Boy, if any service professional anywhere figures out who you are, you better sniff your drinks for added bodily fluids. What an awful attitude. Like insisting on attending Ascot in spandex and a wifebeater because you think dressing up is stupid.

And it's funny how disconnected from reality that underlying notion has become - here an author/waiter claims (with studies to back him up) that tipping is often uncorrelated with quality of service, having more to do with how well the waiter reads the customer and how the customer wants to be treated (whether with friendliness, aloofness, sarcasm, etc.). Certainly if service had much to do with it, the diner near my house (slogan proudly emblazoned on the servers' shirts: "Service With A F* Y*") wouldn't still be in business, let alone thriving

At this point I basically think of it as another example of the "unbundling" craze. The restaurant bill pays for the establishment's food and expenses, tip pays for service, and only for truly atrocious service would I consider stiffing the server. If I don't want to pay for table service, I'll find a place that offers counter service or eat at home. It's really not that hard to figure out.

It doesn't seem like it was that long ago, but here's a thread that's basically the same content.

Avoiding tipping in the U.S. - altogether!

I wholeheartedly agree! Having read some of the horrifyingly low wages some are paid, and a notion of the balance of actual wage to tips of overall income, for me it would seem logical to shift the balance heavily over to a standard higher minimum wage thereby tips being seen as a bonus for quality service. I would also feel less guilty for not tipping when service/food is of a poor quality knowing now that tax is paid on estimated tips.
Am i the only one who thinks this is logical?

Goodnight...Peter

I can't say that anyone fiercely defends the tipping culture. I certainly don't. I would much prefer a system where workers get paid a decent wage and the full price, including goods and service, were on the price list. Fantastic. Great. Wonderful.

HOWEVER, it is simply not that way in most parts of the United States, especially in travel-related industries. In certain areas, people rely on tips as a good share of their income, and denying tips under the theory that "it should be different" does nothing more than make the non-tipping customer look like a big jerk, and impoverish the individual performing the service.

Another consequence is poor service when you return to the establishment. "Oh, look, here comes Mr Big Shot. Let's stick him at the table next to the restroom. No tip from him, so will send over our least experienced trainee waiter." If you justify stiffing the tip on the grounds that "back home we don't do that", you can guarantee that your compatriots will end up at that restroom adjacent table with the trainee waiter.

As I said before, I don't care if you think it's wrong. I don't care if you think our tipping system is stupid. You come to America, tip like Americans.

We have to do it your way when we are there. Do it our way when you are here.

I avoid tipping by living in Asia!

I strongly dislike the tipping system in the US.

Ah, ha, I just thought of a good example. Grocery bagging.

In the US, grocery store employees bag the customer's groceries. (Excepting cut-rate grocery stores.)

In Europe, customers bag their own groceries.

When I visit my neighborhood Vons or Ralphs, I stand there and let the baggers bag my groceries, thank them pleasantly and go on my way.

When I go to Europe and visit a Real or Sainsbury or LeClerc, I grab a bag and bag my own groceries, with a pleasant expression on my face. I thank the clerk after getting my change, grab my bags, and go on my way.

I don't stand there demanding a grocery store employee bag my groceries because THAT'S THE WAY WE DO IT IN AMERICA AND OUR WAY OF GROCERY BAGGING IS FAR SUPERIOR TO YOUR WAY OF GROCERY BAGGING. If I did that, I would be a big jerk.

Similarly, I would consider someone to be a big jerk if they stiffed a tip in an establishment in America where tipping is usual, customary and expected as part of the employee's compensation, citing the European (or Australian or Japanese or whatever) system as superior.

Peter, here is what I do. If the service or the food is of such poor quality that I would not want to leave a tip, I ask to see the manager. I explain to the manager, face-to-face what my problem is. I take the attitude that the manager would want to know if the food or service is of poor quality and that I am actually doing them a favor by taking the time to inform them.

