FlyerTalk Forums - What is a 'Do?' When does a 'Do' become a commercial venture?

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- - What is a 'Do?' When does a 'Do' become a commercial venture? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/talkboard-topics/1195158-what-do-when-does-do-become-commercial-venture.html)

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonutz (Post 16071661)

I'm at the point where I'm almost ready to make a specific recommendation to the TalkBoard to make to make to IB. But before I do that, I may want to try to sell my Many Points seminar to IB. ;):D:p:eek:

Good luck with that. Just in case you missed it, the TalkBoard has already discussed this last year and our Community Director has already spoken: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/talkb...ft-events.html :rolleyes:

And if they read this entire thread and everyone's attempt to get you to understand something extremely simple, I'm quite sure the conclusion will be the same.

koko,
Instead of IMPROVING the communication of the "DO Seminars" these moderators only want to defend what has been done in the past and not help more people who don't attend in select cities.

The moderators should ask the panel of experts for the summaries of their presentations and post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tommy777 (Post 16071769)

And if they read this entire thread and everyone's attempt to get you to understand something extremely simple, I'm quite sure the conclusion will be the same.

I have indeed read the whole thread and have been following it for the last four days with interest, but we're now getting to the point where things are just being rehashed. I haven't seen any new information posted lately.

New Information:
Start with a commitment to get a posting of the Do Seminar in NY in April 2011.

That would be a start to improving the communication.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jackal (Post 16071815)

Quote:

Originally Posted by euromannn (Post 16071103)

Did anyone post a detailed summary on the seminar details?

Recording was prohibited but IIRC mrpickles mentioned filming them to sell to those who could not attend, with the proceeds going to charity. He and the other Legends were amazing and a special kudo also to mrpalert for his zillions of slides on things that would never occur even to the most committed FT'er.

For future seminars I think many of would pay for a transcript or video reminder. I'd be happy to pay extra for a download link, especially for events I am unable to attend.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonutz (Post 16050932)

I'm suggesting either an alteration to the TOS or the creation of a separate forum for commercial ventures that are not done in the original Do spirit of all pay their own share.

are you seriously claiming that these are commercial ventures?

Or are you just saying that you don't personally approve how the concept of a DO has evolved? (The CD has already given her opinion of the fee issue, and that seems to be the opposite of your point about the "DO spirit" in one of those cases, I would imagine.)

I think it's the latter, and I think using the term "commercial venture" to describe the current state of any of the events you have used as an example is pretty ridiculous.

-David

Quote:

Originally Posted by euromannn (Post 16071058)

Interesting. AA 2MM and got 6M extra miles over 3 years.

If its a question, consider all the cheap US miles from promos.

Back on topic:

Simple solutuon. Update FT glossary.
DO= the old fashioned DO
Seminar DO= a developed DO where it might/or might not be (in that case due to sponsors, so still "commercial") a fee to attend.

Just refine this and we are good to go:D

Quote:

Originally Posted by travelkid (Post 16072350)

+1

Or just plain "Seminar".

And, how about have the sponsors/administrators of these seminars buy ads if they want to promote their Seminar on FlyerTalk?

Quote:

Originally Posted by skofarrell (Post 16072448)

+1

Or just plain "Seminar".

And, how about have the sponsors/administrators of these seminars buy ads if they want to promote their Seminar on FlyerTalk?

The organizers won't buy ads to promote the gatherings because there's no profit in them to do so. Why should members of the community pay a tax to Internet Brands in order to put on events to help other members of the community?

With no profit, the events either won't be held or won't be shared here. The only people that really lose are the members of this community. Great idea! @:-)

And as for sponsors, sounds great, no more sponsors for educational events/gatherings. Sponsors give the money to Internet Brands instead of reducing the out of pocket costs for community members. Another great idea! @:-)

I kind of stumbled across this thread, which has been very entertaining!

Personally, I would feel guilty paying just $49 to attend the Frequent Traveller University. I am a wealthy man from my years in finance and I would actually feel uncomfortable that people were paying their own way and giving up their own time in order to give formal presentations to me. It is the least I would expect that the contributors got their costs covered, to be honest. If you asked the attendees, I'm sure most of them would agree. Charging $59 rather than $49 would generate an extra $5k from 500 people, no-one would be out of pocket and I doubt the majority would have any problems with that.

There is also an underlying current here that commerical is BAD. It's not. If Internet Brands had stepped up to the plate 2 years ago and tried to organise its own seminar day, charging $99 and in turn covering the costs of the speakers and making, say, $20/head profit, I doubt we would have seen many complaints. People would probably have come forward to say that they were pleased that IB was developing the community in this way. We should be grateful that people are willing to do it on a voluntary basis.

