|
Beware of stewardesses with PMS!
OK, to be fair, male FA's can get nasty too. But this story is about a certain female.
I was on HP from SNA to LAS today. As we were pulling away from the gate, our FA gave the usual safety announcement. A guy a few rows back was talking to his seat partner. The FA was going "AHEM!" in a loud voice, but he kept talking. She stopped her safety annoucement and asked him to be quiet. He kind of waved her away and kept talking. Big Mistake! Back we went to the gate and the sheriff hauled the guy off the plane. He will have to pay the gate fee and deal with whatever federal charges he gets and we were all late to LAS. Worse, we had to listen to a loud high-pitched lecture about how the FA didn't go to school for 8 weeks to learn safety for nothing. We also heard about how crazy LAS passengers are and how she has been pinched and slapped too many times and she isn't going to take it any longer. Yes the guy was wrong to talk during the safety announcement and he was really wrong for not deferring to the FA, but his punishment doesn't deserve the crime. And I didn't deserve to be late and have to listen to a lecture from an agitated FA. I've been worried about this ever since I heard about the zero-tolerance towards air-rage. The FA's have way too much power to crucify someone for pissing them off. I'm sure that 90 percent of the offenders deserve their punishment, but there is no recourse against PMS (male or female). |
Maybe she was upset about the loss of America's Worst codeshare partner, TWA. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/eek.gif
|
I can appreciate that the FA may have been unpleasant -- but -- I would've loved to have seen them haul that guy off the plane.
Cretins who yak all through the safety announcements are a major pet peeve of mine -- especially those who do it ostentatiously, as if they have to demonstrate how used they are to air travel. You just know that in the chance of a real emergency they'd be the first to freak out, too. I bet the FA on your flight had seen it 100 times before and decided to do something about it -- and I bet every other pax on your flight pipes down from now on during taxi. And I say that FA rocks, PMS or no PMS. |
I always thought it would be a fun practical joke to organize all the passengers on a plane so when the safety announcements are being made, not only is everyone paying attention, but they all all furiously taking notes. And then raising hands and asking questions like "In the event of a water landing, I should use what as floatation device?".
I would do this except it would be too hard, and I'm sure I would wind up in jail. |
I wanna be on Opus" flight! Imagine 150 pax leaping up, donning those lifejackets and pulling those red inflateable tabs and blowing on the whistles all at once. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/eek.gif
CNN would run that one if someone camcordered it! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif ------------------ ~ Glen ~ |
I've been worried about this ever since I heard about the zero-tolerance towards air-rage. The FA's have way too much power to crucify someone for pissing them off. |
Originally posted by stimpy: Yes the guy was wrong to talk during the safety announcement and he was really wrong for not deferring to the FA, but his punishment doesn't deserve the crime. And I didn't deserve to be late and have to listen to a lecture from an agitated FA. I've been worried about this ever since I heard about the zero-tolerance towards air-rage. The FA's have way too much power to crucify someone for pissing them off. Yes, the punishment was a bit severe, but what other choice did the FA have besides doing nothing to really punish the offender? Not give them any peanuts during the flight? |
I gotta agree with Beckles on this one, stimpy. That FA has my sympathy and my support. I've been delayed on flights for so many different reasons (as has everyone else) that I wouldn't mind if for once the delay resulted in some jerk who refuses to listen to the FA being hauled off the plane.
|
Safety announcements may be important to leisure travellers who travel once or twice per year but to the regular traveller they are just a routine like buckling up before the take off. Most of us here probably know by heart the whole pre take-off saftey thing and could do the demonstrations ourselves if we really had to.
Taking a guy off the flight just because he wouldn't shut up during the lecture? Geeeeeee... there is a difference between having a conversation and air rage... This is not primary school after all where students have to shut up when teacher speaks. If this is allowed to go on then what's next? We won't be allowed to read papers and magazines when a FA talks? |
dup
[This message has been edited by letiole (edited 01-09-2001).] |
Spider: Yeah, the guy talking may have known the safety speech inside out. The problem though is that the person next to him may not have known it, but couldn't hear it because of the guy's talking.
[This message has been edited by letiole (edited 01-09-2001).] |
ON a recent Skywest aka UX flight from ONT-LAX, the woman who sat in 9B had the look of someone who didn't travel lots. FA went through cabin asking those in exit rows if they were willing and able to assist in the event of an emergency. Woman looked startled and said "Let me study the material first and tell you." At that point the fa looked startled, but I think was also pleased that someone took it so seriously. Woman then read the briefing card and in a couple of minutes signaled to the fa her ok. I appreciated the woman's candor and willingess to take it seriously.
|
To me it would depend on how loud and how brazenly the individual talked. If he was chatting in a low volume with his seatmate than that's his right. If he made it difficult for others around him to hear the safety announcement he should have gotten the boot.