In most cases, the manager thanks me for bringing the problem to their attention. Occasionally, they might comp my entire bill, or give me a coupon for a future meal in hopes of bringing me back and proving to me the bad service or food was a one-time abberation.

In no case do I slink off into the night leaving no tip. I put on my big girl panties, inform management of the problem, then leave with my head held high.

This is actually rare. Sitting here, I can only think of a handful of times, in my 56 years, this has been necessary. My husband worked his way through college as a bus boy and take tipping very seriously.

Much as I'd prefer to simply pay (more, if necessary) for the food/drink, and not be subject to 'expected' tipping, I adopt a "When in Rome" attitude to these things and adopt the local customs, including tipping for certain services (bar, restaurant, taxi etc.) when in other countries where it exists (and probably erring on the generous side if unsure of the amount).

I did have one experience I didn't like. I know tipping of hotel housekeeping staff does happen (I have no idea how common, or in which countries, or how expected the practice is) but it is not something I have ever done - it simply AFAIK does not happen here in Oz. Was not an issue anywhere on my 9 week RTW trip, till I checked in to a hotel in Anchorage and discovered an envelope beside my bed with a typed message exhorting me to put money in it for the housekeeping staff "because they do a great job" or something like that.

I found that quite offensive (I certainly did not accede to the request/demand), almost akin to a beggar approaching me in the street. Is tipping of housekeeping staff a common practice? Is it universally expected in the US? Reading the envelope did leave a dirty taste in my mouth (no, I didn't lick it ).

As far as I know tipping of housekeeping staff doesn't happen in Australia. You pay a price to the hotel for accomodation and that includes servicing of the accomodation, replacement of linens etc... so the need to tip these staff does confound me a bit.

Recently in Hong Kong I noticed large card left next to the bed with the name of the housekeeper on it, basically saying it had been his pleasure to service the room. First time I had ever seen one of these, and wondered if it was a prelude to a tip!

Just because the government can't calculate income accurately doesn't mean I the consumer have to take the fall. Now there are a variety of issues why tip income isn't accurately reported, but none of that has to do with me.

Didn't a revolution occur the last time Americans were unfairly taxed? (please take that as tongue-in-cheek)

I'm not American, but in America and Canada I realise I need to tip for anything above fast food. God knows how much to tip, seems like every region has different percentages. It would be immensely helpful if as part of the receipt a 'baseline' (i.e. what the government expects your average to be) tip recommendation is displayed. So I know "ok, bad service, halve that" or "nice job, double it".

Once again, would love to have a printed guideline on the receipt.

One can only hope that the IRS will not need to claw every dime of tax and allow calculations based purely on card payments where tax can be itemised.

That is ridiculous

I know this has been mentioned ad-infinitum but that's why in some countries the pay is not rock bottom (it's not great, but not rock bottom) and the incentive for performance is to keep your job. And yes, consistently good performers do get paid more (sometimes significantly more) than the average. All I want is a normal dining experience, if they server can't provide that then they should be fired.

Why would a restaurant owner allow a diner to receive poor service? Would the diner not visit the establishment again? (here's a hint, I avoid several places for bad service and I know I'm not the only one).

Can you imagine how the owner must feel if he lost a big-spending, lousing-tipping customer because the customer never tips servers (or always undertips), and finally the servers gave them terrible service for that and so he will never return. The restaurant owner has vested interested in keeping customers happy too. So part of the job description of any employee should be to keep the customer happy.

The counter-argument to this is that it's a free country, and if a owner did see value in such an approach they would do so, and if it was truly a successful way of doing things you would see restaurants everywhere that don't take tips.

How can that be? Is there a special W2 form, for waiters to submit to the IRS, geared specifically for the restaurant industry that has the restaurant populate on the form what the gross sales were (or is it net?) for the entire year at that particular restaurant or chain of restaurants?

I'd like to know from accountants and/or waiters themselves here on this thread. I'd also like to see that tax form too. Link?

Possible, but unlikely. HK isn't much of a tipping society.