Rapid Rewards 2.0 begins March 1, 2011
Feb 25, 2011, 10:11 am
#1021
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 12
3 credits to get my next award
I have 3 more credits to go before I earn my next award. I will not be traveling on WN before March 1 or expecting to get any more credits. Would it be in my best interest to transfer 4.5k SPG points now, before the new program begins, to earn the 3 credits needed for another award? Does having another standard award locked in before RR 2.0 benefit me?
Feb 25, 2011, 11:14 am
#1022
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
Programs: WN Companion Pass, A-list preferred, Hyatt Globalist; United Club Lietime (sic) Member
Posts: 21,624
I have 3 more credits to go before I earn my next award. I will not be traveling on WN before March 1 or expecting to get any more credits. Would it be in my best interest to transfer 4.5k SPG points now, before the new program begins, to earn the 3 credits needed for another award? Does having another standard award locked in before RR 2.0 benefit me?
Feb 25, 2011, 7:29 pm
#1023
Join Date: Jan 2007
Programs: HHonors Diamond ; Prority Club Platinum; Rapid Rewards A List; OnePass
Posts: 72
I don't think this is correct. The OP stated that the ticket is good through November 2011 (already extended). It won't disappear into oblivion. I also believe that yes, you will be able to extend it again upon expiration if you need to.
What you can't do (if I have this right!), is extend a ticket twice after March 1st. I think you're good with a second extension if the first one was done before March 1st.
What you can't do (if I have this right!), is extend a ticket twice after March 1st. I think you're good with a second extension if the first one was done before March 1st.
Feb 25, 2011, 8:22 pm
#1024
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: So Cal
Programs: UA Gold/0.744MM, WN AL, Hyatt Diamond, MR Scum, Hertz PC, National Exec, Avis PC
Posts: 5,561
Here's an interesting analysis everyone should do with their current awards:
Award 1 – Expired 2/2010
• Renew 2/2011 good until 2/2012 - $50
• Can sit expired until 2/2013
• Renew in 2/2013 good until 2/2014 - $50
Award 2 – Expired 5/2010
• Option 1
Award 3 – Expires 6/2011
• Option 1
Award 1 – Expired 2/2010
• Renew 2/2011 good until 2/2012 - $50
• Can sit expired until 2/2013
• Renew in 2/2013 good until 2/2014 - $50
Award 2 – Expired 5/2010
• Option 1
o Can sit expired until 5/2011
o Renew 5/2011 good until 5/2012 - $50
• Option 2o Renew 5/2011 good until 5/2012 - $50
o Renew 2/2011 good until 2/2012 - $50
o Can sit expired until 2/2013
o Renew in 2/2013 good until 2/2014 - $50
o Can sit expired until 2/2013
o Renew in 2/2013 good until 2/2014 - $50
Award 3 – Expires 6/2011
• Option 1
o Can sit expired until 6/2012
o Renew in 6/2012 good until 6/2013 - $50
• Option 2o Renew in 6/2012 good until 6/2013 - $50
o Renew 2/2011 good until 2/2012 - $50
o Can sit expired until 2/2013
o Renew in 2/2013 good until 2/2014 - $50
So for me, renewing award 2 early seems like a pretty good deal - I can get almost a 21 more months for just one additional $50 fee. Conversely, renewing award 3 early only gets me an extra 8 months with an additional $50 fee which doesn't seem as worthwhile.
o Can sit expired until 2/2013
o Renew in 2/2013 good until 2/2014 - $50
Feb 25, 2011, 10:07 pm
#1025
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: California
Programs: Alaska MVPG, SWA CP, SWA A list, Hyatt Platinum, Hhilton Gold, Makai Club
Posts: 244
getting different answers on extendibility expired awards after 3/1 HELP!!
I called twice today and got several different answers.(EVEN TWO DIFFERENT ANSWERS FROM TWO DIFFERENT SUPERVISORS FROM ONE SINGLE CALL)
I have 2 Standard awards which expired before 3/1/10 and MUST be extended before 3/28/11(before 3/27 actually with the website being down). This action is a no-brainer.
Now here comes the more complicated part:
I have two other awards which expired 4/10 and 10/10 as well as two awards which expiring in 2011 and one expiring 1/12.
