SEARCH :o

one more try...
 

Um...ok. From my perspective, "anyone" who would like to win converts to
his/her side would give a more calm/content-ful answer than a string of red
frownie faces. Clearly it is not your preferred "norm" to have diapers changed
in your presence. I hope that I am not on a plane with you anytime soon.
I'm sure the feeling is mutual. BTW I do not have a diaper-aged child at
the moment. But I hope that any parents who do, are sitting next to me
and not next to you.

I am beginning also to see that flyertalk may have a "norm" of a slight
anti-child bias. I encourage the OP to have a look at babycenter.com or
yahoogroups (under 'travelling with children') so that s/he can get a more
nuanced discussion instead of the spiteful comments that I'm getting here.

At any rate, I don't think that an airplane is very much like a restaurant or
church etc. The main difference is that a plane is a small, sub-optimal
environment for everyone. Compromises must always be made. Not every
compromise will be made in favor of the childless business community.

On one of the other threads, someone hoped for non-family flights to be
available so that s/he could travel with adults only. I would prefer this
as well, so that it would segregate people with those views away from
parents and their small children.

One more practical idea for the OP - if you dress your baby in a diaper that
is one size up from the usual, you can go longer between pee-only changes.
That's probably most convenient for parents and on-lookers alike.

I do have a practical question - how is there a "bacterial" risk from a diaper
changed on a mat on a mom's lap? Where is the bacteria coming from or
going to? Let's assume that the diaper is wrapped up and put in an "air
sickness bag" and thrown away in the trash, and that the mom uses an
anti-bacterial wipe on her hands after the change, and puts the changing
mat back into her diaper bag.

Frankly, I'm a lot more worried about people who wear short skirts/shorts
on the seat before I get there (see "The Secret Life of Germs" for more
on that one...apparently there are measurable levels of adult-bottom
bacteria on seats due to that). I'm also a lot more worried about
adults who don't wash their hands properly etc. etc. If I had to make
the epidemiological choice of whose germs to be near, I'd choose the
baby every time.

--LG

Ever diapered a male infant? Urine can go everywhere when you least expect it. I'm not claiming that it is full of raging bacteria, but it will smell bad, and it just grosses people out to see urine sprayed all over. There is also always an element of the unexpected in diaper changing - just because it was urine only diaper when you started doesn't mean that won't change before you're done. And it is next to impossible for a parent to change a diaper without touching non-diaper things in the area if you're working in a closed space - like at a seat.

I am a parent who has traveled extensively by air with my child since he was 4 months old, so I definitely don't fit the anti-child profile. But I do think changing a diaper at the seat is disgusting. Toilet functions do not belong in the same place people will be eating, or even just sitting confined for a long period of time.

My older daughter has legs too skinny, larger diapers would probably leak. As for the baby, I sometimes change her during the night when all my other attempts to make her comfy enough to sleep have failed... in that case taking her to a bright plane bathroom would only make her more excited. But the odds are that I won't have to change their diapers in the plane unless there is a stinky poop one, and in that case I would surely take the child to a bright bathroom where I can be sure that I have cleaned them properly. :)

I will check those websites. Thank you. ^

Paragraph 1: Just like your post count shows, you are new to f/t. That may be why you do not understand the "SMILIES". There purpose is to try and carry over a sense of BODY LANGUAGE that cannot be shown over the internet or in writing. It is a way to let YOU know that I am not trying to THROW YOU OFF THE PLANE AT 30,000 FEET! Frownie-Faces are YELLOW not RED!
Paragraph 2: f/t is NOT anti-child by any means. Most of us travel with their children or have in the past. I have three boys and they have been flying since birth. "BEEN THERE - DONE THAT". The difference between people on f/t and the other sites that you mention is that people on f/t tend to respect others and try to find a mutually acceptable way of dealing with situations. On the other sites, all they care about is "How do I do this regardless of its affect on others!"
Paragraph 3: It is exactly like a RESTAURANT, People eat at that seat before you were there and long after your gone. It is NOT sterilized after every flight. We should do all we can to minimize the contamination for the sake of everyone. All too often someone starts changing their babies diaper in the cabin and OTHERS are eating or have just eaten and it nausiates them. So if you think it is OK to lay your baby on the table and start changing the diaper or sit at the table and change the diaper while others are eating, you are out of touch with what is acceptable.You are so correct a "plane is a small, sub-optimal environment for everyone" so guess what any bacteria or germs WILL be transmitted to others through-out the aircraft. You have your head in the sand thinking that the "business community" is childless.