Personally it was bad judgement on that guy's part to anger the flight attendant.. even if the punishment is a bit severe why annoy those folks on purpose?? |
How about the FA just stating, "If you do not stop & listen, sir, we will be forced to return to the gate and have you removed at your financial expense and also the expense of the time of all the other pax with whom you will not likely be very popular!! May I proceed? Thank you!"
A little warning would be nice! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif |
I don't understand those who talk, read newspapers (eclipsing the view of the FA), or do anything else to disrupt others from hearing the announcements. It's simply rude.
Does this punnishment fit the crime? No. Am I glad it happened. Yes. |
Oh please. Stimpy is dead right on this. If you want a law, call your congressman and get a law passed. Until then, this is a matter of courtesy, not eminent domain of the FA involved.
My experience is that people usually respond the same way they are treated. A quiet, "Could you please hold your voice down until this is finished?" would be far more effective. If it isnt, quietly look at him until he quiets down in embarassment. If he doesnt, well, that's life. Don't give him a gold star. Bet this guy sues the daylights out of the airline. and if he does, bet he wins, too. This was an abuse. |
There was suuuuch a simple solution which (when all goes left) leaves the passenger embarassed enough not to quickly forget while not causing such a delay:
1. Stop the lecture. 2. Say in a pleasant voice: "Please excuse me. I would hate to interrupt the gentleman seating in seat XX (point him out to all the other passengers, stand next to him if necessary to make clear who´s the offender). As soon as he is done with his conversation, I will be able to finish the demonstration and we can head to Las Vegas." (if that doesn´t work, he really does need to have his A$$ hauled down to police HQ to have the message squeezed through his skull). This isn´t rocket science - I use it all the time when I work with both youths and adults and it has yet to fail me. |
At the risk of violating my own new year's resolution to avoid flame sessions, could I ever-so-politely suggest that a less offensive title for this thread might have been "Beware of FAs on a power trip" ?
Yes, we are enured to the phrase and can laugh at it sometimes. But power-tripping hard asses are usually such no matter where the moon is in its cycle http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif |
Brian and yonatan - if you read the first post again you will notice the guy was given a warning first. 2 infact.
Though I am in no way defending the FA for the actions taken. And I do think the guy was wrong in his attitude. Basically, both sides were wrong in their actions (or reactions). [This message has been edited by Baze (edited 01-09-2001).] |
If you want a law, call your congressman and get a law passed. Until then, this is a matter of courtesy, not eminent domain of the FA involved. Title 14 Chapter I Sec. 91.11 Prohibition on interference with crewmembers. No person may assault, threaten, intimidate, or interfere with a crewmember in the performance of the crewmember's duties aboard an aircraft being operated. [Amdt. 91-211, 54 FR 34291, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by Amdt. 91-257, 64 FR 1079, Jan. 7, 1999; 64 FR 7066, Feb. 12, 1999] The passenger was clearly in violation of the law. However, I agree that the FA overreacted and should have tried more effective motivation before resorting to the authorities... |
More of Title 14, Chapter I U.S.C. in case you care, and even if you don't http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif:
Sec. 91.519 Passenger briefing. (a) Before each takeoff the pilot in command of an airplane carrying passengers shall ensure that all passengers have been orally briefed on-- (1) Smoking: Each passenger shall be briefed on when, where, and under what conditions smoking is prohibited. This briefing shall include a statement, as appropriate, that the Federal Aviation Regulations require passenger compliance with lighted passenger information signs and no smoking placards, prohibit smoking in lavatories, and require compliance with crewmember instructions with regard to these items; (2) Use of safety belts and shoulder harnesses: Each passenger shall be briefed on when, where, and under what conditions it is necessary to have his or her safety belt and, if installed, his or her shoulder harness fastened about him or her. This briefing shall include a statement, as appropriate, that Federal Aviation Regulations require passenger compliance with the lighted passenger sign and/or crewmember instructions with regard to these items; (3) Location and means for opening the passenger entry door and emergency exits; (4) Location of survival equipment; (5) Ditching procedures and the use of flotation equipment required under Sec. 91.509 for a flight over water; and (6) The normal and emergency use of oxygen equipment installed on the airplane. (b) The oral briefing required by paragraph (a) of this section shall be given by the pilot in command or a member of the crew, but need not be given when the pilot in command determines that the passengers are familiar with the contents of the briefing. It may be supplemented by printed cards for the use of each passenger containing-- (1) A diagram of, and methods of operating, the emergency exits; and (2) Other instructions necessary for use of emergency equipment. (c) Each card used under paragraph (b) must be carried in convenient locations on the airplane for the use of each passenger and must contain information that is pertinent only to the type and model airplane on which it is used. [Dkt. No. 18334, Amdt. 91-211, 54 FR 34314, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by Amdt. 91-231, 57 FR 42672, Sept. 15, 1992] And the Federal Aviation Regulations require passenger compliance with the crewmember's instructions with regard to this duty. But, hey, I'm NOT a lawyer. I just play one at work http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif |
They should have just taken his status and FF miles away (the whole account.) No class = no status.
