China Southern vs DL, NW, KE TPAC
Sep 15, 2008, 11:52 am
#1
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China Southern vs DL, NW, KE TPAC
Anyone with experience to compare inflight svc/experience on China Southern on TPAC flights, vs other ST members? Could be J or Y.
Sep 15, 2008, 1:55 pm
#3
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Then CZ has direct flight from LAX.
But NW's stop over at NRT won't be too bad. It will be my first choice.
For DL. I think you need to go to PEK or PVG, where you need longer transit time.
KE's transit time is too long at ICN. They also do code share with CZ from ICN to CAN, which should save you more time.
Sep 15, 2008, 2:54 pm
#4
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Where do you wanna fly to? Guangzhou CAN?
Then CZ has direct flight from LAX.
But NW's stop over at NRT won't be too bad. It will be my first choice.
For DL. I think you need to go to PEK or PVG, where you need longer transit time.
KE's transit time is too long at ICN. They also do code share with CZ from ICN to CAN, which should save you more time.
Then CZ has direct flight from LAX.
But NW's stop over at NRT won't be too bad. It will be my first choice.
For DL. I think you need to go to PEK or PVG, where you need longer transit time.
KE's transit time is too long at ICN. They also do code share with CZ from ICN to CAN, which should save you more time.
The other poster's ranking of NW over DL surprises me, as DL has newer a/c and AVOD in Y (NW doesn't on the 747's).
Sep 15, 2008, 4:49 pm
#5
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I am just stating my opinion on this because the information you provided is little to none regarding what's transpacific... I'll explain a little bit more as to why I ranked it that way.
China Southern is obviously last as their only transpacific is CAN-LAX, and the route is a joke because it's impossible to transit after you arrive at LAX and the services CZ provides is the lowest out of them all. The seats may be a little bit better than NWA CAN-NRT's 757. Unless you are traveling from CAN and prefers direct flight to LAX, I don't see the reason to take CZ.
Why is DL ranked lower than NW? It's simply because Delta does not have enough transpacific routes and all the ones they have originates in Atlanta. If I remember correctly, the three routes are ATL-NRT, ATL-ICN, and ATL-PVG. Unless your transpacific means traveling through the pacific and also to Atlanta, I would not pick Delta.
Northwest has a major hub in Tokyo Narita, where it has services for Beijing, Busan, Incheon, Shanghai Pudong, Taipei, Guangzhou (ends 01MAR09), Hong Kong, Bangkok, Singapore, Guam, and Saipan. With that in mind, you have a better connection that you can make and you can go from Narita to Detroit, Honolulu, Seattle, San Francisco, Los Angeles, and Minneapolis. Osaka Kansai and Nagoya also connects to Detroit, Guam, and Saipan, while Osaka Kansai has Honolulu linked. In terms of connecting traffic and timing, Northwest is way better than Delta, despite the fact it doesn't have AVOD.
Korean Air is obviously the best choice out of them all if you don't mind their safety records (about 10 years or so) as the services and cabin are top notched out of the four and has many connections at Seoul Incheon. I won't list the destinations that they offer in Asia as there are way too many, but they offer destinations in North America such as Vancouver, Seattle, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Honolulu, Las Vegas, New York, Atlanta, Chicago, Toronto, and Dallas. Unless you are traveling from places like Saipan, where Korean Air does not serve, I would choose Korean Air over Northwest.
China Southern is obviously last as their only transpacific is CAN-LAX, and the route is a joke because it's impossible to transit after you arrive at LAX and the services CZ provides is the lowest out of them all. The seats may be a little bit better than NWA CAN-NRT's 757. Unless you are traveling from CAN and prefers direct flight to LAX, I don't see the reason to take CZ.
Why is DL ranked lower than NW? It's simply because Delta does not have enough transpacific routes and all the ones they have originates in Atlanta. If I remember correctly, the three routes are ATL-NRT, ATL-ICN, and ATL-PVG. Unless your transpacific means traveling through the pacific and also to Atlanta, I would not pick Delta.
