Travelling while brown - plane delay
#1
Original Poster


Join Date: Jul 2008
Programs: I am a lowly ant
Posts: 1,756
Travelling while brown - plane delay
This on the Jet2 flight from Malaga to Manchester:
http://www.manchestereveningnews.co....hester-7715938
http://www.manchestereveningnews.co....hester-7719592
"The man, described as in his early 30s and of African descent, took pictures of the plane and cabin crew before taking a selfie and snapping the phones SIM card. He then threw the SIM down the toilet.
Airport staff and Spanish police carried out security checks before letting him return to his seat an hour later."
http://www.manchestereveningnews.co....hester-7715938
http://www.manchestereveningnews.co....hester-7719592
"The man, described as in his early 30s and of African descent, took pictures of the plane and cabin crew before taking a selfie and snapping the phones SIM card. He then threw the SIM down the toilet.
Airport staff and Spanish police carried out security checks before letting him return to his seat an hour later."
#2
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: May 2002
Location: Pittsburgh
Programs: MR LT Titanium, AA LT PLT, UA SLV, Avis PreferredPlus, HH Gold, Hertz PC, National Executive, etc.
Posts: 31,677
His color is mentioned once in the two stories combined, 6 paragraphs in below two photos.
And you make it the key point? Not the fact that he was led off in handcuffs and there was "a scuffle" on the plane during boarding?
And you make it the key point? Not the fact that he was led off in handcuffs and there was "a scuffle" on the plane during boarding?
#3
Original Poster


Join Date: Jul 2008
Programs: I am a lowly ant
Posts: 1,756
Well there is little more than innuendo in there TBH. Basically he took some photos, as FlyerTalk members often do, people were nervous of his behaviour and the police were called, he was then cleared to fly, and some of his passengers decided to get off (delaying the flight further, presumably, while their luggage was unloaded).
#4


Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: SMF
Programs: Hilton Diamond-Marriott Platinum-life
Posts: 1,015
Which is a region not a color, just as if it was stated he was North American. does that define a color for someone's skin?(besides why does that matter??)
#5
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Bangkok or San Francisco
Programs: United 1k, Marriott Lifetime PE, Former DL Gold, Former SQ Solitaire, HH Gold
Posts: 11,889
No where in the two articles posted by OP does it describe the passenger as "brown" it states he is "African descent"
Which is a region not a color, just as if it was stated he was North American. does that define a color for someone's skin?(besides why does that matter??)
Which is a region not a color, just as if it was stated he was North American. does that define a color for someone's skin?(besides why does that matter??)
#6
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,077
Denying the existence of racism where it is? That won't make it go away, as much as the advocates of racist profiling want to deny (or distract from) racism as a factor.
^^ for the pilot of this flight.
Last edited by GUWonder; Sep 5, 2014 at 8:40 am
#7


Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: East Anglia UK
Programs: BA-S UA LH-Sen KLM/AF-Plat.
Posts: 1,701
Why is it so wrong to give his origin? It's a fact, just as they gave his age and gender. We could go on about gender bias or ageism. As has been said above describing him this way is not racism, racism is what others, who want to, use it to try and make some sort of point that isn't actually there. Don't think we're all tarred with the same brush (and that's not racist either)
#8
Original Poster