Lavatories have diaper changing stations that fold down over the toilet. Ask the f/a which one or ones on the a/c that you are flying is equipped with one and use it. Diaper changing in the cabin is DISGUSTING! :mad:

Moderator, please close this useless, redundant, thread? @:-)

Please tell me what your suggestion is when airplanes do not have fold down tables????? That is the issue - I'd always prefer to use them, however when they are not available, the FLIGHT ATTENDANT directed me to use the floor. Which I did as I was prepared with a blanke (mine), changing pad and ziploc.

Just please realise that parents are trying to find the best solution possible for all parties concerned. It may seem great to balance an 18 month old on a toilet seat, but I don't have the dexterity to do so. Not to mention the terror the kids faces by trying to balance on said small space. So I change him on the floor, in front of said door, which yes, is next to the galley. And by my calculation, I'm only about 12 more inches closer to the galley than the lav so the germ issue is moot.

No it is NOT the issue, Read again, that was not the OP's issue. Go SEARCH that is ANOTHER thread.

Ok. Where is it?

Slight anti-child bias? Lol. We have people who want to ban all children from flying.

Most people that say those kind of things are just kidding I am sure.

If you feel this is a useless and redundant thread why don't you just not read this? No one is forcing you to read what you feel is useless and redundant! :rolleyes:

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Me, I support LG10 ^ .
drbond you have made your opinion clear - time to move on I think.

Love your redneck tag by the way - very appropriate ;)

Sometimes all that needs to be said to an OP's question is within the first few lines. You get two differing opinions stated. Leaving the thread open to further comments, just allows a flaming to continue. After it gets way out of hand people start to complain and then the moderators come in and started pm'ing people. It would be best just to close the thread while it is still fairly civil and avoid the problem all together.

Well that is good, everyone needs one or two to support them so they are not TOTALLY alone!

thanks!
 

Thanks! :)

Anyway, I was giving this issue a bit more thought, and I think it is a lot
like any of the "why do xyz passengers do abc that really annoys me??"
posts.

There are threads between people who hate recliners and people who
always recline; there are threads between people who bring their own food
on-board and people who hate the smell of other people's food; there are
people who think rolling suitcases are an imposition on the carry-on space
or boarding time and people who feel that they need those suitcases
for a variety of reasons. I'm sure there are other examples too.

And for every such topic, there are vehement opinions on both sides
expressing everything from Constitutional rights to poor health/hygiene to
physical limitation concerns.

My point is that this "children should be seen and not heard and by gum,
don't even think of changing a diaper in my presence" attitude is just one
side of a "who will compromise on this one?" issue.

Like all such issues, it will likely be decided (it already is) to the more
Libertarian side...i.e. people will do what they like (recline, bring
strong-smelling food, bring desired luggage, change children as they
please), with a dose of airline-economic-reality or regulations.

I do appreciate the etiquette-nature of this (and other) questions, so it's
not like I think it's great to bug everyone around you etc. etc.

Arguably, to take up one of very few airplane bathrooms with a time-consuming
process that could be done elsewhere -- could be considered ruder than
minding one's own business and changing one's baby at the seat. In fact,
I would consider this to be true, and I would think that it was an unnecessary
wait for me if I wanted to use the bathroom at that time.

The best way to manage children on a plane, I think (and I thought well
before having children) -- is to have them be relatively unobtrusive to
everyone else. In diaper situations, this means changing them quietly in your
own space.

Oh, and no one has discussed the safety concerns, but balancing upright
in the lavatory while your wriggly kid is on a raised platform seems pretty
risky to me. What about unexpected turbulence? If you change your baby
at your seat, you don't have to un-belt.

I'm still not buying the "germ" objection because as a parent, I can
assure anyone that the seats/tables/floors are disgusting enough that
no-one would put their baby's plain tush on them! And, regarding boys
and their possible urine, any parent of boys (and I am one) quickly learns
to hold the diaper to catch any such wayward streams.

Of course, vehement posters will always try to shut down debate by saying
that their side is the only one, or the only acceptable one. (It was a new
low that drbond asked the moderator to close the thread because it bored
him personally.)

I did go back and read the originally-suggested thread about diapers. I
found it to be pretty offensive, and by the way, it was actually a thread
about "why people don't want kids to travel on airplanes" which is a pretty
snarky topic to begin with (though the OP seemed to be asking innocently
enough).

I guess there are about a dozen hard-core FT'ers who make themselves
heard about not wanting children or evidence of children to exist
in their presence. I really hope that there are lurkers or seldom-posters who
don't feel intimidated by this kind of attitude, either on flyertalk or on
airplanes.

While it is true that I'm relatively new to flyertalk per se, I'm no newbie to
the internet or to moderated discussion groups. I'm pretty surprised that it
seems to be accepted netiquette here to be so unfriendly/ad-hominem
instead of addressing content.

--LG