I’m sure Fred will get caught, but how?
May 31, 2023, 3:03 am
#16
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E2-EU1-US without a stopover in EU1? The airline at E2 check-in will ask for a passport, as even a national ID DL won’t typically fly to get checked in to fly to the US. And getting short-checked? Well, I wouldn’t count on that reliably working even if the cover story were to be that of picking up the passport at the intercontinental gateway airport for the flight to the US.
There are ways for this kind of scam to be pulled off and even pulled off consistently, but it requires not only more details to be considered and prepared; it also requires limiting participation to a particular combination of people that aren’t all that common and commonly reliable. Fred1 seems to be in for the thrill of a gamble and may perhaps even find out that there ends up being a furious Fred2 wanting payback from Fred1 or willing to try to hang Fred1 out to dry.
May 31, 2023, 6:19 am
#17
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Western Europe
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Play stupid games, win stupid prices. In this case, a cancellation of flights and possible fraud charges.
Seems to me that the root cause of Fred's predicament is that he's chosen to work for a cheap employer, who has a sucky travel policy. That means we have 3 plausible solutions:
1: Suck it up
2: Change role within the organisation to one which doesn't require travel
3: Upgrade to a employer with a decent travel policy
Seems to me that the root cause of Fred's predicament is that he's chosen to work for a cheap employer, who has a sucky travel policy. That means we have 3 plausible solutions:
1: Suck it up
2: Change role within the organisation to one which doesn't require travel
3: Upgrade to a employer with a decent travel policy
May 31, 2023, 7:24 am
#18
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Beside starting off wrong, something will eventually go more wrong if doing this time and again.
Fred1 could perhaps just seek out approval to do a long connection in EU1 and then a connection or stop in EU2 and/or EU1 in one or both directions and see if that works for whichever party is providing the OPM cover for the work trips — all without the problems of even considering a Fred2.
Last edited by GUWonder; May 31, 2023 at 7:34 am
May 31, 2023, 7:38 am
#20
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Not for EU1-EU2 within Schengen. I’ve gone landside to airside at several EU airports this month for intra-Schengen flights. Neither airline workers nor airport security screeners at the airports cross-checked the birthdate on my passports with any birthdate info in the PNRs.
May 31, 2023, 7:38 am
#21
Join Date: Dec 2004
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(all that aside-- cool FT handle, Sheikh!)
May 31, 2023, 7:47 am
#22
Join Date: Jul 2022
Location: Madrid
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I have a sort-of friend who has an EU passport but lives in North America. Let’s call him Fred Smith. Fred has to travel for work to an EU city in the Schengen zone with a major airline hub,. If the flight is overnight, over a certain number of hours, and below a threshold cost he can fly in business class. Due to the timing only a direct flight will do and it seems that this has pushed the cost over the threshold. He recently read a news article on skiplagging and found a flight from his nearest North American airport (let’s call this NAX) and a second EU airport in the Schengen zone (EU2) via the city he needs to be in (EU1) that saved over $1000 and thought it would be a good idea until he realised his return ticket would be cancelled when he didn’t board EU1-EU2.
Clever ruse ensues… he joins a Facebook group called ‘Fred Smiths of the World United’ and posts asking “Does anyone want to fly between EU1 and EU2 on these specific flights for free?” Another Fred Smith accepts and has the ruse fully explained. Fred1 will check in with hand luggage only and fly NAX-EU1. Fred2 uses the online boarding pass to get through to airside (also only hand luggage) after Fred1’s flight has landed. The Freds meet airside in the terminal for a coffee before Fred1 leaves to go to work. Fred2 flies to EU2 for a few days, then boards EU2 to EU1 where the transaction is reversed. Fred1 is convinced he has stumbled onto a spectacular hack.
Both Fred’s are of a similar age but noticeably dissimilar in appearance. They have different middle names and dates of birth. They are convinced that as long as the first and last names on the BP’s match their own passports then no one will check any further. I am convinced they will get caught and face some relatively serious consequences, although I cannot pinpoint exactly how they will get caught.
They're getting caught and going to jail, right?
Clever ruse ensues… he joins a Facebook group called ‘Fred Smiths of the World United’ and posts asking “Does anyone want to fly between EU1 and EU2 on these specific flights for free?” Another Fred Smith accepts and has the ruse fully explained. Fred1 will check in with hand luggage only and fly NAX-EU1. Fred2 uses the online boarding pass to get through to airside (also only hand luggage) after Fred1’s flight has landed. The Freds meet airside in the terminal for a coffee before Fred1 leaves to go to work. Fred2 flies to EU2 for a few days, then boards EU2 to EU1 where the transaction is reversed. Fred1 is convinced he has stumbled onto a spectacular hack.