Northwest has a major hub in Tokyo Narita, where it has services for Beijing, Busan, Incheon, Shanghai Pudong, Taipei, Guangzhou (ends 01MAR09), Hong Kong, Bangkok, Singapore, Guam, and Saipan. With that in mind, you have a better connection that you can make and you can go from Narita to Detroit, Honolulu, Seattle, San Francisco, Los Angeles, and Minneapolis. Osaka Kansai and Nagoya also connects to Detroit, Guam, and Saipan, while Osaka Kansai has Honolulu linked. In terms of connecting traffic and timing, Northwest is way better than Delta, despite the fact it doesn't have AVOD.
Korean Air is obviously the best choice out of them all if you don't mind their safety records (about 10 years or so) as the services and cabin are top notched out of the four and has many connections at Seoul Incheon. I won't list the destinations that they offer in Asia as there are way too many, but they offer destinations in North America such as Vancouver, Seattle, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Honolulu, Las Vegas, New York, Atlanta, Chicago, Toronto, and Dallas. Unless you are traveling from places like Saipan, where Korean Air does not serve, I would choose Korean Air over Northwest.
Sep 17, 2008, 8:23 am
#6
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I am just stating my opinion on this because the information you provided is little to none regarding what's transpacific... I'll explain a little bit more as to why I ranked it that way.
China Southern is obviously last as their only transpacific is CAN-LAX, and the route is a joke because it's impossible to transit after you arrive at LAX and the services CZ provides is the lowest out of them all. The seats may be a little bit better than NWA CAN-NRT's 757. Unless you are traveling from CAN and prefers direct flight to LAX, I don't see the reason to take CZ.
Why is DL ranked lower than NW? It's simply because Delta does not have enough transpacific routes and all the ones they have originates in Atlanta. If I remember correctly, the three routes are ATL-NRT, ATL-ICN, and ATL-PVG. Unless your transpacific means traveling through the pacific and also to Atlanta, I would not pick Delta.
Northwest has a major hub in Tokyo Narita, where it has services for Beijing, Busan, Incheon, Shanghai Pudong, Taipei, Guangzhou (ends 01MAR09), Hong Kong, Bangkok, Singapore, Guam, and Saipan. With that in mind, you have a better connection that you can make and you can go from Narita to Detroit, Honolulu, Seattle, San Francisco, Los Angeles, and Minneapolis. Osaka Kansai and Nagoya also connects to Detroit, Guam, and Saipan, while Osaka Kansai has Honolulu linked. In terms of connecting traffic and timing, Northwest is way better than Delta, despite the fact it doesn't have AVOD.
Korean Air is obviously the best choice out of them all if you don't mind their safety records (about 10 years or so) as the services and cabin are top notched out of the four and has many connections at Seoul Incheon. I won't list the destinations that they offer in Asia as there are way too many, but they offer destinations in North America such as Vancouver, Seattle, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Honolulu, Las Vegas, New York, Atlanta, Chicago, Toronto, and Dallas. Unless you are traveling from places like Saipan, where Korean Air does not serve, I would choose Korean Air over Northwest.
China Southern is obviously last as their only transpacific is CAN-LAX, and the route is a joke because it's impossible to transit after you arrive at LAX and the services CZ provides is the lowest out of them all. The seats may be a little bit better than NWA CAN-NRT's 757. Unless you are traveling from CAN and prefers direct flight to LAX, I don't see the reason to take CZ.
Why is DL ranked lower than NW? It's simply because Delta does not have enough transpacific routes and all the ones they have originates in Atlanta. If I remember correctly, the three routes are ATL-NRT, ATL-ICN, and ATL-PVG. Unless your transpacific means traveling through the pacific and also to Atlanta, I would not pick Delta.
Northwest has a major hub in Tokyo Narita, where it has services for Beijing, Busan, Incheon, Shanghai Pudong, Taipei, Guangzhou (ends 01MAR09), Hong Kong, Bangkok, Singapore, Guam, and Saipan. With that in mind, you have a better connection that you can make and you can go from Narita to Detroit, Honolulu, Seattle, San Francisco, Los Angeles, and Minneapolis. Osaka Kansai and Nagoya also connects to Detroit, Guam, and Saipan, while Osaka Kansai has Honolulu linked. In terms of connecting traffic and timing, Northwest is way better than Delta, despite the fact it doesn't have AVOD.