The first two inquiries, which were from either a supervisor or taken to the supervisor were that if those which are listed as extendible
the two expired in 09
the two expired in 10
two expiring in 11(within 6 months)
could be expired before 2/28/10 and then either left as standard awards or combined as freedom awards, would carry a new expiration date of 2/26/12 and could be extended anytime until 2.26.13 for another $50 each to last until 2/26/14 if needed
The last supervisor determined that whether under RR 1.0 or RR 2.0 and whether as individual Standard awards or as combined Freedom awards,
these awards can be extended once and only once and thus I should wait to extend my awards until they are one year after expiration.
In this way all awards extend now must be used by 2/26/12 without exception
Those that ezpired in 4/10 and 10/10 that I extend in 4/11 and 10/11 must be used by 4/12 and 10/12 No MATTER what.
This is in total contradistiction to what others told me : extending the awards this weekend, whether keeping them SAs or combining them as FAs would still allow them to be extended once after 3/1/11 so that they would last up to three years from the date I extended them, ie until 2/26/14
WHICH IS IT???
ANYONE from SWA know????
Time is running out and the last call I made resulted in the first supervisor giving one answer and the second supervisor she asked giving another.
Anyone out there have the definitive answer--would love to know before the website goes down!
I have 2 Standard awards which expired before 3/1/10 and MUST be extended before 3/28/11(before 3/27 actually with the website being down). This action is a no-brainer.
Now here comes the more complicated part:
I have two other awards which expired 4/10 and 10/10 as well as two awards which expiring in 2011 and one expiring 1/12.
The first two inquiries, which were from either a supervisor or taken to the supervisor were that if those which are listed as extendible
the two expired in 09
the two expired in 10
two expiring in 11(within 6 months)
could be expired before 2/28/10 and then either left as standard awards or combined as freedom awards, would carry a new expiration date of 2/26/12 and could be extended anytime until 2.26.13 for another $50 each to last until 2/26/14 if needed
The last supervisor determined that whether under RR 1.0 or RR 2.0 and whether as individual Standard awards or as combined Freedom awards,
these awards can be extended once and only once and thus I should wait to extend my awards until they are one year after expiration.
In this way all awards extend now must be used by 2/26/12 without exception
Those that ezpired in 4/10 and 10/10 that I extend in 4/11 and 10/11 must be used by 4/12 and 10/12 No MATTER what.
This is in total contradistiction to what others told me : extending the awards this weekend, whether keeping them SAs or combining them as FAs would still allow them to be extended once after 3/1/11 so that they would last up to three years from the date I extended them, ie until 2/26/14
WHICH IS IT???
ANYONE from SWA know????
Time is running out and the last call I made resulted in the first supervisor giving one answer and the second supervisor she asked giving another.
Anyone out there have the definitive answer--would love to know before the website goes down!
Feb 25, 2011, 10:24 pm
#1026
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: So Cal
Programs: UA Gold/0.744MM, WN AL, Hyatt Diamond, MR Scum, Hertz PC, National Exec, Avis PC
Posts: 5,561
I called twice today and got several different answers.(EVEN TWO DIFFERENT ANSWERS FROM TWO DIFFERENT SUPERVISORS FROM ONE SINGLE CALL)
I have 2 Standard awards which expired before 3/1/10 and MUST be extended before 3/28/11(before 3/27 actually with the website being down). This action is a no-brainer.
Now here comes the more complicated part:
I have 2 Standard awards which expired before 3/1/10 and MUST be extended before 3/28/11(before 3/27 actually with the website being down). This action is a no-brainer.
Now here comes the more complicated part:
For your 2010 expiring awards, it probably makes sense to renew early (i.e. in the next day) as it will allow you to extend to 2014 with a double renewal. The 2011 awards are less clear.
As for the rules, I go by the FAQ:
Can I extend my old Standard or Freedom Award once it expires?
Once an Award has expired, if it was originally issued prior to the new program launch, you will have up to 12 months after the expiration date to request a one-time only Award extension for a $50 fee, payable by credit card only, at southwest.com. Standard Awards that are issued after the launch of the new program will not be eligible for extension.
Feb 25, 2011, 10:49 pm
#1027
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: California
Programs: Alaska MVPG, SWA CP, SWA A list, Hyatt Platinum, Hhilton Gold, Makai Club
Posts: 244
no. of extensions of expired awards if extend before 3/1/11 or after??
The last person I called said that quite a number of people got together including (at least one) supervisor and decided that the ability to extend "awards earned before 3/1/11" did not apply for extended awards, even if they were for the first time a new freedom award.
They said they used to have the leeway to extend twice, but they wouldn't anymore.
Do you have information straight from a knowledgeable SWA RR employee?or are you one?
Thanks!
They said they used to have the leeway to extend twice, but they wouldn't anymore.