Geez, the FA's have it bad enough. What is 5 minutes to have some courtesy? |
The heck with the law. How does anyone ever expect extra special service, respect, a free bottle of wine and/or a free box of Godiva chocolates, if one ticks off the FA?
The guy should have been arrested for stupidity. |
Premex wrote:
The guy should have been arrested for stupidity. |
Do I think the FA overreacted when s/he threw the offending passenger off the plane? Yes. If what he was saying wasn't offensive by itself, then he's getting a harsher punishment than the offense warrants.
Would I have applauded once the offending passenger was removed? Also, yes. Air travel is uncivil enough that I encourage anything the airlines do to make it more pleasant. "The test of a first-rate intelligence is the ability to keep two contradictory ideas in mind at the same time and still retain the ability to function." - F. Scott Fitzgerald I'll bet that every other passenger on that plane listened attentively and quietly to the safety announcements on their next flights! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif |
Originally posted by Beckles: [B] But what other punishment is there? How are you going to teach someone that the safety announcements are important? Is there anyone here who thinks that safety isn't important? [B] IMHO the FA was not only out of line, but needs training in how do deal with unruly passengers (or people in general). A simple, "Sir, I'm sorry but we can't take off until I complete the safety lecture" would probably have sufficed. [This message has been edited by freefaller12k (edited 01-09-2001).] |
freefaller, you are correct. In fact, safety announcements are proven to have little effect on safety when there is actually a problem. A recent decompression showed that very few people knew what to do with their oxygen masks despite all those safety announcements. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.
And svpii, as for my title being offensive, it was calculated to do just that. |
Do I just fly on strange routes, at strange times, or why do I notice that most Pax dont pay any attention to the FA? I myself was a little surprised by the FA since I have seen many people talk without consequence. I normally look up out of respect, but normally dont watch the briefing if they have it on video, just no point, as Stimpy mentioned its more of a formality than something that can save your life. That being said, what this guy did was very rude and unjustified, but shouldnt be blown out of proportion just because he did it during the safety anouncement.
|
In my opinion, the safety briefing is only slightly more valuable than the "security" questions asked at check-in. Both are intended to comfort people but actually accomplish little or nothing. They merely waste the time of frequent travelers like most of us on this board. (That's not to suggest that MY time is particularly valuable; it isn't, but I still don't like to waste it.)
Bruce |
That flight attendant can take her safety announcement and shove it in her vomit bag.
I have had enough of flight attendants "here primarily for (my) safety." Give me a flight attendant primarily dedicated to providing a truly first class service, with safety in mind. Safety is important, don't get me wrong, but it serves as an excuse for poor service far too often. I do my best to respect the flight attendant, I hope (s)he will do the best to keep me comfortable and safe. |
I ignore this safety announcement, and the others that are generically canned and repititous. Thankfully, the newspapers are handed out ahead of time.
Then again.....I do not talk loudly either, which IMO is rude when done during the FA's breifing. Crude.....but not criminal. |
It is law, so they all do it, and will continue doing it, but I guess most of us agree it is a bit boring after the first few 100 times. In Australia (and I am sure the USA and some other countries) all cigarette packages have here HUGE writing on them by law saying
SMOKING CAUSES CANCER Smoking KILLS Smoking Causes Birth Defects etc, etc. Has had little or not effect on those who smoke. ( I dont') but does illustrate how we get numb to ANY message if you see it/hear it often enough. ------------------ ~ Glen ~ |
I almost ALWAYS listen to the in-flight safety announcements. (Except when I"m so tired I fall asleep.) I may have heard them a gazillon times but there's always going to be the time when there's a problem and I want to remember what to do.