Quote:

Originally Posted by skofarrell (Post 16072448)

+1

Or just plain "Seminar".

And, how about have the sponsors/administrators of these seminars buy ads if they want to promote their Seminar on FlyerTalk?

Easy. Pull the word DO out of the title and call it Chicago Seminars 2011.

As I stated early in the thread, it is not in the budget to pay for advertising of the event. If asked to pay for advertising we will ask the thread be closed and you can follow the updates on different forums and blogs.

I'm sitting in a beach Vila on Rangali Island in the Maldives - I made it here solely by gleaning information for gleff, ingy, and other FT threads. Try and convince my wife that gleff and ingy aren't diety!

Gleff and ingy have always taken the time to answer my inane questions - always for free.

They even inspired me to start my own blog to share information about travel tips to my fellow EMBA students.

My point is that everyone has always been so willing to share tips tricks and information - in the same spirit as the DO seminars.

I'm new school FT and am happy to pay a registration fee to the organizers with nary a thought as to what they do with it.

You know what? This is just a lot of noise about nothing.

-David

1. I asked if anyone had a referral link of the key comment details at previous DO? No response

2. I asked if FT focals or other presenters at the DO in the future might write a detailed summary and post on FT? No response.

I can see why this remains an ongoing mixed discussion topic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrpickles (Post 16070756)

I joined Flyertalk in June of 2009 after lurking for a few years. The impedes for my joining was that while returning from an independent Australia milage run I ran into LLM at LAX and noticed a FT luggage tag on her carry-on. Se was coming home from Ozfest. We got to talking about miles and she sort of chastised me for lurking and not contributing to the forum. Within a week I started contributing and feel that I have made an honest effort to contribute on a regular basis, especially in the coins thread.

When I has contacted early in 2010 by Ingy he stated that he wanted to have a Legends of Flyertalk session and offered me a time slot to make a presentation. I was humbled to even be considered to make a presentation, let alone at a "Legends" session.

At the time it was offered it was fully understood by me that I would be paying all of my own expenses. When the DO opened up for registration the speakers were given about 3 days advanced notice so we could book our own hotel at the conference location before it sold out. I booked the hotel with my own credit card fully expecting to pay my own way.

I do not have a vested interest in any of the companies, vendors or sponsors of this event. Until this week I did not even have a website. So there was not a financial incentive to present or promote myself at the event. I presented information because I was grateful for all of the Flyertalk predecessors who have paved the way for me to learn and I wanted to give back to this community. I was simply amazed at the kindness of all of the Flyertalker's present especially the ones who came up to me and said that they could not attend on Sunday and I gave at least 3 mini sessions in the bar on Saturday. The generosity of everyone who bought raffle tickets to raise money for charity, Ingy offering copies of his book to raise money for Wounded Warriors was simply overwhelming. Because of this, and I would have never thought of it on my own, I ended up giving 4 UAL regional upgrades to soldiers that I have run into in the airport.

My flight last year was paid for by using a UAL skykit (no charge) and I earned a bump voucher ($400 + one night at ORD Hilton) on the return. I paid for meals and registration for my +1. Off site meals, bar tab and the Sunday night hotel (Westin) was paid out of pocket.

This year after some back and forth emails with Ingy I agreed to speak again on another topic. I do not consider myself a travel expert, but I do have considerable experience both in business, finance and travel. I can't tell you how many times I have been told that I should write a book. My ability to navigate through the miles and points maze comes naturally for me, but I am always open to learning new tricks. When I agreed to speak this year again I had no expectation to be reimbursed for any of my expenses. The gesture has been made that if the finances work out the organizers are offering to reimburse for airfare (with a limit) and hotel at the meeting. Of course speakers are not subject to the meeting registration fee.

I feel that the gesture was kind, but my participation is not conditional on the offer. If the finances do not work out, there is no way that I would be upset. I can tell you that I put forth my best effort last year to present a polished session and will do so this year again. I am a professional and once I commit to something, my presentation will be the best it can be regardless of the "compensation".

Just a couple of weeks ago I was told by SanDiego1K that she considered that my presence at the Chicago Seminar Do was a draw for many attendees. As the second to last speaker, I could tell that there were many in the audience standing with their luggage and they did not leave until after my presentation. Each and every speaker was a draw for their specialty and that is why there were over 500 seats sold out in such a short period of time. It was a recognition of the value for the seminar. All of the financial aspects were always presented to the attendees in advance to the registration. Both Ingy and Toomanybooks have shown the highest level of professionalism it the organization and execution of the Chicago Seminar Do. The after event survey results were also made public and substantiate this.

The Chicago Seminar Do was not, is not, and I believe in the future will not be in the category of a commercial event.