Do you have information straight from a knowledgeable SWA RR employee?or are you one?
Thanks!
See my analysis for my awards in the post directly before yours. Same logic applies and you even have some awards that are almost the same dates....
For your 2010 expiring awards, it probably makes sense to renew early (i.e. in the next day) as it will allow you to extend to 2014 with a double renewal. The 2011 awards are less clear.
As for the rules, I go by the FAQ:
Renewing prior to the new program counts as being "issued prior to the new program", thus, if you renew now, you have one more renewal max which can occur 1 year after expiration which itself is 1 year after renewal. Thus, with two renewals starting now, you can get 3 years of life out of your awards from right now.
For your 2010 expiring awards, it probably makes sense to renew early (i.e. in the next day) as it will allow you to extend to 2014 with a double renewal. The 2011 awards are less clear.
As for the rules, I go by the FAQ:
Renewing prior to the new program counts as being "issued prior to the new program", thus, if you renew now, you have one more renewal max which can occur 1 year after expiration which itself is 1 year after renewal. Thus, with two renewals starting now, you can get 3 years of life out of your awards from right now.
Feb 25, 2011, 10:53 pm
#1028
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: home = LAX
Posts: 25,933
No, I did mean DL. DL just announced recently that they will be adding something just like E+ (but not by that name, of course) on their international flights (only). So it's just like E+, except it's not systemwide like E+ is.
(By "just like" E+, I mean seats with more legroom but still in the Coach cabin; not a separate cabin a la BA's Premium Economy cabin. In case you're not aware, whether it's a seprate cabin or not is of great concern to those who upgrade with miles or with System-Wide Upgrades, since the rule of all upgrades is that you only upgrade one cabin up. So if E+ is still in Coach, you can upgrade Coach to Business. If Premium Economy is a seaparate cabin, you can only upgrade from Coach to PE or from PE to Business; you can't upgrade all the way from Coach to Business!)
(By "just like" E+, I mean seats with more legroom but still in the Coach cabin; not a separate cabin a la BA's Premium Economy cabin. In case you're not aware, whether it's a seprate cabin or not is of great concern to those who upgrade with miles or with System-Wide Upgrades, since the rule of all upgrades is that you only upgrade one cabin up. So if E+ is still in Coach, you can upgrade Coach to Business. If Premium Economy is a seaparate cabin, you can only upgrade from Coach to PE or from PE to Business; you can't upgrade all the way from Coach to Business!)
Feb 25, 2011, 11:00 pm
#1029
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: So Cal
Programs: UA Gold/0.744MM, WN AL, Hyatt Diamond, MR Scum, Hertz PC, National Exec, Avis PC
Posts: 5,561
The last person I called said that quite a number of people got together including (at least one) supervisor and decided that the ability to extend "awards earned before 3/1/11" did not apply for extended awards, even if they were for the first time a new freedom award.
They said they used to have the leeway to extend twice, but they wouldn't anymore.
Do you have information straight from a knowledgeable SWA RR employee?or are you one?
Thanks!
They said they used to have the leeway to extend twice, but they wouldn't anymore.
Do you have information straight from a knowledgeable SWA RR employee?or are you one?
Thanks!
There appears to only be one important qualification:
"Originally issued prior to the new program launch" - check! (a long time before)
No matter how you look at it, renewal date or original issue date, it is before the new program launches therefore it is eligible for a one-time renewal within 12 months of its expiration.
Feb 26, 2011, 1:14 am
#1030
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: California
Programs: Alaska MVPG, SWA CP, SWA A list, Hyatt Platinum, Hhilton Gold, Makai Club
Posts: 244
re inability to extend awards reissued prior to 3/1/11(and even after)
ie, extension will now be a one-time only affair.
I called twice more--this time not asking for supervisors--each time they told me if an award was extended once ,whether before or after 3/1/11, it cannot be reextended thereafter. Each time they were VERY SURE of their answer and were "positive" a supervisor would say the same.
I think they are reading as it A STANDARD AWARD (RATHER THAN AN EXTENDED AWARD) is eligible for a one-time renewal within 12 months of its ORIGINAL expiration.[/QUOTE]
I had asked customer relations for a list of all my rewards since 2001. They provided a print out listing SA (standard awards) and E (extensions).
Those I talked with today said even after RR 2.0 begins they will still be able to see in the computer if it is a SA or an E and they will not reextend Es.
I wish they would clarify this officially so people can decide what to do with adequate information.
They said even if I combined two SAs as an FA it would still show the FA was made with two Es and no further extensions would be allowed.
