So for those who see this as an absolute no-no right now, what would be an acceptable time to do smth "non-essential" like this?

There will not be a single switch, risks will remain, lockdowns and safety measures will vary so it's gonna be be up to individual judgement on when this is acceptable...
not making any calls here but IMO the risks right now are FAR lower than back in february or early march given that ppl are scared, spent a lot of time in lockdown and take common sense precautions..

There is minimal to no risk to others if OP flies out of lockdown (not infected/carrier after staying home) so the risk of spread is really catching it on the way and then after a few days potentially infecting others.. personally if need to get out i'd probably stick to driving trips until mid may just to see how things play out but ymmv

as someone who takes over 100 flights a year & stays over 150 nights a year in hotels, i still agree with the majority of posters here....this is not the right time to travel....i was in nyc & paris last month & got back to india on the 11th of march....just before the who declared this a pandemic....i decided to self quarantine for 2 weeks because i didn't want to risk infecting my wife & kids....i stayed in the guest bedroom & worked from home....

about 3 days after i returned home i started feeling a little unwell....i developed a sore throat & a cough, followed by a headache & body ache....i tried to get myself tested but was not successful....i called the helpline set up by the government a bunch of times but they refused to test me since i didn't develop a fever....the symptoms persisted for about a week & i started feeling better after that....my symptoms were completely gone in about 12 days time....i gave it another 5 days before ending my self imposed exile from the rest of my house....by this time india had gone under lockdown so i was once again stuck at home, but at least i was not confined to one room anymore....

i'm now waiting for the antibody test to be widely available....i can go to one of the clinics set up by the government where i can get tested for free but i don't want to risk venturing outside right now....there are a number of private labs that will begin offering the test by the end of the month & they offer a service where they come home to draw your blood for the test....i'll have to pay to get this done but i feel its completely worth it....i'm pretty convinced i've already had covid-19 & will get a positive antibody result....if this happens then i can start venturing out of my house without fear once this lockdown ends....i still don't think i want to start traveling anytime soon....

As for as DL goes employees did have the option to take leave for up to a year with benefits. Most states (every hub at a minimum) will also give unemployement for at least part of that time. So a lot of them do have a choice for now. Not so much for hotel works or anyone else but at least DL is giving options.

That said, my early May trips have been nixed which is unfortunate because I had Brazil, Argentina, Vegas, Phoenix all planned in the first 2 weeks with another trip to Phoenix later in the month. I'm hoping for a resumption late in May or maybe early June if things start to open up. A lot of states do have quarantines for out of state travelers and the ones that have announced steps to reopening have travel several steps down the road for when that can resume. Idaho for example (assuming things stay on track) will allow it in the third step which will be at the very end of May. And they're near the bottom for infections so other states will be behind them.

It's killing me staying home as well since I traveled 2-3 times per month with 1 of those trips being to Vegas which helps me keep my sanity. But, for the next month I'm holding off assuming nothing changes. Prices will still be cheap for a while. And while I wouldn't mind even holing up in a hotel/house in some other city, it's probably not the best idea. Hopefully in a months time things will be reopening and travel can start to resume. For now I'll just use the free time to work on things around the house.

I think you are in your own echo chamber. Transpose your ‘I’ll do what I want’ to those actions leading to the death of a friend or relative.

No, wrong all around. Non essential travel/congregation is just that. The risks are no lower than they were in March. I don’t know why this is so difficult to understand.

I am not putting words in your mouth. Your direct quote was "Except that is precisely what we are going by preventing unnecessary contact and good hygiene. If the virus has nowhere to go, it eventually dies out. If patient zero (assuming there was only one) had gone home and isolated for a month, there would have been no spread."

Then you literally just said above, in reply to us all staying home "not giving the virus the opportunity to infect multiple other people, it will eventually die out"

Perhaps I am misunderstanding what you believe an acceptable outcome would be here for folks to leave their house. If we both agree the virus is not going to "die out" and that most of us will get it and that the heathcare system in 99.9% of our country has plenty of excess capacity ...when should we be allowed to leave our houses?

You completely misconstrued my quote. My point was not that I didn't care about extra deaths and that we shouldn't try to stop them...it is that it is inevitable that these deaths will occur! Flattening the curve means the same number of people get it spread over more time! Anyone who understands basic statistics or calculus should understand this. Flattening the curve was meant to ensure our heathcare system had the capacity to deal with the disease. In a vast majority of the country, they can easily handle an immediate soft reopening.

Here is my full quote:

"For the third time, in my city, 100 people have been admitted to the hospital for the 'Rona over the past five weeks and we have over 6200 hospital beds. How is this politically motivated? Where is the dire problem with heathcare? Despite what the media shows you, this non-headline grabbing math applies to a very vast majority of the county. A soft reopening as we control the "fresh eruptions and deaths" is what we need to do. Deaths will occur. That is because of the disease, not politics. Unless people want to live off of the grid, grow their own food, forgo Amazon deliveries, and shun heathcare and seeing literally anyone for a few years in complete and utter social isolation...this virus will not go anywhere!

