be easily absorbed by MDW or ORD.
I read an article in the Tribune a while ago about how people don't favor Governer Ryan running for a second term. Maybe that means new runways will be approved since now he doesn't have to please anybody, unless the SOC totally bought him out.
As for Meigs field, I don't think Boeing means anything for it. Their business jets can't use Meigs and they'll use Midway anyway, plus if they want straight downtown flights, they've got helicopters.
Meigs needs to be a park, its 100 daily flights can be easily absorbed by MDW or ORD.
May 15, 2001, 9:27 am
#29
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Highland Park, IL USA
Programs: AA PLT 2MM, UA Plat, SPG Gold, HH Gold
Posts: 561
"O'Hare neighbors say they can handle noise"
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/m...-51732,FF.html
"In startling contrast to the stereotype perpetuated by both sides in the Chicago area's airport expansion battle, the survey indicates that a sizable segment of the people who have chosen to live inside the federally designated noise contour of O'Hare do not view themselves as jet-weary victims who are rabidly against airport development.
In fact, the vast majority of people polled rated O'Hare vital to maintaining the region's economic health."
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/m...-51732,FF.html
"In startling contrast to the stereotype perpetuated by both sides in the Chicago area's airport expansion battle, the survey indicates that a sizable segment of the people who have chosen to live inside the federally designated noise contour of O'Hare do not view themselves as jet-weary victims who are rabidly against airport development.
In fact, the vast majority of people polled rated O'Hare vital to maintaining the region's economic health."
May 15, 2001, 3:27 pm
#30
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Chicago
Programs: United 1K, American EXP & 3 Million Miler, Hyatt Globalist & Marriott Ambassador Elite
Posts: 2,362
Chitown64,
You are right on, I have not before seen such a clear and honest assesment of the situation at ORD. Being a native north suburban resident, I do hope that Daley wins, and ORD can return to its former glory. Hell, there are plenty of shady hotels and trailor parks on the far side of O'hare that could create a good buffer zone and no airline or paying PAX will go down to Peotone. THanks for bringing this up.
You are right on, I have not before seen such a clear and honest assesment of the situation at ORD. Being a native north suburban resident, I do hope that Daley wins, and ORD can return to its former glory. Hell, there are plenty of shady hotels and trailor parks on the far side of O'hare that could create a good buffer zone and no airline or paying PAX will go down to Peotone. THanks for bringing this up.