Anyone with inside information to add?
Thanks,
Thumbelina
I called twice more--this time not asking for supervisors--each time they told me if an award was extended once ,whether before or after 3/1/11, it cannot be reextended thereafter. Each time they were VERY SURE of their answer and were "positive" a supervisor would say the same.
I think they are reading as it A STANDARD AWARD (RATHER THAN AN EXTENDED AWARD) is eligible for a one-time renewal within 12 months of its ORIGINAL expiration.[/QUOTE]
I had asked customer relations for a list of all my rewards since 2001. They provided a print out listing SA (standard awards) and E (extensions).
Those I talked with today said even after RR 2.0 begins they will still be able to see in the computer if it is a SA or an E and they will not reextend Es.
I wish they would clarify this officially so people can decide what to do with adequate information.
They said even if I combined two SAs as an FA it would still show the FA was made with two Es and no further extensions would be allowed.
Anyone with inside information to add?
Thanks,
Thumbelina
I am by no means a WN RR employee, but, no matter how many people got together at WN and no matter what they "decided", the FAQ says otherwise.
There appears to only be one important qualification:
"Originally issued prior to the new program launch" - check! (a long time before)
No matter how you look at it, renewal date or original issue date, it is before the new program launches therefore it is eligible for a one-time renewal within 12 months of its expiration.
There appears to only be one important qualification:
"Originally issued prior to the new program launch" - check! (a long time before)
No matter how you look at it, renewal date or original issue date, it is before the new program launches therefore it is eligible for a one-time renewal within 12 months of its expiration.
Feb 26, 2011, 2:11 am
#1031
Moderator, Southwest Airlines and Choice Privileges
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 3,038
The RR 1.x FAQ states:
So, technically speaking, under RR 1.x awards are not extended, they are reissued. It appears that RR 2.0 is replacing award reissuance with award extension.
There is a small ambiguity in the language used in the newRR T&C:
The first bullet point governs awards that are in an expired state on 01-March. The second bullet point governs awards that were issued from 01-March-2010 through 28-Feb-2011. Neither bullet point definitively covers awards that have been reissued prior to 01-March-2011.
We could be 100% certain about this if the second bullet point read:
The consensus on this forum is that award reissuance is indistinguishable from award issuance, because reissued awards receive a new award number, and thus the second bullet point can be assumed to apply to reissued awards. I have no experience with reissued awards, so I can't confirm that theory.
I am going to speculate, however, that the "E" designation you heard about is a feature of RR 2.0 that is being introduced due to the change from award reissuance to award extension. It was never necessary under RR 1.x to designate an award with an "E" because we didn't have award extension, we had award reissuance. Beginning 01-March, extended awards might not receive a new award number, they might keep the original award number and be flagged with an "E" designation so that they can be clearly identified as ineligible for another "extension."
This ambiguity has existed since the announcement of RR 2.0 in early January, and we have had no official clarification.
If I am unable to use my Award within 12 months, is it possible to have my Award reissued?
Yes, an Award may be reissued for a $50 fee.
Yes, an Award may be reissued for a $50 fee.
There is a small ambiguity in the language used in the newRR T&C:
- After the transition, Standard and Freedom Awards that were issued prior to the transition date and that expired within the 12 months preceding the transition date are eligible for a one-time only extension for a $50 fee, payable by credit card only. Members have up to 12 months after the original expiration date to request the extension by visiting www.southwest.com/rapid_rewards...
- Standard and Freedom Awards that were issued prior to the transition date and that expire after the transition date will be eligible for a one-time only extension for a $50 fee, payable by credit card only. Members have up to 12 months after expiration date to request the extension by visiting www.southwest.com/rapid_rewards...
We could be 100% certain about this if the second bullet point read:
Standard and Freedom Awards that were issued or reissued prior to the transition date and that expire after the transition date will be eligible for a one-time only extension for a $50 fee, payable by credit card only. Members have up to 12 months after expiration date to request the extension by visiting www.southwest.com/rapid_rewards...
I am going to speculate, however, that the "E" designation you heard about is a feature of RR 2.0 that is being introduced due to the change from award reissuance to award extension. It was never necessary under RR 1.x to designate an award with an "E" because we didn't have award extension, we had award reissuance. Beginning 01-March, extended awards might not receive a new award number, they might keep the original award number and be flagged with an "E" designation so that they can be clearly identified as ineligible for another "extension."
This ambiguity has existed since the announcement of RR 2.0 in early January, and we have had no official clarification.