Plus, if you are concerned about the next 6 weeks of being locked in your appartment...try the next two years! The virus, like H1N1, the common cold Cornas, etc ..it is not going away!"

And that is the "other side's" point that you can't seem to understand. The risks are no lower than they were in March...nor will they ever be until we are all vaccinated in two years!

First of all stop calling it Rona. It suggests you don’t take this virus seriously, like it’s some kind of joke.

Next, understand that I didn’t say ‘stay at home, cowering in fear.’ What I said was that you should practice pretty obvious rules of distancing and hygiene. That does not include the totally pointless and economically negligible effect of a cross country trip in the name of ‘liberty and freedom.’

I had no idea that I would get this many responses to this. I really appreciate the feedback, and it gave me perspectives that I had not thought about.

A couple of points:

1. I am in the "at risk" group. I'm 65 years old and have an underlying medical condition. I would like to take a test to determine whether I am an asymptomatic carrier of COVID-19.
2. According to the executive orders of the governor of Virginia and the mayor of the District of Columbia, I am classified as an "essential worker", as I am an attorney whose practice is 100% devoted to representing clients in the telecommunications industry before the FCC in Washington (this has been my profession for the past 40 years); all my clients are located outside the DC area. Other than going to downtown DC on business, the grocery store, pharmacy and post office, I have observed the "stay at home" edict in effect around here.
3. If I go traveling, I would include a couple of visits to clients across the country who I rarely get to meet in person.
4. My trip involved flights with low loads: DCA-MSP shows an A319 with exactly 3 occupied seats in F and 8 occupied seats in Y (DL is not selling basic economy); on the MSP-SEA leg, using a 737-900, dl.com shows 11 F seats (out of 20) occupied and 36 Y seats occupied. I would actually look to sit near the back of the plane in a window seat (in addition to not selling middle seats, Delta is not selling the last two rows of coach), so I would be looking at the third or fourth row from the rear). I would have my own snacks and drinks on the flights so I wouldn't have to have contact with the FAs.
5. I had not thought about the possibility of infecting hotel workers. I could work around this by taking an aerobed in a checked bag, renting an SUV from Hertz, and sleeping in the back of the vehicle on my aerobed.
6. I would probably get a lot of supplies for the trip a Safeway in the Seattle area, thereby cutting down contact with multiple store personnel across the country. At fast food drive thrus, I would pay with a credit card, and my contact with staff there would be at a bare minimum. I observe social distancing in supermarkets right now; I really am conscious of staying out of other people's way. I use a drive thru window at the Walgreens where I get my prescriptions.

I'm not interested in contracting the COVID-19 virus, as it would probably kill me. However, I want to live my life, and do so in such a way that it does not inconvenience others more than is absolutely necessary. Going traveling is a way of supporting Delta at a time where it needs supporting. If we don't support Delta, its employees won't have their jobs for very much longer.

This statement is patronizing. Please don't try to excuse your risky behavior and desire for a personally enjoyable vacay with the idea that you are only doing it to be of service to others. And BTW, you buying a couple of DL tickets is not going to move the needle on whether DL survives. Only if you and millions of others start buying DL tickets will appreciable revenue be generated -- but then you won't be on flights with light loads anymore. You will be packed cheek-by-jowl with other ticket-buyers -- what do you think the risks are then?

The more details you provide, the worse this idea even sounds. Do. Not. Go. Now.

See where we are in another 2-3 weeks as either this thing is going to blow-up again in our face or we are going be in a better spot to adjust to what is feasible coming out of this.
There is the fact the government doesn't want people traveling like this, many of the people who you come across or towns you will pass through do not want you there, and you needless risk yourself and others in the process.

I'm in the wait a while camp. I don't think you've thought through what you'd do if something goes wrong - the flight is diverted, the car breaks down, etc. Also, most states right now have lockdowns in place, so even if your state doesn't you risk breaking the law in those that current have restrictions on non-essential travel in place, and the standard for this really isn't whether you could tax-deduct the lunch. Your proposed visits to clients expose both you and them and their families to the increased risk social isolation is in place to cut down. I think any reasonable person would say you could "visit" them via Zoom, Skype, or any one of a number of other video tools and accomplish what you need to even if it's not ideal. (Plus, there is the chance that the idea that you're going to randomly visit during a pandemic might make one or more of them decide to hire someone else. A lot of people are very touchy about these rules.)

Everyone I know wishes they could go somewhere. But they don't, because this isn't about freedom; it's about caring for your fellow human beings.

wg

probably a little too flippant, but it seems that the bottom-line issue is the extent to which you agree with Leonard Nimoy (Mr Spock):

"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few."

This thread has wandered way off-topic. Time to lock it up
Obscure2k
TravelBuzz Moderator