Korean Air is obviously the best choice out of them all if you don't mind their safety records (about 10 years or so) as the services and cabin are top notched out of the four and has many connections at Seoul Incheon. I won't list the destinations that they offer in Asia as there are way too many, but they offer destinations in North America such as Vancouver, Seattle, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Honolulu, Las Vegas, New York, Atlanta, Chicago, Toronto, and Dallas. Unless you are traveling from places like Saipan, where Korean Air does not serve, I would choose Korean Air over Northwest.
Sep 17, 2008, 10:02 am
#7
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China Southern is obviously last as their only transpacific is CAN-LAX, and the route is a joke because it's impossible to transit after you arrive at LAX and the services CZ provides is the lowest out of them all. The seats may be a little bit better than NWA CAN-NRT's 757. Unless you are traveling from CAN and prefers direct flight to LAX, I don't see the reason to take CZ.
However, I would try to avoid them as the only time I *tried* flying them, it was a very sad experience (spent 2 hours at CAN booking office to be told that the only fare they had on the HKG route was full Y...ended up taking the train, of course).
Sep 26, 2008, 7:36 pm
#8
Join Date: Dec 2006
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I posted a thread this spring about CZ's flight in J. Its not bad but not as good as the alternatives. The service is really pretty good but the seats are outdated which for me is a pretty important issue. If you're going to Guangzhou then I'd probably take it becuase you can cut several hours of transit time out, if you're going to other points in China/Asia that the other ST carriers cover with a reasonable schedule then I'd go the other way.
Here's my link for the travel report:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...674&highlight=
I disagree with a few comments above:
1) Its not impossible to connect in LAX if you're traveling on CZ, all US based ST carriers have LAX covered very well. NW, DL, CO, and even AS terminals are all short walks from TBIT or there's an interterminal bus if you prefer to ride.
2) KE's former safety record shouldn't be even considered at this point. A lot of airlines had bad accidents in the 70's and 80's but no one says don't fly Delta or United because they had problems over 20 years ago. Everything has changed since then. The aircraft are all new generation, the Soviet Union doesn't shoot down passenger planes anymore, pilots are much better trained, etc, etc. KE is a top notch airline and is about as good as it gets in Skyteam especially in the planes with the new Business and First class seats.
To better answer the OP's question, I think the best airline really depends on where you're going. If all other things are equal then I'd say:
1) KE: great J seats, great IFE, great service and personal attention
2) NW or DL: good J seats, NW has AVOD but its terrible don't know about DL, decent service and meals.
3) CO or CZ: decent J seats (both are in bad need of updating), good AVOD on CO lame IFE on CZ, Good meals on each, better personal attention on CZ
If you're going to N. Asia or SE Asia then probably NW or KE will work best; CAN or smaller cities in China then CZ or KE probably; PVG, PEK, HKG then probably DL or CO on a non-stop from the US.
Here's my link for the travel report:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...674&highlight=
I disagree with a few comments above:
1) Its not impossible to connect in LAX if you're traveling on CZ, all US based ST carriers have LAX covered very well. NW, DL, CO, and even AS terminals are all short walks from TBIT or there's an interterminal bus if you prefer to ride.
2) KE's former safety record shouldn't be even considered at this point. A lot of airlines had bad accidents in the 70's and 80's but no one says don't fly Delta or United because they had problems over 20 years ago. Everything has changed since then. The aircraft are all new generation, the Soviet Union doesn't shoot down passenger planes anymore, pilots are much better trained, etc, etc. KE is a top notch airline and is about as good as it gets in Skyteam especially in the planes with the new Business and First class seats.
To better answer the OP's question, I think the best airline really depends on where you're going. If all other things are equal then I'd say:
1) KE: great J seats, great IFE, great service and personal attention
2) NW or DL: good J seats, NW has AVOD but its terrible don't know about DL, decent service and meals.
