Using Someone Else's Ticket
Sep 28, 2012 | 7:56 pm
#61
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 1,006
No one answered the question of "Why."
Why does it matter if someone's name matches their boarding pass?
Someone with malicious intent could easily make a fake name and fake ID. They'd still need to go through security which presumably would remove anything dangerous from them.
So why do we need a name in the first place? Sure, the airline might want the name for record-keeping purposes, but from a safety and privacy perspective, there's no real reason we need people's names.
Why does it matter if someone's name matches their boarding pass?
Someone with malicious intent could easily make a fake name and fake ID. They'd still need to go through security which presumably would remove anything dangerous from them.
So why do we need a name in the first place? Sure, the airline might want the name for record-keeping purposes, but from a safety and privacy perspective, there's no real reason we need people's names.
Long answer: It doesn't matter.
The real answer: The TSA can point to a tiny accomplishment (finding a few fake ID's) for the billions of dollars wasted on this national embarrassment of an organization.
Oct 1, 2012 | 10:41 am
#62
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Houston
Posts: 8,957
With which another poster replies:
But you missed 49 C.F.R. 1540.107 Sub-part B (c) which states:
An individual may not enter a sterile area or board an aircraft if the individual does not present a verifying identity document as defined in 1560.3 of this chapter, when requested for purposes of watch list matching under 1560.105(c), unless otherwise authorized by TSA on a case-by-case basis.
Which is current as of 9/26/2012. http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text...2.10.4&idno=49
Originally Posted by ND Sol
How does that in the least govern the presentation of id at the checkpoint? (BTW, your reference to 2002 is way out of date. That section was revised in 2008.)
49 C.F.R. 1540.107(a) requires that no individual may enter a sterile area or board an aircraft without submitting to the screening and inspection of his or her person and accessible property. So what does that entail? 49 C.F.R. 1540.5 defines "screening function" as "the inspection of individuals and property for weapons, explosives, and incendiaries." No TDC ID requirements here. Care to try again?
49 C.F.R. 1540.107(a) requires that no individual may enter a sterile area or board an aircraft without submitting to the screening and inspection of his or her person and accessible property. So what does that entail? 49 C.F.R. 1540.5 defines "screening function" as "the inspection of individuals and property for weapons, explosives, and incendiaries." No TDC ID requirements here. Care to try again?
An individual may not enter a sterile area or board an aircraft if the individual does not present a verifying identity document as defined in 1560.3 of this chapter, when requested for purposes of watch list matching under 1560.105(c), unless otherwise authorized by TSA on a case-by-case basis.
Which is current as of 9/26/2012. http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text...2.10.4&idno=49
Be that as it may, did you decide not to look at 1560.105(c) or did you do so and not like what you saw since it doesn't support your view? Let's look at those C.F.R.'s:
1540.107(c) An individual may not enter a sterile area or board an aircraft if the individual does not present a verifying identity document as defined in 1560.3 of this chapter, when requested for purposes of watch list matching under 1560.105(c), unless otherwise authorized by TSA on a case-by-case basis.
Request for identification (1) In general . If TSA has not informed the covered aircraft operator of the results of watch list matching for an individual by the time the individual attempts to check in, or informs the covered aircraft operator that an individual has been placed in inhibited status, the aircraft operator must request from the individual a verifying identity document pursuant to procedures in its security program., as provided in 49 CFR part 1544, subpart B or 49 CFR part 1546, subpart B. The individual must present a verifying identity document to the covered aircraft operator at the airport.
(d) Failure to obtain identification . If a passenger or non-traveling individual does not present a verifying identity document when requested by the covered aircraft operator, in order to comply with paragraph (c) of this section, the covered aircraft operator must not issue a boarding pass or give authorization to enter a sterile area to that individual and must not allow that individual to board an aircraft or enter a sterile area, unless otherwise authorized by TSA.
So once again, how does that in the least govern the presentation of id at the checkpoint?
"Good enough?" No. It does not appear that you "can read it and understand what [you] read."
Oct 2, 2012 | 8:10 am
#63
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,526
That is pretty funny. You use an old version of a regulation that was revised in 2008 and then when I point that out to you, you claim I "missed" a section, which you didn't even know existed since it didn't in the old regulation you first quoted. That is the thanks I get for helping you in your research?
Be that as it may, did you decide not to look at 1560.105(c) or did you do so and not like what you saw since it doesn't support your view? Let's look at those C.F.R.'s:
So what does 1560.105(c) say:
So it is the airline that has to ask for the ID, and only under specified circumstances. What happens if the airline fails to obtain that identification:
I think that there is a reason why the TSA is not involved in this process directly with the passenger.
So once again, how does that in the least govern the presentation of id at the checkpoint?
"Good enough?" No. It does not appear that you "can read it and understand what [you] read."
Be that as it may, did you decide not to look at 1560.105(c) or did you do so and not like what you saw since it doesn't support your view? Let's look at those C.F.R.'s:
So what does 1560.105(c) say:
So it is the airline that has to ask for the ID, and only under specified circumstances. What happens if the airline fails to obtain that identification:
I think that there is a reason why the TSA is not involved in this process directly with the passenger.
So once again, how does that in the least govern the presentation of id at the checkpoint?
"Good enough?" No. It does not appear that you "can read it and understand what [you] read."
Oct 5, 2012 | 6:35 pm
#64
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,195
That is pretty funny. You use an old version of a regulation that was revised in 2008 and then when I point that out to you, you claim I "missed" a section, which you didn't even know existed since it didn't in the old regulation you first quoted. That is the thanks I get for helping you in your research?
Be that as it may, did you decide not to look at 1560.105(c) or did you do so and not like what you saw since it doesn't support your view? Let's look at those C.F.R.'s:
So what does 1560.105(c) say:
So it is the airline that has to ask for the ID, and only under specified circumstances. What happens if the airline fails to obtain that identification:
I think that there is a reason why the TSA is not involved in this process directly with the passenger.
So once again, how does that in the least govern the presentation of id at the checkpoint?
"Good enough?" No. It does not appear that you "can read it and understand what [you] read."
Be that as it may, did you decide not to look at 1560.105(c) or did you do so and not like what you saw since it doesn't support your view? Let's look at those C.F.R.'s:
So what does 1560.105(c) say:
So it is the airline that has to ask for the ID, and only under specified circumstances. What happens if the airline fails to obtain that identification:
I think that there is a reason why the TSA is not involved in this process directly with the passenger.
So once again, how does that in the least govern the presentation of id at the checkpoint?
"Good enough?" No. It does not appear that you "can read it and understand what [you] read."
Oct 6, 2012 | 9:27 am
#65
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Houston
Posts: 8,957