egtravel

I will be traveling to Italy from LAX via AMS on KLM 03Sept and return from FCO to LAX via DTW on NW on 11Sept. I have never flown either of these airlines and so far have not heard good things. Can anyone tell me their experiences so I can be prepared for what may happen?? I will be in economy class...for instance, how are the seats on KLM (747) and Northwest (DC10)?? One more thing, I was told by a NW agent that I can't reserve seats for the KLM portion from AMS to FCO, does any one know...is this true??? Thanks!

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Erik

[This message has been edited by egtravel (edited 08-08-2000).]

[This message has been edited by egtravel (edited 08-09-2000).]

Vulcan

I've been in both KLM and NW to Europe from the US and like all coach seats, they are uncomfortable. I think the KLM were a little better, but that may be because the plane was a 747.

doc

Definitely KLM - Before they hooked up with NWA, they were pretty darn good!

Warrenlm

NW DC-10 coach seats are pretty narrow and the pitch is also pretty tight. Try for a bulkhead seat if you can't get the exit row. I think the bulkhead row aft of the break in the middle of coach has the most legroom.

mcrt

If you buy your ticket for an airline based on the plane you want to fly, make sure you are really flying that airline. A couple of years ago I was going SEA to AMS. When I booked my ticket I went with KLM instead of NW because it was $100 cheaper. The ticket was on the same plane, with NW colors and a smaller KLM logo near the tail.

Merry

I am sorry but I can't resist, on European routes KLM is dreadful, the service is cheap, the aircraft are old and the whole service is geared towards the low end market.

Luckily it has been a long time since I have had to travel KLM transatlantic, so I won't comment on that.

Nick

monitor

Most of the KLM service in Europe from AMS is run by the Cityhopper. Their planes of choice are Fokker 50s or 70s one class which range in comfort somewhere around the NW ARJs. There is however a bit more food service than one would get on a comparable domestic flight. I can't speak for the coach seats on the NW DC-10s but I would not expect anything out of the ordinary because the World Business Class comfort and service is quite inferior to CO Business First.

lonman

actually, most of my intra-european flights on kl have been on 737s. here you should strive to get a seat before row 15. it seems most of the planes were configured with biz class seats with a 2-3 configuration through row 14. where biz class ends, and coach begins seems to be flexible on those planes, so the front passengers in coach get some extra room. after row 15, the config is the smaller 3-3 with standard coach seats. i'm nw gold and usually get booked in the front seats regularly.

and they are correct in saying while the cuisine wihin europe isn't incredible in coach, it is clearly more than you get on a domestic flight. also, wine and beer are usually complimentary, something that clearly doesn't exist domestically, except for on the dl and us shuttle.

fastflyer

As for the NW DC-10, even the business seats leave quite a bit to be desired. And the service that I had in this combined business-first product was less desirable then the KLM transoceanic business experience.

NickB

I have consistently had my worse transatlantic experiences in coach on NW: unpleasant DC10s, stodgy food, surly F/As, etc... KL is nothing to write home about but passable (BA or VS are much better)

Monitor: only a handful of intra-European KL destinations are handled by Cityhopper (KLC). Mostly, it is KL itself and the a/c is almost invariably a B737. AMS-FCO is definitely KL rather than KLC. As Lonman states, the first few rows of the coach cabin often have a biz class configuration. However, these are allocated in priority to elite FF members of KL and partners and full fare Y passengers.

And no, you cannot get seat pre-allocation on KL's intra-European flights (even when you are in the top tier of their FFP). This being said, as you will be checking in LAX well before most of the other (Europe-originating) passengers on the AMS-FCO flight, you should have a pretty good choice of seats, although the first few rows of the cabin may not be available to you, depending on the number of elite FFP members and full fare pax expected on the flight.

afang

what is AMS? I flew NW alot to Asia in Eco class, I had no feeling towards the service. The service was neither surperb nor below par. I try to collect as many NW miles as I can because of my frequent going back to Asia.

doc

AMS=Amsterdam

Asian NWA/KLM TP inflight services, have been significantly better than TA, IMHO.

ROADRUNNER

I flew NW and KLM to AMS and found NW to be better in 1st by a small margin, that gets magnified the longer you fly.

The age of the equipemnet determines my comfort level to a degree. The newer the better the flight.