seattlebruce

I just ran into a problem applying travel credits for a new ticket. I wanted to use 2 credits, one of which expires this month and the other of which expires in 6 months. Obviously I wanted to use all of the first credit and then just the part I needed of the second credit. But Southwest's system applies the largest credit (which in this case was the second one) first.

It doesn't even matter in which order you enter the credits! In my case I first applied the first credit, but then when I applied the second, it applied all of it and, while still listing the first credit, showed none of it being used.

I called Southwest and was told they could not override this behavior. The agent even checked with someone and confirmed that. There is a workaround requiring you to book a dummy ticket: find a fare for just the portion of the second credit that you want to use, book that, then cancel it and voila, you now have a credit for just the amount you need. (You could probably also just change the dummy ticket rather than cancelling it.) That's what I did (even though the agent didn't understand my plan when I explained it, it worked fine), but it was a pain in the butt, and I lost $1 because the dummy fare I found was $1 more than I needed and it wasn't worth the trouble to search further.

In the past I've booked dummy tickets on Southwest when I wanted to use more than 2 travel credits at a time (book a dummy ticket that exactly uses the sum of the first 2 credits, then cancel that and use the new credit as a single credit combined with a 3rd credit, etc.). (Again, I suppose one could just change the dummy ticket repeatedly rather than cancelling it.) But this problem with the order that credits are applied seems easily solved if Southwest would just apply credits in the order that the customer enters them.

nsx

Welcome to my world. I have to do this quite often. Twice last week, for example.

I believe that if we agitated for a fix, Southwest would throw in a customer-unfriendly change like a re-use fee. So it's better to live with the devil we know. Although the TTF devil has gone through several changes, forcing us to re-learn his habits.

Inconvenient and irritating funds re-use beats no re-use at all, and I believe that is the real world choice we have. This is why I fear that a class action suit claiming deception will end funds re-use completely. That possibility is the only good argument for raising the issue with Southwest.

johnslloyd

The algorithm for applying funds gives first preference to cancelled tix that still have their original full value over applying partial funds left over from another cancel & rebooking.

I agree with NSX that the best course of action is to live with the inconvenience rather than risk Southwest possibly doing yet another nasty on it and maybe losing the TTFs.

diablonhn

The system for applying ticketless travel funds has always been awful. The most absurd is the limit of four TTFs per itinerary but only at most two unused TTFs can be used...

ftnoob

seattlebruce, when you click the Apply Travel Funds button on the purchase page, the section below the headingexpands and displays some instructions, including this one (italics mine):What you describe is exactly what should have happened if your larger source of funds was an unused ticket and the smaller was LETF. Can you clarify whether that was the case, or whether the system actually did something different than it is supposed to do?

seattlebruce

Ftnoob, yes, the larger (and later-expiring) funds were from a cancelled ticket, whereas the smaller (and sooner-expiring) funds were leftover travel funds from a ticket that had dropped in price. So the agent who told me they apply the larger amount first was wrong. But it seems equally random to apply based on size or the unused/leftover distinction.

The common-sense approach is to apply funds based on the order that the user enters them and clicks "Apply Travel Funds". But if Southwest has to decide the order, by far the most likely wish of the traveler is to apply the earliest-expiring funds first. The current system is so random that it's either a malicious attempt to screw customers or really stupid software design.

johnslloyd

Who said anything about common sense? The behavior you observed is not random, it is what Southwest says it is, like it or not (I don't like it either). Both I and FTNoob have pointed this out - unused cancelled tickets get applied first, even if they are younger than older partial TTFs.

seattlebruce

By "random" I didn't mean the software behaves randomly, I meant the choice of what to do was random as opposed to based on some rational principle. Unless, of course, it's based on the principle of preventing customers from using their credits. Given Southwest's general attitude and the poor quality of much of their software, I think it's quite possibly just stupidity as opposed to malice.

nsx

My guess is that this way was marginally easier to implement or to administer, and that the person making this decision had no idea that it made a significant difference to customers. In fact, I doubt that anyone at Southwest has a clue how much bother it can be to efficiently roll unused funds into new bookings without letting some of them expire.

When I am booking 20 trips on a sale with my unused funds, I sometimes have to think 3 or 4 steps ahead to avoid ending up with a small TTF that expires soon. If Southwest knew how hard this is, they might believe that they would be doing me a favor by eliminating funds re-use. They might even be right.

ftnoob

I rate numerous SWA "explanations" as nothing more than "plausible BS," but not in this case.

Exchange of an "unused ticket" for a different ticket is an industry-wide concept. Applying travel funds vouchers is also an industry-wide concept. They are however, fundamentally different.

SWA customers tend to be less familiar with the distinction, because for so many years at SWA there was no difference between UT and LETF. To prepare for future interlining and/or better integration of partnerships (e.g., with Volaris), it was necessary for SWA to restructure their TTF reuse system. The most logical way to do so is to view the transaction as first an exchange of tickets, and second a settling up of the fare difference.

In the future when non-SWA tickets are sold at southwest.com, I expect it to be possible to exchange UTs for non-SWA tickets, but I don't expect to be able to apply LETF to purchases (or exchanges) of non-SWA tickets.

There is no guaranteed size or date relationship between UT and LETF. I could have a $50 unused ticket and a $1,000+ LETF, and of course there is no way to predict which is older or newer.

The limit of four total payments, however, without even the ability to use two different credit cards, is partly lazy system design and partly an intentional hurdle to help ensure a healthy volume of funds expiration.

johnslloyd

Please don't even think about eliminating funds re-use! The ability to do this is the single biggest single reason I fly SWA as much as I do. I also have to plan carefully to avoid expiring TTFs, but I have yet to lose a single expired $ and I also do a lot of canceling/changing.

lougord99

So we are now approaching year 2 of this meaningless difference so that at some time in the future the difference matters.