Both Fred’s are of a similar age but noticeably dissimilar in appearance. They have different middle names and dates of birth. They are convinced that as long as the first and last names on the BP’s match their own passports then no one will check any further. I am convinced they will get caught and face some relatively serious consequences, although I cannot pinpoint exactly how they will get caught.
They're getting caught and going to jail, right?
May 31, 2023, 7:57 am
#24
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Check-in/boarding at E2 could be a show-stopper because the airline thru-checking from EU1 to the US will generally want to validate for transport and admissibility to the US using the passport details. But if the boarding pass for EU2-EU1 pops out with online check-in giving a boarding pass usable for boarding based on the stored passport info for Fred1, then the gate agents in EU2 would generally not be aware that the passport (if any) used to board EU2-EU1 isn’t a match for what’s in the PNR.
Here is another risk with this Fred scam: if Fred2’s cabin baggage ends up becoming checked in luggage for whatever reason (albeit less likely in business class), then it may well end up headed to the US. Does Fred1 really want to be responsible for Fred2’s items showing up in the US and subject to CBP rules and consequences?
F2 possessing and using F1’s passport in F1’s absence is a direct recipe for trouble. Also, they don’t even look alike.
Perhaps Fred1’s employer will get around to consider firing Fred1 for the bad judgment of even considering such a hare-brained, problematic scheme and drafting in others for participation on the employer’s dime.
Here is another risk with this Fred scam: if Fred2’s cabin baggage ends up becoming checked in luggage for whatever reason (albeit less likely in business class), then it may well end up headed to the US. Does Fred1 really want to be responsible for Fred2’s items showing up in the US and subject to CBP rules and consequences?
Why should the Freds meet airside? Fred1 arrives in EU1, uses his EU passport to enter Schengen zone, then goes landside. Meets Fred2 landside and F1 gives F2 his passport. F2 flies to EU2, on return F2 has to check in using F1's passport though, then flies back to EU1 and goes landside, meets F1 and gives his passport back, F1 goes back airside....
Perhaps Fred1’s employer will get around to consider firing Fred1 for the bad judgment of even considering such a hare-brained, problematic scheme and drafting in others for participation on the employer’s dime.
Last edited by GUWonder; May 31, 2023 at 8:11 am
May 31, 2023, 8:27 am
#26
Join Date: Jul 2022
Location: Madrid
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Check-in/boarding at E2 could be a show-stopper because the airline thru-checking from EU1 to the US will generally want to validate for transport and admissibility to the US using the passport details. But if the boarding pass for EU2-EU1 pops out with online check-in giving a boarding pass usable for boarding based on the stored passport info for Fred1, then the gate agents in EU2 would generally not be aware that the passport (if any) used to board EU2-EU1 isn’t a match for what’s in the PNR.
Here is another risk with this Fred scam: if Fred2’s cabin baggage ends up becoming checked in luggage for whatever reason (albeit less likely in business class), then it may well end up headed to the US. Does Fred1 really want to be responsible for Fred2’s items showing up in the US and subject to CBP rules and consequences?
F2 possessing and using F1’s passport in F1’s absence is a direct recipe for trouble. Also, they don’t even look alike.
Perhaps Fred1’s employer will get around to consider firing Fred1 for the bad judgment of even considering such a hare-brained, problematic scheme and drafting in others for participation on the employer’s dime.
Here is another risk with this Fred scam: if Fred2’s cabin baggage ends up becoming checked in luggage for whatever reason (albeit less likely in business class), then it may well end up headed to the US. Does Fred1 really want to be responsible for Fred2’s items showing up in the US and subject to CBP rules and consequences?
F2 possessing and using F1’s passport in F1’s absence is a direct recipe for trouble. Also, they don’t even look alike.
Perhaps Fred1’s employer will get around to consider firing Fred1 for the bad judgment of even considering such a hare-brained, problematic scheme and drafting in others for participation on the employer’s dime.
May 31, 2023, 8:36 am
#27
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Schengen-DUB-US on common carrier flights involves showing the passport to airline agents in the Schengen zone when flying from Schengen to Ireland. Also, there is also Schengen government passport control/national ID check to exit Schengen on a Schengen-Ireland flight.
May 31, 2023, 8:42 am
#29
Join Date: Jul 2022
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Yes, typically.
Schengen-DUB-US on common carrier flights involves showing the passport to airline agents in the Schengen zone when flying from Schengen to Ireland. Also, there is also Schengen government passport control/national ID check to exit Schengen on a Schengen-Ireland flight.
Schengen-DUB-US on common carrier flights involves showing the passport to airline agents in the Schengen zone when flying from Schengen to Ireland. Also, there is also Schengen government passport control/national ID check to exit Schengen on a Schengen-Ireland flight.