3) CO or CZ: decent J seats (both are in bad need of updating), good AVOD on CO lame IFE on CZ, Good meals on each, better personal attention on CZ
If you're going to N. Asia or SE Asia then probably NW or KE will work best; CAN or smaller cities in China then CZ or KE probably; PVG, PEK, HKG then probably DL or CO on a non-stop from the US.
Last edited by dvs7310; Sep 26, 2008 at 7:43 pm
Sep 27, 2008, 12:15 am
#9
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Sep 27, 2008, 1:52 am
#10
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I disagree with a few comments above:
1) Its not impossible to connect in LAX if you're traveling on CZ, all US based ST carriers have LAX covered very well. NW, DL, CO, and even AS terminals are all short walks from TBIT or there's an interterminal bus if you prefer to ride.
1) Its not impossible to connect in LAX if you're traveling on CZ, all US based ST carriers have LAX covered very well. NW, DL, CO, and even AS terminals are all short walks from TBIT or there's an interterminal bus if you prefer to ride.
2) KE's former safety record shouldn't be even considered at this point. A lot of airlines had bad accidents in the 70's and 80's but no one says don't fly Delta or United because they had problems over 20 years ago. Everything has changed since then. The aircraft are all new generation, the Soviet Union doesn't shoot down passenger planes anymore, pilots are much better trained, etc, etc. KE is a top notch airline and is about as good as it gets in Skyteam especially in the planes with the new Business and First class seats.
Sep 30, 2008, 4:10 am
#12
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: NRT / HND
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I don't know... NW Y, 31-32" pitch depending on plane. KE Y 34" pitch, that's a big difference if you're any taller than 5'6". Most of the KE planes will have AVOD in Y now which beats the heck out of NW's AVOD... I do commend NW for putting AVOD in Y buy they don't spend jack on new programming... I fly NW frequently enough in WBC transpac and I'm sorely disappointed with the AVOD selections. I usually just count on watching something on my laptop.
Sep 30, 2008, 5:20 am
#13
Join Date: Jun 2007
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Posts: 1,950
Correct me if I'm wrong, since I haven't personally flown CZ but aren't their 777's configured 10 across in Y 
On a 15 hour or so flight that would seem like a almost absolute deal breaker against CZ for Y.
On a 15 hour or so flight that would seem like a almost absolute deal breaker against CZ for Y.
Oct 8, 2008, 9:21 am
#14
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: DCA
Programs: DL Plat
Posts: 68
My 2 cents
Flying from the east coast, I will never book another NW flite thru DTW or MSP to NRT again. I have taken that flite 3 times in the last 2 years and I cannot believe NW still hasn't put the AVOD system in. At this point, I would consider that a minimum requirement on such a loooong flite. Especially when almost every other airline offers it. It certainly helps make the time fly. NW service is very standard, but they do have an amazing hub system in NRT.
CO service IAH-NRT or EWR-NRT is great! I have taken that once.
Upcoming flites: KE from IAD-ICN-HKG in Y next week. I've never been disappointed in KE. Outstanding!
CZ on a 777 from KUL-PVG (Shanghai) in two weeks. Never been on CZ so I'll keep you posted. The seat map is 2-5-2 in Y. Flight time is 5 hours.
DL's new 777 service from PVG-ATL in two weeks. I'm looking forward to it!
I will forever avoid the DTW-NRT or MSP-NRT routes until they replace the airplane..
CO service IAH-NRT or EWR-NRT is great! I have taken that once.
Upcoming flites: KE from IAD-ICN-HKG in Y next week. I've never been disappointed in KE. Outstanding!
CZ on a 777 from KUL-PVG (Shanghai) in two weeks. Never been on CZ so I'll keep you posted. The seat map is 2-5-2 in Y. Flight time is 5 hours.
DL's new 777 service from PVG-ATL in two weeks. I'm looking forward to it!
I will forever avoid the DTW-NRT or MSP-NRT routes until they replace the airplane..
Oct 9, 2008, 12:26 pm
#15
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: NRT / HND
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Posts: 5,667
On the long haul routes, yes they are and the pitch is horrible. I made the mistake of doing that once back in 2004. It was a mistake that was never repeated. I don't mind flying them in C but if I have to fly Y for some reason then I'll use KE for transpac.