Feb 26, 2011, 10:17 am
#1032
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: JFK, DCA, BUR, YVR
Programs: AC, AS, BA, DL, HH (D), MR (T/LTP), UA (*S), UScAAre (PLT/1,87MM), WN
Posts: 5,207
No, I did mean DL. DL just announced recently that they will be adding something just like E+ (but not by that name, of course) on their international flights (only). So it's just like E+, except it's not systemwide like E+ is.
(By "just like" E+, I mean seats with more legroom but still in the Coach cabin; not a separate cabin a la BA's Premium Economy cabin. In case you're not aware, whether it's a seprate cabin or not is of great concern to those who upgrade with miles or with System-Wide Upgrades, since the rule of all upgrades is that you only upgrade one cabin up. So if E+ is still in Coach, you can upgrade Coach to Business. If Premium Economy is a seaparate cabin, you can only upgrade from Coach to PE or from PE to Business; you can't upgrade all the way from Coach to Business!)
(By "just like" E+, I mean seats with more legroom but still in the Coach cabin; not a separate cabin a la BA's Premium Economy cabin. In case you're not aware, whether it's a seprate cabin or not is of great concern to those who upgrade with miles or with System-Wide Upgrades, since the rule of all upgrades is that you only upgrade one cabin up. So if E+ is still in Coach, you can upgrade Coach to Business. If Premium Economy is a seaparate cabin, you can only upgrade from Coach to PE or from PE to Business; you can't upgrade all the way from Coach to Business!)
Feb 26, 2011, 11:14 am
#1033
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: California
Programs: Alaska MVPG, SWA CP, SWA A list, Hyatt Platinum, Hhilton Gold, Makai Club
Posts: 244
ftnoob
The E designation next to my awards is on a printout of all my awards since 2001 that i asked SWA for so I doubt it has anything to do with SWA2.0 as it would hardly be worth their while to reinput data on awards which cannot be resurrected and do not count as liabilities against their bottom line.
It remains unclear to me what the policy is so i really hope some SWA person in the know chimes in today...although I bet they are either off or BUSY!
It remains unclear to me what the policy is so i really hope some SWA person in the know chimes in today...although I bet they are either off or BUSY!
Feb 26, 2011, 12:43 pm
#1034
Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 1,627
The E designation next to my awards is on a printout of all my awards since 2001 that i asked SWA for so I doubt it has anything to do with SWA2.0 as it would hardly be worth their while to reinput data on awards which cannot be resurrected and do not count as liabilities against their bottom line.
It remains unclear to me what the policy is so i really hope some SWA person in the know chimes in today...although I bet they are either off or BUSY!
It remains unclear to me what the policy is so i really hope some SWA person in the know chimes in today...although I bet they are either off or BUSY!
Standard and Freedom Awards that were issued prior to the transition date and that expire after the transition date will be eligible for a one-time only extension for a $50 fee, payable by credit card only. Members have up to 12 months after expiration date to request the extension by visiting www.southwest.com/rapid_rewards...
If you were to reissue a currently expired award on 2/26/11, it meets all the requirements of the statement above to allow for a one-time only extension up to 12 months after the new expiration date:
1. It was clearly issued prior to the transition date.
2. It clearly will expire after the transition date (you will see an Expiration Date value of 02/26/12 when you view your awards list after the reissue action).
Feb 26, 2011, 1:51 pm
#1035
Moderator, Southwest Airlines and Choice Privileges
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 3,038
We can't evaluate anything from your printout without seeing it. If you can copy it, redact it, scan it, and post it somewhere, we could take a look.
I think the odds are very high (over 95%) that awards extended before 01-March will be eligible to be extended again, and that the small ambiguity is just imperfect language.
Keep in mind that the employees are still learning RR 2.0 also. The other day I was told something that sounded odd regarding my award that expired in August '09. I forget what it was, maybe it was the same as you are being told that if I extend it now it won't be allowed to be extended again. Later in the conversation I was told that the same award had to be extended by August '11. There is plenty of confusion among SWA employees about all the new rules.
I think the odds are very high (over 95%) that awards extended before 01-March will be eligible to be extended again, and that the small ambiguity is just imperfect language.
Keep in mind that the employees are still learning RR 2.0 also. The other day I was told something that sounded odd regarding my award that expired in August '09. I forget what it was, maybe it was the same as you are being told that if I extend it now it won't be allowed to be extended again. Later in the conversation I was told that the same award had to be extended by August '11. There is plenty of confusion among SWA employees about all the new rules.