Join Date: Jul 2008
Programs: I am a lowly ant
Posts: 1,756
A few points here:
* the description of the passenger as being of 'African descent' is in fact a racial description, the key point being 'descent' - a white South African would typically be described as being of European descent, for example
* this is a budget airline on a flight to a bucket + spade destination where people go to eat British food and drink beer in sunshine. Not exactly a cosmpolitan clientele.
* idiot passengers on this exact same route, also on a budget flight, in 2006, caused two men to be ejected from the flight for the crime of speaking apparently-Arabic(it might not have actually BEEN Arabic), the fifth-most spoken language in the world http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...s-removed.html
* police specifically investigated and the man was allowed to fly, he had also been pre-screened at the airport, authorities in this age are not renowned for being reckless about allowing dangerous passengers to fly
* my view is that the passengers would not have reacted this way if the passenger had fitted the appearance of the typical passenger on this flight - i.e. white and sun-burned.
* the description of the passenger as being of 'African descent' is in fact a racial description, the key point being 'descent' - a white South African would typically be described as being of European descent, for example
* this is a budget airline on a flight to a bucket + spade destination where people go to eat British food and drink beer in sunshine. Not exactly a cosmpolitan clientele.
* idiot passengers on this exact same route, also on a budget flight, in 2006, caused two men to be ejected from the flight for the crime of speaking apparently-Arabic(it might not have actually BEEN Arabic), the fifth-most spoken language in the world http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...s-removed.html
* police specifically investigated and the man was allowed to fly, he had also been pre-screened at the airport, authorities in this age are not renowned for being reckless about allowing dangerous passengers to fly
* my view is that the passengers would not have reacted this way if the passenger had fitted the appearance of the typical passenger on this flight - i.e. white and sun-burned.
#9
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,077
The hysterical, racist passengers and reportedly at least one hysterical flight attendant need to consider hiring a private plane or not flying if the sight of a "scary" "brown or black" man in such circumstances catches their imagination's paranoid fantasies about who knows what and makes them go bat crazy in the metal cave.
#10
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Bangkok or San Francisco
Programs: United 1k, Marriott Lifetime PE, Former DL Gold, Former SQ Solitaire, HH Gold
Posts: 11,889
Indeed. And it's a well-justified view.
The hysterical, racist passengers and reportedly at least one hysterical flight attendant need to consider hiring a private plane or not flying if the sight of a "scary" "brown or black" man in such circumstances catches their imagination's paranoid fantasies about who knows what and makes them go bat crazy in the metal cave.
The hysterical, racist passengers and reportedly at least one hysterical flight attendant need to consider hiring a private plane or not flying if the sight of a "scary" "brown or black" man in such circumstances catches their imagination's paranoid fantasies about who knows what and makes them go bat crazy in the metal cave.
#11
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,077
He was released and cleared to fly. That is primary to whipped up claims about "behavior". Do you really believe a seventeen year old girl of only ethnic European appearance in the same circumstances as this guy would have had the same passengers and crew freaking out? If anyone does, I hope they don't go broke picking up their title paperwork for the Brooklyn Bridge.
#12
Original Poster


Join Date: Jul 2008
Programs: I am a lowly ant
Posts: 1,756
He was removed in handcuffs because of the behaviour of other passengers freaking out. That's just SOP, when other people accuse you of something. If he had done anything en he would not have been allowed to reboard the flight. Airlines generally have no compunction about kicking disruptive pax off flights. The fact he WASNT kicked off, suggests he did nothing wrong.
#13




Join Date: May 2009
Location: South Park, CO
Programs: Tegridy Elite
Posts: 5,677
Indeed. And it's a well-justified view.
The hysterical, racist passengers and reportedly at least one hysterical flight attendant need to consider hiring a private plane or not flying if the sight of a "scary" "brown or black" man in such circumstances catches their imagination's paranoid fantasies about who knows what and makes them go bat crazy in the metal cave.
The hysterical, racist passengers and reportedly at least one hysterical flight attendant need to consider hiring a private plane or not flying if the sight of a "scary" "brown or black" man in such circumstances catches their imagination's paranoid fantasies about who knows what and makes them go bat crazy in the metal cave.
Calling others racist without any proof of such is ridiculous and presumptuous. As is the title of this thread.
#14
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Bangkok or San Francisco
Programs: United 1k, Marriott Lifetime PE, Former DL Gold, Former SQ Solitaire, HH Gold
Posts: 11,889
You have no basis to conclude that the passengers who left did so wholly or partly over racism. Could it have been (a/the) reason? Possibly, but we don't have any proof of that. They might have also left due to the disruptive incident itself, or the airline's poor handling of it. But absent being able to read those passengers' minds, or a statement by the passengers explaining their deplaning was due to the man's race, none of us knows what was inside any of their heads.
Calling others racist without any proof of such is ridiculous and presumptuous. As is the title of this thread.
Calling others racist without any proof of such is ridiculous and presumptuous. As is the title of this thread.
#15
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,077
You have no basis to conclude that the passengers who left did so wholly or partly over racism. Could it have been (a/the) reason? Possibly, but we don't have any proof of that. They might have also left due to the disruptive incident itself, or the airline's poor handling of it. But absent being able to read those passengers' minds, or a statement by the passengers explaining their deplaning was due to the man's race, none of us knows what was inside any of their heads.
Calling others racist without any proof of such is ridiculous and presumptuous. As is the title of this thread.
Calling others racist without any proof of such is ridiculous and presumptuous. As is the title of this thread.
"People who want to justify racist profiling or who want to deny racist profiling as an involved factor will believe what they wish."

