yeah a flat bed is a huge W , and def cost less on points.

Pre-pandemic I was doing half a dozen Rouge flights annually mostly TPA-YYZ. I resumed flying this route in early 2022 and the seat pitch on the newer Rouge Airbus in Y is ridiculous and I'm not that tall at 5'11" with a 32" inseam. My plan going forward is to burn up my points flying J and then switch to WestJet or an American carrier.

Another option is to pay for one of the extra legroom seats on Rouge.

The standard seat pitch in Y on the Airbus Rouge aircraft is brutal (I will never sit there), but it hasn't changed since pre-Covid. Perhaps the aircraft flying that route has? You will get more room on any other airline flying transborder.

It might be one specific plane but I do not recall the seats being quite that cramped previously. I recall being on 767s on that route that were tolerable in a standard Y seat.

I agree. Flew from Punta Cana to Halifax in February on a Rouge 319. It was literally quite painful. I do not recall that being the case pre-Covid shutdown. I'm 6'2, but don't think I grew taller during the lockdown.

I avoid Rouge as much as possible. When they flew to LIS with the 767, I flew mainland to anywhere MAD, FRA, MUC etc and back tracked on another Star alliance carrier

As I now fly out of a secondary market YLW, I am now a second class citizen and Rouge is flying to both YUL & YYZ from here. I booked a couple of red eyes and perhaps if i just pass out I wont feel the pain?

The rouge fleet of 767 had a good selection of comfortable Y seats for my 6’-1” frame. Their PY product up front was pretty lousy, but Y wasn’t so bad.

The Airbus fleet is totally different. I literally fit in 2 Y seats on the 319: 19A and 19F. The various configs of the 321 have more preferred seats, so there are a few more options, but I’ll find another flight if I can’t get a preferred (non-bulkhead) seat on a rouge plane. Just brutal.

We did a YYZ-YYJ flight last June, an A320 or 321. I’m 5’11”, and I found it “acceptable”. By that, I mean my knees didn’t leave dents in the seat pocket. Previous to that, another Rouge flight to MIA in 2017 was a nightmare. I don’t think a piece of paper could have slid in there. Worst flight ever.

I suspect our Victoria flight had the refurb cabin. Apparently they removed a row, or two.

I flew YYZ-LAS-YYZ on rouge earlier this week. It won't depend on the boeing, as it's now an all airbus fleet. Bottom line: rouge J is v. similar to mainline PE, but minus the IFE and service is a bit less consistent. Rouge Y is essentially inhumane - if you can't get an exit row, book another flight. highly unlikely to get overhead bin space if boarding in zone 4, forget it altogether in zone 5. In any case, eat in the terminal before you board.

Oh yes, one more thing - expect to arrive an hour late.

Return trip will be similar, with the addition of zealous gate agent in LAS who will want to put every single carry-on through the sizer, even if it's obviously small enough to fit easily.

Enjoy your flight.

This is not entirely correct. The current, 12J A321 is featuring 30" of seat pitch in Y. The older, 16J config has the same seat pitch in Y as the 319s and 320s: 29". That one is absolutely atrocious and the current version is actually better.
The best are, obviously, the ex BR aircraft with 31" seat pitch in Y. However, those only have 8 J seats, so no good for those seeking upgrades or buying J tickets.

My recent (8 June 2023) flight from Toronto to Phoenix in Premium Rouge had only one redeeming feature. It was the only direct flight to PHX. Normally I would try a connection to avoid Rouge, but the only other flights available were via YVR and SFO with difficult connection issues.
It started out with AC sending a text message directing me to the wrong gate. On board I had the usual AC breakfast of a Parsley omelette and things went downhill from there. Rouge no longer has the tablets they used to hand out for the IFE, so nothing to view or listen to during the the 4 hour 40 minute flight. The only FA in attendance was unable or unwilling to prevent Y class passengers coming forward to use the J class lavatory. In addition Y class friends of some J class passengers frequently came forward to visit these friends and even to sit in empty J seats. I brought these issues to the attention of the FA, only to have her apologize, and saying there was little she could do as it would appear that AC doesn't care to enforce the class rules in Rouge. I did complete one of AC's surveys asking me how I "enjoyed" my Rouge flight. I gave most of my experience a 0 rating. Perhaps next time I travel to Phoenix, I'll put up with the inconvenience of connections rather then fly Rouge again.

But Rouge provides free Wi-Fi for J pax � I would choose that over any IFEs which I almost never use other than for flight map.

My complaint about Rouge J is its seats. The lower back region is pretty firm and my back still aches from a Rouge flight I took last weekend �

Did you have personal device of any kind with you (smartphone or tablet)? There would have been free WiFi for Premium Rouge as well as streaming content available.

Washroom visits happen unfortunately.

Social visits? That would be an unusually poor crew to tolerate that.

I would still choose Premium Rouge over an connection. But I would choose a connection before Economy Rouge.

Not enforcing rules isn�t just a Rouge issue, it�s more or less a society issue in North America.

I try my best to avoid Rouge, but I know that there is no guarantee as a flight can get rouged or de-rouged at anytime.

I guess given the options between flying rouge direct and a clumsy connection, I would still prefer the former.