I also hate it when people get chatty during the in flight safety announcements. I had a chatty seatmate, laced with alcohol, who did not shut up. The Male F-A came over and badgered the both of us. I told the guy if he would be quiet I would get him the drink of his choice when we landed and I would save his life if there was a plane problem. (He had a Jim Beam which I tried and made me nautious.) Good point Beckles and yes PremEx he was an idiot. Legal Eagle KOKO: thanks for the info on the law. There may be a "Pink" article in this. If the safety announcements are boring maybe they should get a bunch of us Flyertalkers together and we can do an flight safety video (It can even be humorous!) |
Fly Westjet in Canada and you will hear humorous safety announcements. First time I flew them, I had tears in my eyes laughing so hard.
|
I'll usually listen attentively to the announcements, make eye-contact with the FA, smile and even nod from time to time. It's called being polite. And it's the first step in the type of relationship-building with the FA's that net thank-you gifts from time to time.
OTOH, sometimes I do sleep, read or tune out. But certainly I'd never be so rude as to talk so loudly that I interfered with the FA's legal obligation to orally brief the passengers. On the one hand, I say again that the FA overreacted. And on the other, sometimes it is nice to see rudeness punished in the extreme... Jeez, it sure is uncomfortable sitting on this fence http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif. |
I find it extremely rude for the cabin crew to tell me to "cease all conversation and put down all reading material" while they recite their safety briefing. The odds of surviving a plane crash just because of some gem of information you gleaned from an oral briefing are next to zero. Some of these flight attendants really do take themselves far too seriously. The public would be much better served by having a well-trained bartender on board and some sweet vermouth and marachino cherries to make a decent Manhattan.
|
It all comes down to respect, and how we should, and are suppose to, treat one another.
Preventing a Flight Crew Member from performing his/her duties is a Federal offense. As a Flight Attendant, it is my responsibility to make sure each passenger hears the safety announcements. Let us not assume all passengers are as well traveled as you. Too, if a passenger is going to give me problems prior to take-off, I surely do not want him/her locked in a plane with me. If something were to go wrong, I need all of the cooperation and help I can get, and I need to know to whom I can count on if I am unable perform my duties. Being a Flight Attendant is not as it use to be. Somewhere along the way, we have lost compassion and respect for another human being. |
TransWorldOne expressed my sentiments precisely:
I have had enough of flight attendants "here primarily for (my) safety." Give me a flight attendant primarily dedicated to providing a truly first class service, with safety in mind. Safety is important, don't get me wrong, but it serves as an excuse for poor service far too often. I do my best to respect the flight attendant, I hope (s)he will do the best to keep me comfortable and safe. Flight attendants are generally nice people and I try to respect everyone -- at least initially -- but let's not delude ourselves (or let them delude us) about their safety role. First, safety issues almost never arise, because probably 99.9% of flights are incident-free. Second, when safety issues do arise, FAs have been known to fall short of expectations. Third, when things really go wrong on an airplane, NOBODY is going to save you! I'm sure that FAs feel better about their jobs when they cite their "safety" responsibilties, but I'm not impressed. Likewise, I'm not impressed by the ridiculous "security" questions asked at check-in, which collectively waste more time than anything else I can think of at the moment (including waiting at red lights on empty suburban streets at 5 a.m., another of my pet peeves). Bruce |
Sorry, I'm not comfortable leaving this broad-brush slur unchallenged:
Originally posted by bdschobel: Flight attendants are generally nice people and I try to respect everyone -- at least initially -- but let's not delude ourselves .... when safety issues do arise, FAs have been known to fall short of expectations. And then it also comes down to a matter of respect for people. Every frequent flyer knows that FAs are required to give the safety demo, and they have given that demo far more times than even the 3-gazillion-mile-a-year flyer has heard the demo. It is sad indeed that some find it so burdensome to shut their traps for those 45-60 seconds and allow the FAs to do their assigned tasks. |
OK folks - It is five minutes out of your life that may save your life and someone elses in the case of a survivable incident such as fire, runway collision, pig stampede and the like. We all know how to buckle our seat belts, not smoke but we don't always know where the BEST exit is. Use this time to take a look around. See how you fit in with the other passengers (amount and type) in relationship to the exit and when you've got that figured out plan an alternative. Be quiet, be respectful and be aware. Hope the other guy is doing the same so you don't fumble over each other in case of an emergency.
Awareness, knowledge and PRACTICE saves lives - ask any cop or fireman. I've seen the results of people not using these skills and it ain't nice. This goes for hotels also. You need to know 2 exits and how to get there in the dark on your stomach because ladders don't reach that far. FA's serve an essential safety role. FOr those new to flying it provides information and practice and for those on their 5th mileage run this year it provides a reminder to be aware. Good luck and safe travels. Dick |
| All times are GMT -6. The time now is 4:02 am. |
This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2026 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.